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Bach-Ed

Drive belt doesn't disengage engine pulley

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Bach-Ed

I started this a while ago as an engine dies problem.  Wrong thought.  I recently replaced the drive belt.  Now I have an 857 but some years ago I have replaced the engine with a Kohler CH270.  So the factory part data as too long a belt it needs doesn't apply.

Now on to the problem.  When I drove down the biggest hill on my property and went to turn at the bottom, the engine stalled.  What I found was while the tension was off the belt the belt was stuck in the engine pulley.  So with the brake on full. it stalled the engine.

So here are a number of pics with the drive engaged.  I'll put two pic in a second message due to size restrictions.  One thought was the new belt unlike the previous one had a cogged back.  Any way with the clutch/brake released  it seems the belt is good.  Then we have pics with the parking brake set.   Notice how tightly the belt is in the engine pulley groove.  and for the record, this was with the guard in place.

How about some input.

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Bach-Ed

Now in what should be disengaged mode.

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pfrederi

I think the belt is your problem.  Never seen a toothed belt on a WH gear drive.  Also the WH belts are wrapped, not raw rubber like yours.  Also are the guides on the end of your belt guard located close to the belt

Edited by pfrederi
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stevasaurus

Check to see if your pulleys line up also.  Wrong kind of belt for sure.

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ebinmaine
  On 8/23/2021 at 3:14 PM, pfrederi said:

the belt is your problem

 

  On 8/23/2021 at 3:24 PM, stevasaurus said:

Wrong kind of belt for sure.

 

 

I concur..

 

On a Wheelhorse the drive belt is PART of the clutch system.

The drive belt MUST be a cloth wrapped unit or it won't be able to properly slip in the pulleys.

 

Standard automotive type rubber-sided belt CANNOT be used.

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Bach-Ed

Gentlemen , I bow to superior knowledge.  Time to get another belt.  THANK YOU

Ed

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Snoopy11
  On 8/23/2021 at 4:56 PM, Bach-Ed said:

Gentlemen , I bow to superior knowledge.  Time to get another belt.  THANK YOU

Ed

I would go with a Bando Ultrapower KC belt... best one that I have found in my belt searches...

 

Sorry I don't know your dimensions or I would give you a model number. BUT call Bearing and Industrial supply and order from them. They are awesome. 

 

800-826-9870

 

Don

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Snoopy11

Hey, guys, shouldn't there be a belt guard on the engine to?

 

I don't see any guards around the engine pulley...

 

Don

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ebinmaine
  On 8/23/2021 at 7:18 PM, Snoopy11 said:

Hey, guys, shouldn't there be a belt guard on the engine to?

 

I don't see any guards around the engine pulley...

 

Don

Not on the older tractors.

 

Some of them had wire type belt guides bolted to the engine but there were no guards around the engine pulley.

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Snoopy11

Basically, what I see is that the following part is missing off the engine...

 

Don

diagram.gif

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Snoopy11
  On 8/23/2021 at 7:27 PM, ebinmaine said:

Not on the older tractors.

 

Some of them had wire type belt guides bolted to the engine but there were no guards around the engine pulley.

Interesting... hold old are you talking?

 

Mine is a '67 and had the wire crap...

 

Don

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squonk

That belt would be fine IF it didn't need to be clutched. I agree needs a different belt. Napa green 4L (Whatever length it's supposed to be)0W

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Snoopy11

All I know, is that when I was building my tractor... I never got the belt to disengage without the above guard. I had to make my own on my 51 horse engine.

 

Don

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ebinmaine
  On 8/23/2021 at 7:27 PM, Snoopy11 said:

Basically, what I see is that the following part is missing off the engine...

 

Don

diagram.gif

 

Lots of Horses with Kohler engines only had the one single small lip tab that stuck forward off the bottom of the belt guard

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Snoopy11
  On 8/23/2021 at 7:29 PM, ebinmaine said:

 

Lots of Horses with Kohler engines only had the one single small lip tab that stuck forward off the bottom of the belt guard

Yeah, I mean, from what I saw, the difference with the above part off and put on was night and day. With that part on, and the clutch pushed in, the belt floats around the pulley without contacting it. 

