Onan P220 surging/hunting at operate

[WheelHorse520H 708]

3 minutes ago, Horse Newbie said:

Best of my recollection, my 1194 520H was like this in the area of the PTO engagement linkage...

1. Engine block.    2. muffler mounting bracket

3. PTO linkage bracket/ no spacer such as I see in your pic.

 

I believe it was between #1 and #2

[Horse Newbie 7,069]

Just now, WheelHorse520H said:

I believe it was between #1 and #2

I guess that is totally possible...

I would see how the muffler/ exhaust lines up after hand snugging  the bolts in the pipe flanges to the heads, then see if it looks like you have a space to fill between the engine block and muffler bracket.

[WheelHorse520H 708]

2 minutes ago, Horse Newbie said:

I guess that is totally possible...

I would see how the muffler/ exhaust lines up after hand snugging  the bolts in the pipe flanges to the heads, then see if it looks like you have a space to fill between the engine block and muffler bracket.

I’ll check there, I’ll loosen the PTO bolts and see if there is room.

[WheelHorse520H 708]

I found where the piece goes, it’s a little cover over a hole in the engine block. Photos below. I have a ripped gasket for it so I used some gas safe sealant and it seems good. Got it all back together and it has spark but it won’t start. I don’t know what is going on, used an eye dropper and dropped gas into the carb but it still won’t start. PLEASE HELP.

[lynnmor 7,306]

29 minutes ago, WheelHorse520H said:

I found where the piece goes, it’s a little cover over a hole in the engine block. Photos below. I have a ripped gasket for it so I used some gas safe sealant and it seems good. Got it all back together and it has spark but it won’t start. I don’t know what is going on, used an eye dropper and dropped gas into the carb but it still won’t start. PLEASE HELP.

 

 Is this an older engine that once had points and it was converted to electronic?  The points would have been mounted there.

 

Pull a spark plug and check for sparking while cranking.

[WheelHorse520H 708]

11 minutes ago, lynnmor said:

Is this an older engine that once had points and it was converted to electronic?  The points would have been mounted there.

I don’t think so, but I could be wrong.

 

13 minutes ago, lynnmor said:

Pull a spark plug and check for sparking while cranking.

I will try that. But just curious does using a spark tester make any difference?

[lynnmor 7,306]

1 hour ago, WheelHorse520H said:

 

I will try that. But just curious does using a spark tester make any difference?

 

A spark tester might give a better idea of the intensity of the spark, but a spark plug will show if a spark is present.  Since it takes higher voltage to spark under compression, the gap on the test plug can be opened a bit to better test for ample voltage.  I keep an old but good plug around for test purposes, it can be any plug that fits the ignition wire.  Be sure to ground the base of the plug against a metal engine part.  I have a meter that tests spark that hasn't been used in 50 years, a spark plug is good enough.

[WheelHorse520H 708]

The tester said it has spark but resting the plug on metal did not have spark, does it need to be held there or does having it rest there good?

[lynnmor 7,306]

42 minutes ago, WheelHorse520H said:

The tester said it has spark but resting the plug on metal did not have spark, does it need to be held there or does having it rest there good?

As long as it is touching bare metal it will work.  A very bad plug can leak the spark down the center electrode where you may not see it, a new or known good plug is best.  I avoid spark testers preferring actual conditions.

[WheelHorse520H 708]

1 minute ago, lynnmor said:

As long as it is touching bare metal it will work.  A very bad plug can leak the spark down the center electrode where you may not see it, a new or known good plug is best.  I avoid spark testers preferring actual conditions.

I am actually about to leave to get new plugs anyway just because of how old these are.

[lynnmor 7,306]

NGK plugs are the best, in recent years Champion has some poor threading.

[WheelHorse520H 708]

Does it matter if they are unused but I bought them years ago? 

[lynnmor 7,306]

1 hour ago, WheelHorse520H said:

Does it matter if they are unused but I bought them years ago? 

Spark plugs will last almost forever if they aren’t exposed to something that caused them to corrode.

[WheelHorse520H 708]

I got new plugs and have verified, there is spark. It seems there is a fuel delivery issue. The fuel filter is getting some fuel but not a lot. Not enough to start I believe. I think the fuel pump is to blame. However I am not sure which way the fuel shut off goes to have fuel flowing. I believe it is when the screw is out all the way, correct? This is strange, it started fine before I tore it down.

[Ed Kennell 38,174]

Is the pulse hose connected to the pump and block?

Edited August 20, 2021 by Ed Kennell

[WheelHorse520H 708]

Just now, Ed Kennell said:

If this is a pulse pump, is the hose connected?

It was when I put it together and it appears to pump just slowly. I think since I took the carb apart it may need to be filled since it completely drained. Thoughts?

[Horse Newbie 7,069]

It may take 20 to 30 seconds of cranking with that pulse pump to fill the bowl... 

[WheelHorse520H 708]

Ok, I am going to fill the line that goes from the filter (after the filter just to be clear) to the carb so I can start it and let it fill the bowl on its own. Thanks for the input.

[Tuneup 1,433]

Isn't that the useless plate that sits right behind the PTO on the engine. Older Onans with points mounted there.

[WheelHorse520H 708]

1 minute ago, Tuneup said:

Isn't that the useless plate that sits right behind the PTO on the engine. Older Onans with points mounted there.

Yes, in the first photo of post 204 you can see the drive belt in the bottom of the photo. The thing about the points is what @lynnmor said. I never knew the p220 had points, I thought it was always electronic.

[Tuneup 1,433]

1 hour ago, WheelHorse520H said:

Yes, in the first photo of post 204 you can see the drive belt in the bottom of the photo. The thing about the points is what @lynnmor said. I never knew the p220 had points, I thought it was always electronic.

The 220 was always electronic but the block came from the older series which had a points module - at least that has always been my belief...

[WheelHorse520H 708]

4 minutes ago, Tuneup said:

The 220 was always electronic but the block came from the older series which had a points module - at least that has always been my belief...

Interesting. Thanks for the info.

[WheelHorse520H 708]

I took off the top of the carb and filled it with fresh gas I got today and it still won’t start. @Horse Newbie I’ve been cranking it like crazy to pump fuel up but it still won’t start. I am not sure @lynnmor if I have spark. With the plug out and against bare metal there is a spark but I know that you said it is harder to get a spark when it’s under compression. I am at a loss, I have no clue what is happening.

[Horse Newbie 7,069]

@WheelHorse520H  Has anybody mentioned safety switches? I know my 1994 520H wouldn't crank one day and I had to put my motion lever (right side of steering wheel) in exact neutral. But now I remember it would not even turn over, not turn over but not fire. 

Don't fret and be patient, you just ain't figured it out yet...you'll get it.

[WheelHorse520H 708]

2 minutes ago, Horse Newbie said:

@WheelHorse520H  Has anybody mentioned safety switches? I know my 1994 520H wouldn't crank one day and I had to put my motion lever (right side of steering wheel) in exact neutral. But now I remember it would not even turn over, not turn over but not fire. 

Don't fret and be patient, you just ain't figured it out yet...you'll get it.

I’ll bypass them and try it but I am pretty sure I have spark, the motion lever on the 88 is in the middle. It appears to be flooding what on the carb should I adjust?