Bach-Ed 170 #1 Posted August 23, 2021 I started this a while ago as an engine dies problem. Wrong thought. I recently replaced the drive belt. Now I have an 857 but some years ago I have replaced the engine with a Kohler CH270. So the factory part data as too long a belt it needs doesn't apply. Now on to the problem. When I drove down the biggest hill on my property and went to turn at the bottom, the engine stalled. What I found was while the tension was off the belt the belt was stuck in the engine pulley. So with the brake on full. it stalled the engine. So here are a number of pics with the drive engaged. I'll put two pic in a second message due to size restrictions. One thought was the new belt unlike the previous one had a cogged back. Any way with the clutch/brake released it seems the belt is good. Then we have pics with the parking brake set. Notice how tightly the belt is in the engine pulley groove. and for the record, this was with the guard in place. How about some input. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bach-Ed 170 #2 Posted August 23, 2021 Now in what should be disengaged mode. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pfrederi 17,851 #3 Posted August 23, 2021 (edited) I think the belt is your problem. Never seen a toothed belt on a WH gear drive. Also the WH belts are wrapped, not raw rubber like yours. Also are the guides on the end of your belt guard located close to the belt Edited August 23, 2021 by pfrederi 2 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,841 #4 Posted August 23, 2021 Check to see if your pulleys line up also. Wrong kind of belt for sure. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 68,160 #5 Posted August 23, 2021 16 minutes ago, pfrederi said: the belt is your problem 5 minutes ago, stevasaurus said: Wrong kind of belt for sure. I concur.. On a Wheelhorse the drive belt is PART of the clutch system. The drive belt MUST be a cloth wrapped unit or it won't be able to properly slip in the pulleys. Standard automotive type rubber-sided belt CANNOT be used. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bach-Ed 170 #6 Posted August 23, 2021 Gentlemen , I bow to superior knowledge. Time to get another belt. THANK YOU Ed 3 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snoopy11 5,714 #7 Posted August 23, 2021 1 hour ago, Bach-Ed said: Gentlemen , I bow to superior knowledge. Time to get another belt. THANK YOU Ed I would go with a Bando Ultrapower KC belt... best one that I have found in my belt searches... Sorry I don't know your dimensions or I would give you a model number. BUT call Bearing and Industrial supply and order from them. They are awesome. 800-826-9870 Don Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snoopy11 5,714 #8 Posted August 23, 2021 Hey, guys, shouldn't there be a belt guard on the engine to? I don't see any guards around the engine pulley... Don Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snoopy11 5,714 #9 Posted August 23, 2021 I used this here on mine when I had the Tillotson 212 engine on it... these work great! https://www.propartsdirect.net/786-0039B-0637-mtd.aspx Don Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 68,160 #10 Posted August 23, 2021 7 minutes ago, Snoopy11 said: Hey, guys, shouldn't there be a belt guard on the engine to? I don't see any guards around the engine pulley... Don Not on the older tractors. Some of them had wire type belt guides bolted to the engine but there were no guards around the engine pulley. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snoopy11 5,714 #11 Posted August 23, 2021 Basically, what I see is that the following part is missing off the engine... Don Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snoopy11 5,714 #12 Posted August 23, 2021 Just now, ebinmaine said: Not on the older tractors. Some of them had wire type belt guides bolted to the engine but there were no guards around the engine pulley. Interesting... hold old are you talking? Mine is a '67 and had the wire crap... Don Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
