Help removing the hub

[Redav72 227]

I’m in the process of installing new seals and have two quandaries.

 

1)  I can’t seem to remove the small facing plate on the hub even with a breaker bar and heat.  Pics below, looking for strategies that won’t result in broken tools or tractor.

 

2). Both sides of the axle seem to have a slim copper washer between hub and side of the transmission.  On both sides the copper ring was deformed and pushed aside and was no longer performing any purpose that I can see.  Was this originally part of the seal?

 

 

[lynnmor 7,307]

Looks to me like some amateur brazed the hub to the axle?   There should be no copper washer, some later models had a large plastic washer.  You have a mess on your hands to fix it right.  I don’t know what I am looking at, maybe some more photos would help.

Edited September 4, 2022 by lynnmor

[Redav72 227]

Oddly the other side came off with little fanfair.  Here’s a pic of the other side with similar braze points.  So I don’t think it’s welded to to the axle but it’s certainly stuck on pretty good.

 

 

Edited September 4, 2022 by Redav72

[ineedanother 1,369]

57 minutes ago, Redav72 said:

Oddly the other side came off with little fanfair.  Here’s a pic of the other side with similar braze points.  So I don’t think it’s welded to to the axle but it’s certainly stuck on pretty good.

Well that's an interesting mod. Did the hub come off once you removed it?

[Redav72 227]

Ok, if this plate is a previous owner mod (which now that I’m looking closely seems likely).  It seems that I’ve got two options.

 

1) don’t replace the seals, keep an eye on the oil level.  It is leaking but it doesn’t seem to rapid yet.

 

 

2). Crank on it until my harbor freight hex tool fails from the strain.  Maybe I’ll get enough torque on it to break it free.

 

thoughts?  Other options?

[Ed Kennell 38,205]

Use a pipe wrench on the outside of the disc plate.

 

Do not use the transmission to hold the hub from turning.  Lock the hub with another pipe wrench.

Edited September 4, 2022 by Ed Kennell

[oldlineman 1,481]

wonder what the purpose of that item was is? I see to hold the hub in place, that was a lot of work when another set screw would do the trick!

Edited September 4, 2022 by oldlineman

[ineedanother 1,369]

I would probably work to get a notch in the edge, maybe with a chisel, and then use a blunt punch to try to break it loose.

[Handy Don 12,233]

Extreme overkill since the only real value is to keep the hub from falling off. Although they may have thought it'd help on rotation as well, and that leads me to....

 

A fleeting thought is that someone slick enough to drill and tap the (almost) center of an axle is also slick enough think about left-hand threads so that if the axle rotated within the hub the threaded stub would help hold it. Hopefully they didn't have THAT good of tooling or interest! Importantly, though, the one you got off the right side is right-handed, for sure, and if s/he were going to left-hand one it would've been on the right side so, ok, I talked myself out of left-hand concern! 

 

I like the pipe wrench idea, if you have one large enough, and definitely agree about securing hub/axle externally and not relying on the transmission internals. 

Alternately, a notch and a small sledge or even a jackhammer.

 

Best of luck!

Edited September 4, 2022 by Handy Don

[ineedanother 1,369]

10 minutes ago, Handy Don said:

Importantly, though, the one you got off the right side is right-handed, for sure, and if s/he were going to left-hand one it would've been on the right side so, ok, I talked myself out of left-hand concern! 

 

I went down that thought early on myself...r/o.

[Ed Kennell 38,205]

I wonder if the bolt is fastened to the axle with loctite ?

[ineedanother 1,369]

I really do think that it's large enough in diameter that tapping it from the edge counter-clockwise will do it.

[Redav72 227]

Alright!  Cold chisel and the hammer did it.  Now to figure out a hub remover.

[Jeff-C175 7,202]

4 hours ago, Redav72 said:

hub remover

 

Were there also four flat head screws in the plate?

 

Is the set screw in the hub also still used?  If so, do your hubs have one, or two, set screws?

 

IMHO, that's a pretty clever modification, but not necessary.

 

If your hubs have only one set screw, drill and tap 90 degrees around for a second one.  Use NEW setscrews (McMaster-Carr) and torque them to 35 ft lbs (you won't get them tight enough with a combination wrench.  Others may offer options, but an 8 point socket is what I use.) and they'll never come loose again.

 

Https://mcmaster.com/set-screws/cup-point-set-screws/alloy-steel-square-head-cup-point-set-screws/thread-size~3-8-16/

 

As for getting them off, do NOT use a 3 jaw puller on the outside of the hub. You'll break the hub.

 

Since the PO put those extra holes, you could probably use a harmonic balancer puller on those with no fear of breaking the hub.

 

https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/performance-tool-harmonic-balancer-puller-w151p/11244518-p

 

 

Edited September 5, 2022 by Jeff-C175

[Heatingman 971]

Wonder if that was a fix for a failed woodruff key/keyway.

 

 

[ri702bill 8,327]

6 hours ago, Heatingman said:

Wonder if that was a fix for a failed woodruff key/keyway.

 

 

Or if the hub tended to "walk" either in or out on the axle??

The solution used here is taking the long way home , for sure. Lots of time spent machining up those 2 axle caps, and tapping the hubs and axles. probably easier to add a second setscrew to each hub??

The axle cap idea would address the walking hub issue, but would be of little help to "fix" a key, keyseat, or keyway issue in an attempt to overcome a torque problem.

[Ed Kennell 38,205]

7 hours ago, Heatingman said:

Wonder if that was a fix for a failed woodruff key/keyway.

 

                                ,  

           

           Hopefully after the hubs are removed and we can see the condition of the key and keyways, we may understand the intention of this unique modification.

I still wonder if there was any indication that the bolt was loctited to the axle .   Some of these bonding products work well and could along with the face friction created on the end of the axle, would certainly add strength to hub/axle torque connection.      

[ri702bill 8,327]

2 hours ago, Ed Kennell said:

add strength to hub/axle torque connection.

The key word, no pun intended, is add - it will help to a degree, but it is not a proper long term fix all by itself - how about plowing 6 inches of heavy slush, using ice chains ???