Restoring 48 inch deck - Tracking my progress so far, needed advice + PICTURES

[Charbs152 254]

Hello all

First off,  I've never restored anything in my life to this extent so bear with me.

AM I CRAZY OR IS MY CENTER PULLEY INSTALLED UPSIDE DOWN? lol

 

I am restoring my 48 inch deck i recently acquired when i got my C-175 Auto this fall.  its a 05-48MS01 deck but upon taking it apart, it has at least 2 different spindles in it, all 3 appear to be 3/4 shaft but one is keyed and the other two aren't, also one has a big nut at the bottom near the blades and the others have the spindle cups...

 

I have new bearings for these spindles, my question is how do i remove the shafts/bearings.  my understanding is there is a snap ring somewhere but how do i access the snap ring?

 

My plan to is rebuild the spindles and give this deck a new paint job along with new bolts, bushings, maybe wheels/rollers and bump stops.  Thanks all!!

 

Another question..what about the mule drive?  can that be rebuilt?

 

Parts i have:

-Bearings

- Bushings for under tension arm

-Bushings in Lift assembly

-Blades/Nuts

-Primer and paint (rustoleum)

-Idler pulley

 

 

Need:

-Nuts and Bolts/Hardware

-Rubber bump Stops

-Source spare spindle/spindle shaft/housing

-New Wheel/roller set?

-Belts? meh

-Decals?

 

Need to do:

Finish cleaning up deck/parts with flap disc

Prime/paint

Rebuild spindles (they seem fine but since its new to me i may as well learn it and do it now)

Assemble deck

 

 

pics here

 

https://imgur.com/gallery/Qs5aR1j

 

 

Edited November 17, 2020 by Charbs152

[JCM 9,130]

Try Parts Tree for mower parts list for both mule drive and mower deck. Exploded view will give you a good idea what is involved in what you are trying accomplish, Good luck

[JoeM 7,871]

6 hours ago, Charbs152 said:

I have new bearings for these spindles, my question is how do i remove the shafts/bearings.  my understanding is there is a snap ring somewhere but how do i access the snap ring?

You have to remove the pulley and shaft out of the housing and the snap ring resides in the bottom of the housing. The shafts push out through the bottom after the pulleys are removed. The snap ring need to be removed to replace the lower bearing. The top bearing should drive straight out of the top after the shaft is removed. This should be the stack up of you original deck parts, the odd spindle is an older model but will work fine. 

Edited November 17, 2020 by JoeM

[Charbs152 254]

29 minutes ago, JoeM said:

You have to remove the pulley and shaft out of the housing and the snap ring resides in the bottom of the housing. The shafts push out through the bottom after the pulleys are removed. The snap ring need to be removed to replace the lower bearing. The top bearing should drive straight out of the top after the shaft is removed. This should be the stack up of you original deck parts, the odd spindle is an older model but will work fine. 

 

Awesome!  I have all the pulleys off.  So if i put the spindle in a vise i should be able to drive the spindle shaft down and out the bottom?  The only thing that holds the shaft in the housing is the pulley?

[JoeM 7,871]

4 minutes ago, Charbs152 said:

The only thing that holds the shaft in the housing is the pulley?

And nut. Caution on driving it out. If the shaft hangs up on the bearing or tube, it can break the snap ring area out of the bottom of the housing, Light taps and work it up and down if it is tight. use a block of wood on the top with the nut reinstalled flush with the top of the shaft to start.

[Charbs152 254]

53 minutes ago, JoeM said:

And nut. Caution on driving it out. If the shaft hangs up on the bearing or tube, it can break the snap ring area out of the bottom of the housing, Light taps and work it up and down if it is tight. use a block of wood on the top with the nut reinstalled flush with the top of the shaft to start.

Awesome, thanks for the tips!  I will give it a go once i get some free time!

 

I am still debating on if i want to keep the bearings fully sealed or remove the inner grease seals and have greasable bearings...thoughts?  i am leaning towards greasable...

[JoeM 7,871]

11 minutes ago, Charbs152 said:

fully sealed or remove the inner grease seals and have greasable bearings

I have sealed ones running now for a couple years. There are a lot of different opinions on that subject. I will say the mule drive bearings are sealed and last a long time. If you like to grease take the seals out, if not leave them in. 

[peter lena 8,583]

charbs 152, interesting read, my experience is that yes that pto mule drive can be rebuilt ,  having the same 6203- 3/4" bearings as  your deck spindles , finding regular increasing noise and failure , due to generic grease when new, those bearings get very hot , popped seals and went to lucas hi temp grease , 550 + temp rating , means no noise or bearing failure . done a few decks , and its the detailing of lubrication building and looking at fit issues that really make the decks work with ease. do not be afraid to improve on things , a tear down is the opportunity to correct them , pete   

[DennisThornton 4,769]

You mentioned a flap wheel, great tool but not for pitted rust.  Wire brush, blast or chemicals.  Shame to have rust come back after all the effort to paint.  And use a great primer meant for rust.  Rustoleum 769 has been around a log time and is the best I've used. 

[Charbs152 254]

23 minutes ago, peter lena said:

charbs 152, interesting read, my experience is that yes that pto mule drive can be rebuilt ,  having the same 6203- 3/4" bearings as  your deck spindles , finding regular increasing noise and failure , due to generic grease when new, those bearings get very hot , popped seals and went to lucas hi temp grease , 550 + temp rating , means no noise or bearing failure . done a few decks , and its the detailing of lubrication building and looking at fit issues that really make the decks work with ease. do not be afraid to improve on things , a tear down is the opportunity to correct them , pete   

Sorry for the silly questions.

