417a idler pulley replacement - advice/tips

[stegs 325]

Good morning everyone

 

I have a quick question. The drive idler pulley on my 417a went bad . It makes a awful noise and has alot of play in it. So I ordered a brand new toro replacement from jacks small engines.

 

 

Can anybody here walk me thru the steps to replace this?

 

My pulley will ship this week sometime, but id like to know how to remove the old and install the new one before it gets here. There isnt much on youtube on how to replace the transmission idler pulley

 

 

Is there anything i should watch for or pieces under load that might fly off?

 

 

 

 

[953 nut 55,762]

Remove the belt guard, check the condition of the belt and have the belt tensioner in the up position. 9/16 wrench should get the idler off and the new one on.

[peter lena 8,720]

@stegs , agree 953 NUT  , on simple installation , would also detail lubricate the related linkages, make the rust run out at every movement point , aerosol lubricant with extension tube to get into tight spots , pete   

[Gregor 4,847]

On my C sreies tractors, there is a wave washer on the idler pulley mechanism. Interesting enough, this diagram for the 417-A does not show a wave washer

Yet in the parts list accompanying this diagram, it lists item # 41 as a wave washer.

 

I cannot find item 41 in the diagram. If it does in fact have a wave washer, it's easy to overlook. Be sure to get it back where it was, and how it was, or there will be a rattle in your linkage. Even more than there is now.

[stegs 325]

thanks everyone! I think ill have to take the tire and side plate off to get good access to it. Ill crawl underneath tonight and look things over.

 

 

Right now that pulley make a god awful noise and you can easily wiggle the pulley, even with the belt on full tension. 

 

 

I did inspect the belt. It has been replaced and looks great. No fraying or cracks from what i can see. 

[lynnmor 7,353]

If too much of that wiggle is coming from the shaft where it pivots in the tractor, you may want to repair it with a bushing.  There are some old threads where folks gave a procedure to do that.

[stegs 325]

1 minute ago, lynnmor said:

If too much of that wiggle is coming from the shaft where it pivots in the tractor, you may want to repair it with a bushing.  There are some old threads where folks gave a procedure to do that.

 

I think its the pulley on the bearing is where the wiggle is coming from. Everything looked good, but the bearing/pulley screeches when its spinning. 

 

I look it at it better tonight and report back. 

[lynnmor 7,353]

Just now, stegs said:

 

I think its the pulley on the bearing is where the wiggle is coming from. Everything looked good, but the bearing/pulley screeches when its spinning. 

 

I look it at it better tonight and report back. 

I’m sure that you have a failed bearing, I just didn’t want you to start off with a new pulley that is running at a significant angle.  As you can see, it is a good idea to open up the console to oil all moving joints regularly.

[peter lena 8,720]

@stegs  that pulley is not that difficult , remove the drive belt metal guard , exposing the entire belt and pulley lay out .  you can roll that belt off the drive , letting you easily replace the pulley . my reference to lubrication , is the opportunity to lubricate rusty and hard moving movement points. good luck with it , pete 

[stegs 325]

15 minutes ago, peter lena said:

@stegs  that pulley is not that difficult , remove the drive belt metal guard , exposing the entire belt and pulley lay out .  you can roll that belt off the drive , letting you easily replace the pulley . my reference to lubrication , is the opportunity to lubricate rusty and hard moving movement points. good luck with it , pete 

thank you. I will lubricate while im in there for sure!

[Handy Don 12,457]

2 hours ago, Gregor said:

On my C sreies tractors, there is a wave washer on the idler pulley mechanism. Interesting enough, this diagram for the 417-A does not show a wave washer

Yet in the parts list accompanying this diagram, it lists item # 41 as a wave washer.

 

I cannot find item 41 in the diagram. If it does in fact have a wave washer, it's easy to overlook. Be sure to get it back where it was, and how it was, or there will be a rattle in your linkage. Even more than there is now.

I think in this diagram that the item labeled #36 (which is not in the list) is mislabeled and should be #41, the wave washer. That's where it was when I did two recent drive idler repairs.

 

However, to simply replace the pulley, there is no need to remove the idler shaft. The hole in #40 that accepts bolt #45 is threaded (do use Blue loctite when reassembling).

 

If you DO you remove the shaft, be sure to put the E-clip (#17) back correctly. It'll have sharp edges on one side and rounded edges on the other side. The sharp edges go away from the tractor.

 

One tip, I found it easier, surprisingly, to install the idler pulley with the belt already in place and properly routed under the pulley because the drive belt, even when the clutch is disengaged, is very stiff and has very little slack.

[stegs 325]

so i took it off last night. The bearing was completely gone in the pulley. 

 

 

However i do have a question. 

 

I had the belt of and no tension on it. I took the bolt out (#45 in the diagram above) and the silver arm (#40 in the diagram above) got pulled down by the spring #37

 

 

Not a problem, however in order to line up the new bolt/pulley/spacer and threaded hole on arm #40 is going to be a pain to align those

 

Question is, any tips to take the tension off the arm without taking spring #37 apart

 

 

 

I mean as soon as the bolt came out, that arm got pulled down and now has to get realigned with a spacer ......its could be a pain.

 

I feel there is a trick to this

[Gregor 4,847]

There really is no aligning to it. IF you put the pulley, spacer, bolt, and everything back as it was, everything will align itself. Simply pull up on the lever, and put the belt back under the pulley. As I remember it anyway.

[953 nut 55,762]

Now that you mention it I seem to recall having to take the spring off at the bottom until the bolt was installed on the idler.

Edited September 28, 2021 by 953 nut

[Handy Don 12,457]

5 hours ago, stegs said:

so i took it off last night. The bearing was completely gone in the pulley. 

 

 

However i do have a question. 

 

I had the belt of and no tension on it. I took the bolt out (#45 in the diagram above) and the silver arm (#40 in the diagram above) got pulled down by the spring #37

 

 

Not a problem, however in order to line up the new bolt/pulley/spacer and threaded hole on arm #40 is going to be a pain to align those

 

Question is, any tips to take the tension off the arm without taking spring #37 apart

 

 

 

I mean as soon as the bolt came out, that arm got pulled down and now has to get realigned with a spacer ......its could be a pain.

 

I feel there is a trick to this

I removed the spring and reinstalled it after putting the pulley back.  I had the right rear tire off anyway and that made it a lot easier.

[stegs 325]

3 minutes ago, Handy Don said:

I removed the spring and reinstalled it after putting the pulley back.  I had the right rear tire off anyway and that made it a lot easier.

i think this is what i will have to do. As soon as the bolt came out, that arm slammed down.....

 

Whats easier tho, fighting that spring will still attached or removing the spring and tryin to put it back after your done LOL!

[Handy Don 12,457]

I was one hand short trying to hold the sprung arm, hold the pulley, and thread the bolt.

That spring is quite strong so I used vise-grips to grab it when I put it back on. I put it on the lever first and then hooked it to the tractor frame hole.

[stegs 325]

1 hour ago, Handy Don said:

I was one hand short trying to hold the sprung arm, hold the pulley, and thread the bolt.

That spring is quite strong so I used vise-grips to grab it when I put it back on. I put it on the lever first and then hooked it to the tractor frame hole.

 

Thank you! Ill make sure when my pully shows up to have the wife give me a hand