Hub removal - 6 lug - All help appreciated

[Skipper 1,788]

Hi Guys

 

This sounds like a noob question, and it kind of is, so please bear with me. I have newer taken off 6 lug hubs before 

 

I have taken plenty hubs off, the 5 lug type, no problem. But on the 195 and D series, they have a much longer contact area, and the ones I am working on are stuck hard. I made up a custom puller from a HD commercial rim center of very thick steel, some 1/2" flat bar, and a 5 lug hydraulic press. All is bolted up perfect to the hub, trying to push it off the axle. The set screws are out, and penetrating oil has been soaking in for a few days. I have put as much pressure on as I dare. tried heat, and tapping with a set of mallets on the sides, like you would to loosen a steering ball joint. (not on the mating surface of cause). Nothing makes it budge. I would estimate there is about 2-3 tons of pressure on it, and my gut feeling tells me that if I crank it up much further, the hub mating surface will snap. Can't tell exact pressure with this little press, but everything else I have used it on, would have given up a long time ago.

 

So, now I have 2 options left, to avoid breaking something.

 

1. Pull the whole tranny, and set it up in the 50 ton shop press. That's heavy, and I will have to make axle wide fixtures for it, to go inn behind the hub.

2. Hope that someone here has the golden idea, that I have missed.

 

Thanks guys

 

Edited July 7, 2021 by Skipper

[squonk 41,151]

If you could fabricate a 2 piece plate to go behind the hub it would be better. and a hex on the puller screw to use a breaker bar or big impact.

[pfrederi 17,741]

To avoid snapping the flange you have to pull against the back of the hub.

 

 

[peter lena 8,634]

@pfrederi, great example of strength against strength , when you get a very solid and secure hook up , lubrication and leverage advantage , it just walks off the pull point , I like , pete

[squonk 41,151]

4 minutes ago, pfrederi said:

To avoid snapping the flange you have to pull against the back of the hub.

 

 

 

Paul do those 2 red and bare metal plates just stay there from pressure or are they fastened some way?

[pfrederi 17,741]

11 minutes ago, squonk said:

Paul do those 2 red and bare metal plates just stay there from pressure or are they fastened some way?

They are held by the silver flange puller being behind them pulling them against the hub.

[Handy Don 12,235]

1 hour ago, pfrederi said:

To avoid snapping the flange you have to pull against the back of the hub.

 

This setup looks like it can exert a fearsome amount of force!

Well done

[gwest_ca-(File Mod) 11,046]

Something I have always wanted to try but have not yet.

Replace the set screw with a bolt that has had the head cut off leaving about 3/4" of unthreaded shank. Drill a small hole down the center of the bolt. Install in the hub with a thread sealer to prevent a leak.

Add about 4 feet of hose straight up toped off with a small funnel.

Fill with Seafoam. It should create about 1-1/2 pounds pressure at the axle. If may drip out at the end of the axle so a drip tray would let one recycle what has gone through. Add patience and time.

 

Garry

[ebinmaine 67,602]

11 minutes ago, gwest_ca said:

Something I have always wanted to try but have not yet.

Replace the set screw with a bolt that has had the head cut off leaving about 3/4" of unthreaded shank. Drill a small hole down the center of the bolt. Install in the hub with a thread sealer to prevent a leak.

Add about 4 feet of hose straight up toped off with a small funnel.

Fill with Seafoam. It should create about 1-1/2 pounds pressure at the axle. If may drip out at the end of the axle so a drip tray would let one recycle what has gone through. Add patience and time.

 

Garry

 

I've done something a couple times in the past that eludes to your direction but isn't quite the same.

 

I've taken the set screws out and filled the small cavity with penetrating oil.

Heat the rest of the outside of the hub.

Repeat. Repeat.

 

Add the puller into the mix and get pressure going.

Heat, lubricate, heat, lubricate,...

 

After a few cycles you can see the penetrating oil coming out of the hub in different places so you KNOW it's working.

 

After that it's just a matter of patience and time. 

 

I've taken as much as two or three weeks to get a stubborn hub off. 

[pfrederi 17,741]

53 minutes ago, Handy Don said:

This setup looks like it can exert a fearsome amount of force!

Well done

 

Note that it bent the square tubing (Heavy wall)

[Skipper 1,788]

2 hours ago, pfrederi said:

To avoid snapping the flange you have to pull against the back of the hub.

 

Yeah. My thoughts exactly. That was also what I would do in the big press. I guess I can fab up a contraption like yours or so. That's surely the way to go if the tranny should stay in.

