Static vs timing light

[Goldnboy 926]

I have been using the static method for timing Kohler  points gap with great success and no need for buying a timing light. What does everyone else use? What extra benefit is there to using a timing light? The static method works when a engine is not running and that to me is a great feature.

Edited February 25, 2021 by Goldnboy

[pfrederi 17,741]

I use the timing light now...  a bit more precision. Just wish I had the GM points you could adjust while running...I know there is an adapter to allow to use them but it costs...

[81blackhood 168]

I used a multi meter to set my points exactly.   Norm from “I Save Tractors” has a video on this.  

Edited February 25, 2021 by 81blackhood

[formariz 11,987]

Is there really a point to do it with a timing gun if one cannot adjust it with engine running? How much more precise does it need to be it than with the multimeter? It just seems like a source for frustration with the constant checking after turning engine off and on.

Edited February 25, 2021 by formariz

[pfrederi 17,741]

Static is fine.  I use the light because I have it...and I can see it is on time while running less something moved slipped after static timing..

Edited February 25, 2021 by pfrederi

[Tractorhead 9,064]

Depends a little on the Engine.

mostly i try to find the marks, than i use the multimeter setup and the timing light after to verify against while running.

 

[Achto 27,609]

I use static timing, it has worked very well for me. Turned one PITA to start engine into a 1 pull wonder. I have a timing light, just never found need to break it out.

[squonk 41,155]

One nice thing about the timing light. If our engine is running like poo, you can stick a timing light on and see if the timing is off (worn points maybe) before taking anything apart. It may also show erratic spark

[Stepney 2,325]

Old snowmobiles were Always static timed right off the crown of the piston. That's how I time anything if it's apart for any reason. Teccy did it that way for years too. Nothing is any more exact..

Course.. a K301 also doesn't exactly care most of the time. But I'm picky. Seems way more important on a mag fired engine.
Not even sure you can change the timing on the Magnums?? Small engine SSI always bugged me in that way. Especially with B&S.

I've had several flywheels with the marks not .. quite right. 

[953 nut 55,321]

5 hours ago, formariz said:

Is there really a point to do it with a timing gun if one cannot adjust it with engine running? How much more precise does it need to be it than with the multimeter? It just seems like a source for frustration with the constant checking after turning engine off and on.

 

6 hours ago, 81blackhood said:

used a multi meter to set my points exactly.

 

If I am doing static timing I use a 12 volt test light rather than a meter, the light grabs your attention better than a meter.

Gapping the ignition points at .020 has always been the standard answer to how points should be set. That probably will get you into the ballpark where the engine will run, but with a bit of additional effort you can improve the engine’s power and performance.

The Kohler engine manual in the Red Square files section covers two methods for setting the ignition timing, Static Timing and using a Timing Light. This manual is a relatively new manual and it overlooks the fact that many of our engines were built prior to the ACR (automatic compression release) camshaft.

Earlier engines (mostly 1965 and earlier) had a Spark Advance camshaft that can not be timed using Static timing. At rest (and very low RPMs) the timing is retarded to fire slightly after TDC. The timing mark (SP) on your flywheel is at twenty degrees before top dead center but at rest the points on these engines break about ten degrees after top dead center. The only reliable way to check or set the timing on these engines is with a timing light.

There are a couple ways to determine what camshaft you have. Presuming the camshaft in your engine is the one it was born with the data plate on the engine has a suffix that can tell you what camshaft was used. The table below will tell you the suffix applicable to your engine. The other way to determine what camshaft you have is to remove the cam gear cover and take a look. If you see a mechanism attached to the cam gear it is the ACR cam.

 

 

The following engines have the spark advance camshaft;

K-141, Suffix prior to “C”

K-161, Suffix prior to “J”

K-181, Suffix prior to “D”

K-241, Suffix prior to “D”

[Goldnboy 926]

Thanks for the education @953 nut I forgot about the older Kohler engines.  But now this brings up another subject... did timing lights exists before 1965? I am thinking that is expensive equipment to be using back in the 60's...

[Tractorhead 9,064]

I see another big advance in the Timing light check before and after the timing setup,

you will optical see missfires even if you can‘t hear em

 

if the engine is in idle you can mostly hear missfires at one revolution,

but with a timing light verification you can also verify if your coil have a frequency depending failure.

means if it just fails in small rpm range or over  the complete range.

It indicates also if you have fuel problems or ignition/ timing problems ( points, setup, coil, ignition relevant parts)

( if engines runs to lean, they can u.d.c. show symptoms like a bad ignition)

Therefore i do it the Way, if ignition can be seen synchron - look closer at the fuel system.

 

i know we here not in rocket sience on this small engines, but so i found a failure can be quicker found,

especial if a engine spit‘s while in mid or high rpm, you will see it immediately if there is an ignition trouble

from whatever reason - if not look at  other things like lean / ritch ratio, fuel path maybe just clogged, Valves and so on...

 

 

[953 nut 55,321]

8 hours ago, Goldnboy said:

. did timing lights exists before 1965? I am thinking that is expensive equipment to be using back in the 60's..

I am old enough to confirm the timing lights existed long before the '60s.  Just like today's meters and specialty tooling there were expensive timing lights for those who used them every day and there were hobbyist grade timing lights fore shade tree mechanics. The J.C.Whitney catalog had something for everyone. 

[rjg854 11,387]

You could get almost anything through J.C.Withney back in the day. 

[Mickwhitt 4,642]

I used a static timing light unit I built myself. One clip on battery positive, one on the coil lead.

Magnet holds it close to the viewing port so I can see the led light and mark at the same time.

 

Makes static timing a lot easier.

 

I agree with Caz about not being able to adjust the timing while the engine is running. No point using a strobe light in my view.

 

Mick  

 

 

 

[squonk 41,155]

1 hour ago, 953 nut said:

I am old enough to confirm the timing lights existed long before the '60s.  Just like today's meters and specialty tooling there were expensive timing lights for those who used them every day and there were hobbyist grade timing lights fore shade tree mechanics. The J.C.Whitney catalog had something for everyone. 

That air cooled oil filter looks intriguing!