 

I never got the freaking thing to disengage without the guard... LOL

 

Don

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ebinmaine
  On 8/23/2021 at 7:29 PM, Snoopy11 said:

All I know, is that when I was building my tractor... I never got the belt to disengage without the above guard. I had to make my own on my 51 horse engine.

 

Don

There could have been extenuating circumstances there. What size pulley? What width belt? Did it have the right angle? Was it a 5/8 or a 5l? 1/2" or 4l?

Those are four different sizes by the way...

Was the whole bottom of the belt properly supported?

Was the angle of the lineup going to the engine pulley slightly different than stock?

 

These are all things I ran into when I was trying to set up something slightly different than stock..

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ebinmaine
  On 8/23/2021 at 7:28 PM, Snoopy11 said:

Interesting... hold old are you talking?

 

Mine is a '67 and had the wire crap...

 

Don

Don't quote me as an authority here but I think the Tecumseh engines had the wire. Kohler ...? I'm not sure.

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Snoopy11
  On 8/23/2021 at 7:33 PM, ebinmaine said:

There could have been extenuating circumstances there. What size pulley? What width belt? Did it have the right angle? Was it a 5/8 or a 5l? 1/2" or 4l?

Those are four different sizes by the way...

Was the whole bottom of the belt properly supported?

Was the angle of the lineup going to the engine pulley slightly different than stock?

 

These are all things I ran into when I was trying to set up something slightly different than stock..

Yes dose things are all true... 

 

I think originally the pulley was the stocker that came on the Horse. Mine was the 1/2" Looks identical to the one in this tractor's picture in this forum.

 

Do you agree though since he has nothing on the engine pulley at all, that could be contributing to his issue?

 

Don

 

 

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Snoopy11
  On 8/23/2021 at 7:36 PM, ebinmaine said:

Don't quote me as an authority here but I think the Tecumseh engines had the wire. Kohler ...? I'm not sure.

Yep, mine was Tecumseh!!!

 

Don

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ebinmaine
  On 8/23/2021 at 7:36 PM, Snoopy11 said:

Yes dose things are all true... 

 

I think originally the pulley was the stocker that came on the Horse. Mine was the 1/2" Looks identical to the one in this tractor's picture in this forum.

 

Do you agree though since he has nothing on the engine pulley at all, that could be contributing to his issue?

 

Don

 

 

 

That is certainly a possibility but I would definitely change the belt and try it before I tried to build the wire belt guides.

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Snoopy11
  On 8/23/2021 at 7:38 PM, ebinmaine said:

 

That is certainly a possibility but I would definitely change the belt and try it before I tried to build the wire belt guides.

Good thing is... if you don't want to buy the above part, like I did... you can make belt guards out of junk laying around your shop... or the wire idea... although I tend to dislike the look of the wires...:rolleyes:

 

Don

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Snoopy11

Oh, by the way, ebinmaine

 

Did I see that you use Napa belts? Do you know if you can physically buy them at Napa?

 

Don

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ebinmaine
  On 8/23/2021 at 7:43 PM, Snoopy11 said:

Oh, by the way, ebinmaine

 

Did I see that you use Napa belts? Do you know if you can physically buy them at Napa?

 

Don

 

Me personally. Yes. But I have the advantage of being able to buy at the Westbrook Maine store which is also one of their warehouse hubs

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squonk
  On 8/23/2021 at 7:36 PM, ebinmaine said:

Don't quote me as an authority here but I think the Tecumseh engines had the wire. Kohler ...? I'm not sure.

I'm m going to quote you Eric! :)

 

I took this engine out of what looked to be an un-molested 702 and there is a wire on it.

 

IMG_20210823_170310596_HDR.jpg.8d17dab558876e2a0c66428c3cccb941.jpg

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