Hydro vs Electric Lift

[JCM 9,130]

I was planning to Install a 48'' Dozer blade on the 418-A this winter to try using a hydro for a change but after my first winter trail ride I changed my mind, boy is that nice on the trails. I am thinking on the 417-8 instead with factory lift. I have a set of wheel weights that I have had for 20 years and never used and a spare set of chains. The dozer blade has not been used in 18 years. My driveway is roughly 150' long so not a lot of back and forth motion and this will be used to clean up after the bucket loader has done it's job and for lighter, powdery snow. My question is your comments on 1 vs the other,  and is the electric a lot slower. I have not needed the electric lift for any attachment and would like to use it or lose it.    Thanks

[WVHillbilly520H 10,373]

20 minutes ago, JCM said:

I was planning to Install a 48'' Dozer blade on the 418-A this winter to try using a hydro for a change but after my first winter trail ride I changed my mind, boy is that nice on the trails. I am thinking on the 417-8 instead with factory lift. I have a set of wheel weights that I have had for 20 years and never used and a spare set of chains. The dozer blade has not been used in 18 years. My driveway is roughly 150' long so not a lot of back and forth motion and this will be used to clean up after the bucket loader has done it's job and for lighter, powdery snow. My question is your comments on 1 vs the other,  and is the electric a lot slower. I have not needed the electric lift for any attachment and would like to use it or lose it.    Thanks

Jim, I do not have the electric lift, but of the ones I know of everyone says they are "painfully" slow vs hydraulics but if the idea of burning out your left arm scares you put it on. Unfortunately I'm so spoiled by hydraulics now its almost impossible to return to the one arm bandits for me.

[Pullstart 62,805]

@PeacemakerJack put electric lift on Ghostrider... I don’t think it!s terribly slow for the one bottom plow...

[ebinmaine 67,310]

Not being sarcastic (for once) why does it matter if it's slow?

Drive to the end of the row being plowed. Stop. As soon as you stopped the tractor hit the UP. Grab R. 

By the time you shift, let out the clutch, and proceed in reverse it'll be some off the ground. 

 

In all seriousness if you don't like it throw me a price.... I realize they aren't cheap but it would be a good add to something here like Cinnamon or Colossus. 

 

 

[midpack 862]

I have 2 electric lifts and would love another. I prefer 8 speed  machines, although I was using a hydro quite a bit to mow last summer but that was because I was liking the 48" deck I had on it. The difference in speed isn't that much

[JCM 9,130]

Are yours factory lifts or did you add them.

[wallfish 16,986]

Just use the manual lever. Set up properly it's not a difficult task and you can always add a helper spring.

I still use a manual lift on my little 654 tractor and there's added weight to blade frame plus a huge 1/4" thick scraper bar and no helper spring. Lots of back and forth and up and down so it needs to be quick for me.

[midpack 862]

One was factory installed, I liked it and one came up for sale local so I grabbed it

[JCM 9,130]

Hi John   @wallfish   My 417-8 has a factory lift, it is a 1986, the 85 model had the manual lift. I have just never needed it and now I would like to plow with it and was curious from those that had one what their opinions were. Thanks for your input.

[WheelhorseBob 1,549]

The 121 I’m restoring has the electric lift. Before I disassembled it I tried it. It’s seems to be twice as slow as hydraulic but really 1.5 seconds vs 3 seconds doesn’t seem to make a difference at my advanced age......

[Stepney 2,325]

Manny had a C141 with an electric lift, likely the same unit. It was rather slow. But I liked it. It never would sink when left to sit, and the adjustment was much more fine than the hydraulics can manage. Had all the control of a hand lift without the work. 

[JCM 9,130]

Iv'e been yanking on those manual lift levers since 1989 and I think by the sound of it I am going to love the electric lift. Besides I'm not quite as much in a hurry as when I was younger. I am quite sure the hydro lift is the better of the two though.

[JCM 9,130]

If I was going to hang that 44'' 2 stage off the front we wouldn't be having this conversation.   HYDRO LIFT !

[ebinmaine 67,310]

2 minutes ago, JCM said:

HYDRO LIFT

No sir. 

That's where you want a good ole fashioned left shoulder workout. 

 

 

[WVHillbilly520H 10,373]

29 minutes ago, JCM said:

If I was going to hang that 44'' 2 stage off the front we wouldn't be having this conversation.   HYDRO LIFT !

I can say that this year was they first for manual lift and a tiller, honestly it wasn't too bad but it wasn't buried 8" under soil like a Brinly moldboard either.

