redone 45 #1 Posted March 13, 2021 Guys, this special to timing to I brought to set those gears. Not sure it's the right way to set the timing. What advice if any. Thanks Bill Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 48,834 #2 Posted March 14, 2021 Don' put them in ... most guys here don't. The general consensus is if you don't have them in right and even when you do they can grenade and ventilate the block. Reports are there is little to no difference in vibration. 3 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Achto 27,621 #3 Posted March 14, 2021 You will find many others here that will give you the same advise. 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pfrederi 17,741 #4 Posted March 14, 2021 (edited) Well I am not one of them. I left the balance gears out of the last two overhauls and there is a noticeable difference in vibration. i ordered one of the tools and will use it in the next rebuild. Kohler didn't spend the money for no reason. Yes i am sure some balance gears "grenaded" but so did some connecting rods and other parts. I think part of the reason for leaving them out is the very detailed and difficult installation instructions. Edited March 14, 2021 by pfrederi 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JAinVA 4,619 #5 Posted March 14, 2021 (edited) On the whole I can only argue one point. Most of the Kohlers I have done, I removed the balance gears with little difference. Kohler made engines for hundreds of companies and some opted out of the gears . I have a 14HP bare block on the bench that was never drilled for the balance gear shafts. I thought I had one, and I just checked seeing only solid castings where the shafts are pressed in. Edited March 14, 2021 by JAinVA 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 48,834 #6 Posted March 14, 2021 1 hour ago, pfrederi said: I think part of the reason for leaving them out is the very detailed and difficult installation instructions. I think you have a point there Paul .... Truth be told here I have never done a build with them so I have no idea on the diff between leaving them out or not but I have perused the manuals on how it is is done .... like reading Greek to me. I would be scared as a mouse in a cat house as to get the timing spot on. BUT might be different had I did a few 100 builds and considered myself a pro at it. I'm a guy that has a penchant for S/G motors and prescribes to the kiss principal. Just going by the many past discussions we have had about tbalance gears we had here before. . On the Kohler didn't build them for no reasons is open to debate on were they looking for a better mouse trap or just trying to blow their own horn on a "balanced " engine? Not sorry just don't think it was one of their better mouse traps. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oliver2-44 9,765 #7 Posted March 14, 2021 3 hours ago, JAinVA said: Kohler made engines for hundreds of companies and some opted out of the gears . I have a 14HP bare block on the bench that was never drilled for the balance gears The 16hp K341 in the WH C161 I picked up some time ago was destroyed inside by a balance gear. I have several parts engines. Some have them, some don’t. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mickwhitt 4,642 #8 Posted March 14, 2021 I left them out of my K301 rebuild with no apparent difference in running or vibration. Its an agricultural engine, not a precisely balanced machine. Its noisy no matter what you do to it, thats just the nature of the beast. I was told the weights were only ever included to try to make the tractor appeal to middle Americans cutting their suburban lawns rather than to provide a real improvement in performance etc. They are very complicated to install correctly so that hints they are not particularly well designed IMHO. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
briankd 817 #9 Posted March 14, 2021 when i done my K301 i left mine out . looked at putting them back in but i had the old style gears and the cost of buying bearings and shims was quite a bit of $$ . then the hassle of timing them . kouler has a tool to time them which i didn't have . the WH dealer i deal with he don't even put them back in because of the cost to customer on the rebuild . he gave me another crankshaft that the weights on the crank wasn't flattened out says that would help for the vibration . seen where there is a kit out where you take crank to machine shop and they shave off some counter weight and install some weight to compensate for the vibration without using the balance gears 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
953 nut 55,328 #10 Posted March 14, 2021 12 hours ago, redone said: Guys, this special to timing to I brought to set those gears. Not sure it's the right way to set the timing. What advice if any. Thanks Bill The balance gears should not be used unless you are installing a new set of bearings and shims which come in a kit. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pacer 3,174 #11 Posted March 14, 2021 By now you have probably guessed that the majority of 'us' remove the gears. I had a new to me K341 that had a ..... different? rattle/noise and being unfamiliar with the engine I tore into it for an inspection. On checking it over found that it was in really good condition in still standard specs --- except the "grenade gears" very sloppy/loose. Having read many of the posts like this one regarding them, I removed them and could not see/notice any difference,,,,, except that odd 'rattle' was gone. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bill D 1,926 #12 Posted March 14, 2021 I have noticed that engine blocks from John Deere machines aren't drilled for balance gears. @Greentoredcan balance the crankshaft or install one of David Kirk's balance plates. I had a rattle in an M16 I picked up. I pulled the gears and the rattle is gone. Bill 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