 

Thanks. Super info! 

 

 

[pacer 3,173]

I've tried all of these methods - and prolly a couple that I forget ..... and. they usually work.... but! (theres that 'but') On the 2 'Big D's" that I worked on I ended up taking them out of the case and used one of those HF type 20ton press and ... wow! we had about a 3ft bar in the Jack putting everything we had on it when POW! it turned loose. Amazing how stuck those things can get -- then theres the steering wheels.............

[Skipper 1,788]

6 minutes ago, pacer said:

I've tried all of these methods - and prolly a couple that I forget ..... and. they usually work.... but! (theres that 'but') On the 2 'Big D's" that I worked on I ended up taking them out of the case and used one of those HF type 20ton press and ... wow! we had about a 3ft bar in the Jack putting everything we had on it when POW! it turned loose. Amazing how stuck those things can get -- then theres the steering wheels.............

 

Just in case. How did you get them out of the tranny? Will that little lock ring just pop off in the diff or what?

[stevasaurus 22,764]

If that is what Pacer is doing, you only need to pop one...and if you have a choice, pop the brake drum side (left side).  That way you can open the trans with the shallow side down, take apart the differential, un-snap the other ring and pull out the other axle.  

[Handy Don 12,235]

1 hour ago, stevasaurus said:

and if you have a choice, pop the brake drum (left side)

Now THAT is the voice of experience, talking. Thanks!

[Skipper 1,788]

1 hour ago, stevasaurus said:

If that is what Pacer is doing, you only need to pop one...and if you have a choice, pop the brake drum (left side).  That way you can open the trans with the shallow side down, take apart the differential, un-snap the other ring and pull out the other axle.  

 

Hi Steve. Thanks for chiming in. 

 

Newer tried popping an axle out of the diff. Is there a certain method, or do one just give it a good old wack with the biggest persuasion tool around?

[pfrederi 17,741]

I think Steve meant to pop off one hub.  Then split tranny.  Trying to drive it out you will probably break the hub before you break / overide the snap ring.  They are heavy duty rings.  It may mess up the snap ring groove and then you are looking at a new axle...

[Skipper 1,788]

That sound right, but I also seem to recall reading about this popping axles out before, so I just wondered if that might be an option

 

Thanks guys

[pacer 3,173]

Not sure about your application, but the D's are really not that bad to drop the tranny part. Once that is done, remove the ...  5-6? bolts holding the 2 halves together and Viola! the whole guts are exposed and both axles are easily reached...... 

 

Now is as good a time as any and touch on the gasket for the 2 halves (in case you get that far) It is NLA! and youll have to make one. Find a Cherios or cracker box, etc with enough cardboard to cover all the holes. Lay the cardboard over the case and with a small ball peen hammer tap tap around a hole til the piece falls out and stick a bolt in that hole, got to the next one and do same til you have bolts in all the holes (that keeps it in alignment) Then with the small hammer tap tat tap all around the perimeters til it breaks away in the shape of the case. Takes a bit of time and patience but it works -- and after youve done 6-7 of them you can get pretty good at it!!

[Skipper 1,788]

So a quick update.

 

I made a puller, and I really thought i had made it plenty strong.

I welded it up in a H-frame style of 1/2"x2" steel. Put a 1" bolt in the middle, and put the impact gun on it.....................woulden't budge the least.

 

So i figured while under tension, i would try wacking the big bolt, while pulling the axle as much out of the tranny as possible, and then with the weight of that puller contraption, and a lot of wacking, tightening and further wacking, it slowly creeped out. 

 

 

Next time, the puller will be rebuild to hold a bottle jack for sure. This was a PITA. The second hub was removed in the big shop press, no issues at all.

 

Just a heads up on making life easier, if you ever have to split the diff, while in the tranny, with one side off. This flex end socket could easily sneak inn, and go on the nut. easy breezy.

 

 

 

 

So as to why the tranny had to come apart, that will shortly appear in another thread

 

Edited August 3, 2021 by Skipper

[953 nut 55,315]

30 minutes ago, Skipper said:

Next time, the puller will be rebuild to hold a bottle jack for sure.

That is the only way to go!   I made one like the one @meadowfield has, rather than a hub I used a 6" X 6" piece of 3/8" steel.

[squonk 41,151]

A fine thread center bolt would have given you more pulling power.

 

[Tuneup 1,433]

BFH - I think we have all been there. Nothing like a 3 lb sledge applied carefully, almost.