[JoeM 7,871]

10 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

want a good ole fashioned left shoulder workout

How about this EB?

[ebinmaine 67,310]

20 minutes ago, JoeM said:

How about this EB?

PERFECT

[JoeM 7,871]

3 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

PERFECT

Thigh master 6000 plus! Manual everything!

[richmondred01 2,237]

I’ve had both. 
As stated, hydro is faster however, I’ve never been a fan of hydros for anything other then cutting grass or using the 2 stage blower.

When pushing snow every 520,416 hydro I’ve had wimp out in the winter when pushing snow. Whereas the 8 speed will keep going until the tires spin. 
With that in mind, the 520-8 with electric lift was perfect. Even better was the 418-8 with the electric lift (I’m a Kohler engine guy)
If anyone is interested I’ve got a NOS full electric lift set up. 

[pfrederi 17,674]

9 minutes ago, richmondred01 said:

I’ve had both. 
As stated, hydro is faster however, I’ve never been a fan of hydros for anything other then cutting grass or using the 2 stage blower.

When pushing snow every 520,416 hydro I’ve had wimp out in the winter when pushing snow. Whereas the 8 speed will keep going until the tires spin. 
With that in mind, the 520-8 with electric lift was perfect. Even better was the 418-8 with the electric lift (I’m a Kohler engine guy)
If anyone is interested I’ve got a NOS full electric lift set up. 

 

 

Interesting.  My experience with 12hp Sunstrands is somewhat different.  I have them well weighted and good chains.The engine will start to slow before it spins the wheels. The engine slowing wold indicate no significant slippage in the hydro. Add the high speed reverse and quick directional changes I will never go back to gears for snow removal...

[richmondred01 2,237]

8 minutes ago, pfrederi said:

 

 

Interesting.  My experience with 12hp Sunstrands is somewhat different.  I have them well weighted and good chains.The engine will start to slow before it spins the wheels. The engine slowing wold indicate no significant slippage in the hydro. Add the high speed reverse and quick directional changes I will never go back to gears for snow removal...

agreed. I should have mentioned the sunstrands are, in my opinion, far better then the Eaton used on the 520 and 416 models.
 

Edited December 7, 2020 by richmondred01

[peter lena 8,583]

JCM , AGREE WITH WALLFISH on the helper spring for plow or snow blower lift help , I did this on mine , scroll down and look at the  THREADED EYE BOLTS  , THAT I ADDED TO THE LOWER CORNER HOOD MOUNTING POINTS ,  also added an eye to the closest frame mount to the hood area , tried a number of springs till I got the  perfect lift help yet ,let the plow make full contact plow. btw those 2 heavy springs really help on snow blower lift , once you add the eye bolts , you can see your answer, pete 

 

[DennisThornton 4,769]

I have manual and hydros and I do have a couple electric actuators laying around but my absolute favorite for a dozer blade is manual!  I have incredible control with down pressure!  I can feel how much and either cut down harder or just let it skim across the top, so lightly that I can push grass and light limbs off my yard without tearing up the turf.  It will skim across not quite frozen gravel or I can push forward and cut into ice.  Love it!

 

I've yet to install my mid-mount on my XI and I'm wondering if I'm going to miss the control of feeling the cut.  I suppose on it I'd want it to just cut down level anyway, so...

[ebinmaine 67,310]

10 minutes ago, DennisThornton said:

I have manual and hydros and I do have a couple electric actuators laying around but my absolute favorite for a dozer blade is manual!  I have incredible control with down pressure!  I can feel how much and either cut down harder or just let it skim across the top, so lightly that I can push grass and light limbs off my yard without tearing up the turf.  It will skim across not quite frozen gravel or I can push forward and cut into ice.  Love it!

 

I've yet to install my mid-mount on my XI and I'm wondering if I'm going to miss the control of feeling the cut.  I suppose on it I'd want it to just cut down level anyway, so...

 

I've never run a dozer for a living but I know from the experiences of others that even with a power lift you can get a feel for it...

Practice practice practice. 

[DennisThornton 4,769]

20 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

 

I've never run a dozer for a living but I know from the experiences of others that even with a power lift you can get a feel for it...

Practice practice practice. 

I highly recommend the WH dozer blade with a manual lift and down pressure link instead of chain.

Now, I can feel or sense what my New Holland is doing with it's hydraulics by listening to the load on the engine and I can feel little changes AFTER they have occurred but with the manual lift, and slowing down a bit, it's as though I'm one with the blade!  And I guess I pretty much am!