Hot Rod 2 seater Rat ?

[giddyap 1,569]

On 4/3/2022 at 8:28 PM, wallfish said:

Front suspension and possibly rear suspension too if my idea works.

 

I can imagine the front looking like the snowmobile suspension that Pullstart used on his fabulous build. But a rear suspension? It would take the "mind meld" ability of Spock to even imagine your plan. L@@king forward to see how that concept develops.  

[wallfish 16,995]

So this seems to be moving along at the snail speed of Colossus (Sorry Eric, couldn't help it! LoL) And the only thing I'm a master of is baiting. It's a lot slower going than things were 10 years ago. Had some time to fiddle around on this Friday afternoon, some yesterday and some today. Mocked up a little bit on the front end suspension by making brackets and such to see how it would look then realized something will need to be done about the steering geometry to avoid bump steering or at least minimize it. If the tie rod ends aren't positioned correctly it will bump steer on it's own as each axle moves up and down. Pretty sure it's figured out how to proceed with that and made some parts but it definitely consumed some time instead of getting more parts stuck on there.

I realize the purists might jump on this for cutting those axles but I probably have 5 or 6 and picked the worst two to use. There's always a bunch down at the big show if you need one. I was going to use other type axles but needed these to be short as possible so the front isn't wider than the back.

Those coil overs are kind of tall for this build as shorter ones would probably look better to scale but these were already in stock from a long ago purchase. . 

 

[ebinmaine 67,460]

8 hours ago, wallfish said:

So this seems to be moving along at the snail speed of Colossus (Sorry Eric, couldn't help it! LoL) 

 

. It's a lot slower going

 

No worries brother man. 

You ain't wrong. 

"Snail🐌 speed" might even be a little ambitious for a comparison on mine...

😀

 

Like the suspension set-up. 

I take it you adjust the tension on the shocks for ride height and/or weight carrying capacity?

 

[953 nut 55,210]

[wallfish 16,995]

2 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

I take it you adjust the tension on the shocks for ride height and/or weight carrying capacity?

Yes, There's a tension adjustment on the coils themselves.

If air bags weren't so expensive that would make a cool ride.

[19richie66 17,500]

12 hours ago, wallfish said:

Yes, There's a tension adjustment on the coils themselves.

If air bags weren't so expensive that would make a cool ride.

Airbags for semi sleeper cabs would probably work. Check a heavy truck salvage yard maybe? 

[prondzy 3,881]

On 4/17/2022 at 7:09 PM, wallfish said:

So this seems to be moving along at the snail speed of Colossus (Sorry Eric, couldn't help it! LoL)  

 

 oh come on Wallfish, your only 327 some odd pages shy of Colossius, this thing is moving like a rocket! Great work cant wait to see what that mind of yours come up with this time

[Snoopy11 5,714]

On 4/3/2022 at 8:28 PM, wallfish said:

Probably gonna make this a fast one

When you say... fast... how... fast...?

 

May have to come down to a show just to... compare notes...

 

Don

[wallfish 16,995]

Made up some shock mount brackets and attached them to the axles and re-did the Ackerman angles for the steering arms. Those angles had to change because the steering will now connect in the front instead of behind the spindles. Did a bunch of work on it but it basically still looks like the pic above without the clamps so no real updates. Waiting for some parts to arrive like heim joints

Hoping to get that front end done by pecking away at it this week and then move on to the drive system. Considering turning the engine 90 deg but that means a tunnel down the middle with a driveshaft to the rear and a gear box or 2. The look of the engine turned 90 looks better to me but it makes for a more complex drive line set up with more points of failure too.

 

[Ed Kennell 38,162]

8 minutes ago, wallfish said:

steering will now connect in the front instead of behind the spindles

Had to do the same on my low rider.

 

 

    

 

 

[ebinmaine 67,460]

2 hours ago, wallfish said:

The look of the engine turned 90 looks better to me but it makes for a more complex drive line set up with more points of failure too

Agreed but that's the reason I stayed to Wheelhorse standard with Colossus and used a belt drive.  