squonk 41,289 #13 Posted August 23, 2021 That belt would be fine IF it didn't need to be clutched. I agree needs a different belt. Napa green 4L (Whatever length it's supposed to be)0W 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snoopy11 5,714 #14 Posted August 23, 2021 All I know, is that when I was building my tractor... I never got the belt to disengage without the above guard. I had to make my own on my 51 horse engine. Don Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 68,160 #15 Posted August 23, 2021 1 minute ago, Snoopy11 said: Basically, what I see is that the following part is missing off the engine... Don Lots of Horses with Kohler engines only had the one single small lip tab that stuck forward off the bottom of the belt guard Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snoopy11 5,714 #16 Posted August 23, 2021 1 minute ago, ebinmaine said: Lots of Horses with Kohler engines only had the one single small lip tab that stuck forward off the bottom of the belt guard Yeah, I mean, from what I saw, the difference with the above part off and put on was night and day. With that part on, and the clutch pushed in, the belt floats around the pulley without contacting it. I never got the freaking thing to disengage without the guard... LOL Don Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 68,160 #17 Posted August 23, 2021 1 minute ago, Snoopy11 said: All I know, is that when I was building my tractor... I never got the belt to disengage without the above guard. I had to make my own on my 51 horse engine. Don There could have been extenuating circumstances there. What size pulley? What width belt? Did it have the right angle? Was it a 5/8 or a 5l? 1/2" or 4l? Those are four different sizes by the way... Was the whole bottom of the belt properly supported? Was the angle of the lineup going to the engine pulley slightly different than stock? These are all things I ran into when I was trying to set up something slightly different than stock.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 68,160 #18 Posted August 23, 2021 7 minutes ago, Snoopy11 said: Interesting... hold old are you talking? Mine is a '67 and had the wire crap... Don Don't quote me as an authority here but I think the Tecumseh engines had the wire. Kohler ...? I'm not sure. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snoopy11 5,714 #19 Posted August 23, 2021 1 minute ago, ebinmaine said: There could have been extenuating circumstances there. What size pulley? What width belt? Did it have the right angle? Was it a 5/8 or a 5l? 1/2" or 4l? Those are four different sizes by the way... Was the whole bottom of the belt properly supported? Was the angle of the lineup going to the engine pulley slightly different than stock? These are all things I ran into when I was trying to set up something slightly different than stock.. Yes dose things are all true... I think originally the pulley was the stocker that came on the Horse. Mine was the 1/2" Looks identical to the one in this tractor's picture in this forum. Do you agree though since he has nothing on the engine pulley at all, that could be contributing to his issue? Don Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snoopy11 5,714 #20 Posted August 23, 2021 Just now, ebinmaine said: Don't quote me as an authority here but I think the Tecumseh engines had the wire. Kohler ...? I'm not sure. Yep, mine was Tecumseh!!! Don Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 68,160 #21 Posted August 23, 2021 1 minute ago, Snoopy11 said: Yes dose things are all true... I think originally the pulley was the stocker that came on the Horse. Mine was the 1/2" Looks identical to the one in this tractor's picture in this forum. Do you agree though since he has nothing on the engine pulley at all, that could be contributing to his issue? Don That is certainly a possibility but I would definitely change the belt and try it before I tried to build the wire belt guides. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snoopy11 5,714 #22 Posted August 23, 2021 1 minute ago, ebinmaine said: That is certainly a possibility but I would definitely change the belt and try it before I tried to build the wire belt guides. Good thing is... if you don't want to buy the above part, like I did... you can make belt guards out of junk laying around your shop... or the wire idea... although I tend to dislike the look of the wires... Don Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snoopy11 5,714 #23 Posted August 23, 2021 Oh, by the way, ebinmaine Did I see that you use Napa belts? Do you know if you can physically buy them at Napa? Don Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 68,160 #24 Posted August 23, 2021 2 minutes ago, Snoopy11 said: Oh, by the way, ebinmaine Did I see that you use Napa belts? Do you know if you can physically buy them at Napa? Don Me personally. Yes. But I have the advantage of being able to buy at the Westbrook Maine store which is also one of their warehouse hubs Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
squonk 41,289 #25 Posted August 23, 2021 1 hour ago, ebinmaine said: Don't quote me as an authority here but I think the Tecumseh engines had the wire. Kohler ...? I'm not sure. I'm m going to quote you Eric! I took this engine out of what looked to be an un-molested 702 and there is a wire on it. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
