Hydro control questions. '70 Charger.

[ebinmaine 67,619]

I've been putting a little time in driving around on the Charger hydro. 

 

The controls are .... Lacking precision. 

 

I MUST keep my right hand ON the speed lever 100% of the time or it'll do whatever the heck it wants.

Could be slowing down. Usually it speeds up. 

 

.            

 

 

I do realize that this isn't a manual transmission and they just aren't going to act the same. 

 

Two main questions:

 

How do I adjust/tighten the controls to attempt to stop the "self-adjusting"?

 

Going up and down our hills I'm constantly adjusting the lever to maintain a constant speed whereas a manual transmission tractor you "set it and forget it". 

Is this normal????

 

 

 

I do still have some curiosity to try it as a plow tractor but as a woods runner this rig is currently useless. 

 

Help me out?

 

 

[The Tuul Crib 7,336]

Eric there's actually a way to tighten that up underneath the plate below the seat granted the spring isn't broke. I got mine dialed in pretty close

[ebinmaine 67,619]

1 minute ago, The Tuul Crib said:

Eric there's actually a way to tighten that up underneath the plate below the seat granted the spring isn't broke. I got mine dialed in pretty close

Any general direction instructions?

 

I left that cover plate off. 

[gt14rider 765]

Loosen nut #102, make adj with #100, think its 8 ft lb, to move handle, no lube on assembly,  works on friction. 

[cschannuth 3,816]

Eric, I’ve never had much luck getting my charger 12 to cooperate either. As long as I don’t go much over half speed it will stay and hold speed pretty well. But, as soon as I go full speed and slow down and then try to hold at partial speed it wants to creep up and go as fast as it can again. I’m not a big Hydro guy so I really don’t know what else to try. 

[ebinmaine 67,619]

20 minutes ago, gt14rider said:

Loosen nut #102, make adj with #100, think its 8 ft lb, to move handle, no lube on assembly,  works on friction

Excellent. Thank you!

[pfrederi 17,741]

You need a 5/8" open end for the threaded shaft and a thin 3/4" wrench to work the nut.  I use my home made blade nut wench

 

 

[pacer 3,173]

In the couple I've had that whole 'string' of part # from 96 thru to 101 are .... finiky? It seemed to me that cleanness was critical.

 

Course the ones I got had been sitting out forever and were rusty/dirty. I had one that I simply could not get apart and ended up cutting it out and find a replacement.

To me its kind of a crappy method & design .... We DO see a few puzzling ... design/engineering? in our horses  

[pfrederi 17,741]

Sorry 1-1/8" wrench for eh nut.  brain freeeze

[cschannuth 3,816]

4 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

Excellent. Thank you!

Let us know how it works if you try to adjust it.

[gt14rider 765]

Disassemble and clean all parts, take care to clean/polish #96, #98 smooth. Shaft has a woodruff key under #98 check or replace, and end of shaft #95, tab can crack allowing to spin. Could cause some adj problems, reassembled dry,no lube

[pfrederi 17,741]

You really raised two issues...One has been addressed getting the motion control to stay where you leave it.

 

Second issue is harder.  Even if the motion control doesn't move a hydro will speed up some going down hill and slow going up. If the hydro is in excellent shape the speed change will be minor.  However as they age and wear the over/under run will become much more noticeable.     That is why buying a used hydro is always something of a crapshoot.  It is why for hilly area mowing I prefer and use the set and forget of a C-175-8.  The hydro is great for congested areas with lots of maneuvering...

[pacer 3,173]

41 minutes ago, pfrederi said:

 

Second issue is harder.

Very true, on my D's the hand control is on the right side in front of the steering wheel, and I find myself with the right hand constantly on the lever - course I've done it so many years I really dont even think about it. I still much prefer a Hyd drive over gears....

 

As a comparison, I stumbled on a Massey Ferguson garden tractor (1650) and they have a foot control for their 2 speed hyd, and I have to say that foot control is a beautiful thing! Here again, I find my foot always on the pedal and am constantly fine tuning speed, and really not even aware of it!

[Ed Kennell 38,227]

2 hours ago, pfrederi said:

Even if the motion control doesn't move a hydro will speed up some going down hill and slow going up.

One more reason I like a foot control on all my tractors.

[ebinmaine 67,619]

Excellent advice and instructions folks. 

 

I have a spare shift linkage I got from @Stepney when I got the lift cylinder and valve. 

 

I'll disassemble that one. Clean til the cows come home. Then put it in this Charger. 

[Ed Kennell 38,227]

3 hours ago, pacer said:

foot control is a beautiful thing!

I only own hydros.....all have foot control and hydraulic lift.

[ebinmaine 67,619]

1 minute ago, Ed Kennell said:

I only own hydros.....all have foot control and hydraulic lift.

Are there different types of foot controls?

 

Something that can be self-made?

 

 

[pacer 3,173]

Eric, what with your imagination, engenuity, inquisitivity, etc, etc, why certainly you can adapt a foot control (I'm jealous as hell with your colossus project!)

Seriously, while that setup on yours is a bit crappy, it is relatively simple to rig up a pedal with a rod running back to attach to the hand control.

 

Things got slack around here one day (I cant stand to NOT have a project!) and I started plotting adding one to? ..... whatever tractor I had at that time - with that control, and in a couple days working out the kinks I had a pretty decent foot control. I sold the tractor so dont know how long term it was? 

 

I can only hold 4-5 tractors at a time, so as I finish a resto on one I lose interest in it anyway and stick it on CL for somebody else to play with 

 

Now, my dont sell tractors are the Big D's and in spite of all the plotting and head scratching, I just cant come up with a foot control on a D!!

[Ed Kennell 38,227]

32 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

Are there different types of foot controls?

 

Something that can be self-made?

 

 

I made all mine.    Alter the motion lever slot to a straight slot and add a right foot pedal connected to the hand lever.    Add a spring to default to reverse.

520H

 

312H

 

The 417H and C-120H  are similair.

[ebinmaine 67,619]

14 minutes ago, pacer said:

, what with your imagination, engenuity, inquisitivity, etc, etc, why certainly you can adapt a foot control (I'm jealous as hell with your colossus project!)

Seriously, while that setup on yours is a bit crappy, it is relatively simple to rig up a pedal with a rod running back to attach to the hand control

Hahahahaha. 

Thanks. 

 

I'm already mentally brewing about it. 🤔

 

The forklifts at work have foot speed controls. THOSE I like a LOT. 

Been thinking on a rocker pedal or maybe a big C shape that has a part that sits ABOVE my foot. 

Push, forward. 

Pull back with toe, reverse. 

 

 

 

Colossus has certainly been a LOT of challenges and the same level of FUN. 

Wish I had more time to mess with it.... Soon though. No real rush. 

 

 

[tom2p 2,394]

10 hours ago, pfrederi said:

Even if the motion control doesn't move a hydro will speed up some going down hill and slow going up.
 

If the hydro is in excellent shape the speed change will be minor.  However as they age and wear the over/under run will become much more noticeable.     

 

my hydro experience is limited to two 416-H with Eaton 1100 trans and steering column mounted control lever - have no experience with the earlier hydro tractors with Sundstrand trans 

 

to reduce speed build up / freewheeling when going down hill - just requires a slight tap to the control lever and it will slow the tractor 

 

speed reduction going uphill is minor and barely noticeable - even on the 416 with around 1000 hours 

 

the speed reduction I've had to address was due to the throttle cable pivot losing friction !  lol

 

had one that would not respond to the Vice Grip tightening - so I replaced the rivet with a nut and bolt 

 

Edited May 3, 2021 by tom2p