[953 nut 55,210]

I'v been kicking around the idea of a 953 side by side with two front axle halves for independant front suspension. Rather than coil overs I was thinking of using a pair of knee action shocks I have from from a '39 Pontiac. Looking forward to watching your progress.

[wallfish 16,995]

15 minutes ago, 953 nut said:

I'v been kicking around the idea of a 953 side by side with two front axle halves for independant front suspension. Rather than coil overs I was thinking of using a pair of knee action shocks I have from from a '39 Pontiac. Looking forward to watching your progress.

I see the steering is moved to the side as well. Hmmm, 2 seater?

Don't believe I've ever seen those type of knee shocks

[953 nut 55,210]

11 hours ago, wallfish said:

Don't believe I've ever seen those type of knee shocks

They are somewhat the same as a door closer that has an adjustable rate.   They were common on early automobiles.

 

I will peobably need to run some sort of rod between the two half axles on the lower end of the bend to keep it from sagging. Also a pitman/idler arm steering set up to compensat for the added width 

[wallfish 16,995]

So it's slow going but pecking away. Had some time to play again. The steering set up seems good as far eliminating any bump steer but still need to figure out how to connect the rest of it back to the steering wheel and offset it to one side.

The front suspension has been a bit more challenging than anticipated with some trial and error. I overestimated the strength of the springs on the coil overs. After doing adjustments, parts on and off and on again quite few times it's sitting on the ground like it should. Problem is --- it only allows about 1/2" of axle movement up until the shock bottoms out. Coils are adjusted for max pressure already. That really defeats the whole purpose of the suspension so heading back to the drawing board. Before looking for stronger springs or new coil overs I'm going to try moving the the bottom mounts out towards the tires. That should (in theory) equal less mechanical leverage against the coils compared to the existing location and put the pressure closer to the spindles.

 

 

 

 

 

[wallfish 16,995]

Moving those lower shock mounts out towards the tires seems to work much better and the coils can be set softer. Still allows only about 1 1/2" of travel up but that should be plenty for what this is. 4 wheeling -- no good but cruising around at tractor shows - yes. Looks better with them closer to the center on the axles but oh well.

Now to redo the upper shock mount bracket to something more permanent. I like using the steel stuff with the holes already in it because the plan is to drill holes all over everything like the old school race car guys did to lighten everything up.

[Sparky-(Admin) 21,315]

16 minutes ago, wallfish said:

Moving those lower shock mounts out towards the tires seems to work much better and the coils can be set softer.  4 wheeling -- no good but cruising around at tractor shows - yes. 

Looking forward to a “Cadillac soft ride” 😎

[wallfish 16,995]

Ugh, Getting close to a year since playing with this. Seeing some of the other guys doing stuff has motivated me to get some time in on it.

It's taken a pretty big turn from the original plan as it seems everything I do does that. Anyway, here's an update for the change. Going Can-Am style bike

Rear adjustable suspension swing arm is 2 Suburban lift handles. (They were twisted and damaged)  The front is from the beginning. Again, trying to get as many wheel Horse parts on there as possible.

 

 

[SylvanLakeWH 25,552]

That

is

cool

 

And it's a Black Hood - sorta... 

[WHX?? 48,815]

Keep at it 'Fish... best part about under the apple tree work is that tree gets bigger providing more shade so take your time...  Lets not get into EB's mode tho...

[Ed Kennell 38,162]

Kool     

 

                                                                          I won't tell, but the engines in backwards....probably only work for us southpaws.

[953 nut 55,210]

Unless you are holding out on us you may need to alter the title of this thread.   Hot Rod 2 seater Rat ?  

[wallfish 16,995]

1 hour ago, 953 nut said:

Unless you are holding out on us you may need to alter the title of this thread.   Hot Rod 2 seater Rat ?  

Not holding out but there are still some parts on stand-by to continue a 2 seater build. And yes, a new thread should probably be started for this one.

The front end just looked too wide on it after building it so this emerged. Plus, a Can-Am style bike is something that hasn't been done before as far as I'm aware.