 

did you reseal the bearings after you put t he tacky grease in them or are you talking about running with the inner seals removed and using the grease zerks?

 

For the mule drive (i dont have it in front of me at the moment) its just two pulleys right?  I didn't think there were any other bearings besides whats part of the pulley.  parts diagram just shows a couple spacers

 

Thanks

[Charbs152 254]

7 minutes ago, DennisThornton said:

You mentioned a flap wheel, great tool but not for pitted rust.  Wire brush, blast or chemicals.  Shame to have rust come back after all the effort to paint.  And use a great primer meant for rust.  Rustoleum 769 has been around a log time and is the best I've used. 

I am going to use a rust primer...why wont the flap wheel help it? i got down to bare metal on the top of the deck...  it seems to work better than the wire brush i got for my grinder....  i dont have access to a blaster....what chemicals do you suggest?  i want to do it right.

 

edit - i already have a can of "rusty metal primer" and "rust reformer" by rustoleum

Edited November 17, 2020 by Charbs152

[Goldnboy 910]

Every 3/4" keyed spindle shaft that I have come across with the big nut (2" I believe) has come loose from the shaft and spins. Maybe  this is why they changed the design to the nut using a 1 1/8" wrench? Anyway  I have had great success  using a 3" cutoff wheel and or sawzall  at cutting the nut off the shaft completely (and trying  to avoid damaging  threads in the process) then using a 3/4" NF die to tap the threads on the shaft down to where the nut was and replace with a new jam nut (apply blue locktite to threads).

[pacer 3,168]

You've already got a pile of good info so all I'll add it that I converted to leaving the bearings sealed some time ago The idea of packing  about a whole tube of grease into the cavity and still not being totally confident that the correct amount got to the bearings ...... well that just didnt set well with me. What cinched it was when I got an older Yard Man tractor and found they were using the bearings sealed and I ran that deck without bearing failure for a loooong time.

[Charbs152 254]

25 minutes ago, Goldnboy said:

Every 3/4" keyed spindle shaft that I have come across with the big nut (2" I believe) has come loose from the shaft and spins. Maybe  this is why they changed the design to the nut using a 1 1/8" wrench? Anyway  I have had great success  using a 3" cutoff wheel and or sawzall  at cutting the nut off the shaft completely (and trying  to avoid damaging  threads in the process) then using a 3/4" NF die to tap the threads on the shaft down to where the nut was and replace with a new jam nut (apply blue locktite to threads).

What is the purpose of the giant nut?

[DennisThornton 4,769]

1 hour ago, Charbs152 said:

I am going to use a rust primer...why wont the flap wheel help it? i got down to bare metal on the top of the deck...  it seems to work better than the wire brush i got for my grinder....  i dont have access to a blaster....what chemicals do you suggest?  i want to do it right.

 

edit - i already have a can of "rusty metal primer" and "rust reformer" by rustoleum

Sand paper can't reach down into pits and even wire brushes struggle so attack from all directions.  Remove as much as you can and then a wet coat of Rustoleum 769 in a warm area.  I'd skip chemicals for now including the Reformer IF you can remove almost all the rust.  Consider a sand blaster, even the little self contained hand held.  The bigger the compressor and tank the longer you can blast but you'll be impressed with even a minute of blasting used on an otherwise impossible spot. 

[Charbs152 254]

26 minutes ago, pacer said:

You've already got a pile of good info so all I'll add it that I converted to leaving the bearings sealed some time ago The idea of packing  about a whole tube of grease into the cavity and still not being totally confident that the correct amount got to the bearings ...... well that just didnt set well with me. What cinched it was when I got an older Yard Man tractor and found they were using the bearings sealed and I ran that deck without bearing failure for a loooong time.

good point...is it possible to remove grease seal on the bearing and pack it with good grease and put the seal back?

[Charbs152 254]

1 minute ago, DennisThornton said:

Sand paper can't reach down into pits and even wire brushes struggle so attack from all directions.  Remove as much as you can and then a wet coat of Rustoleum 769 in a warm area.  I'd skip chemicals for now including the Reformer IF you can remove almost all the rust.  Consider a sand blaster, even the little self contained hand held.  The bigger the compressor and tank the longer you can blast but you'll be impressed with even a minute of blasting used on an otherwise impossible spot. 

Not a bad idea at all. i just dont want to shell out the cash for a blaster and media right now.  I think i can get it pretty good with a grinder and an array of different discs.  Great advice though, i appreciate it!

[dalez 137]

11 hours ago, Charbs152 said:

AM I CRAZY OR IS MY CENTER PULLEY INSTALLED UPSIDE DOWN?

If the blades are all the same size then the belt should be on the same size pulley which is the bottom one. It may not go on upside down without rubbing or sticking out above the shaft.

[Charbs152 254]

2 minutes ago, dalez said:

If the blades are all the same size then the belt should be on the same size pulley which is the bottom one. It may not go on upside down without rubbing or sticking out above the shaft.

interesting, because the part diagram shows the small pulley on the bottom

[peter lena 8,583]

charbs,  no silly questions , on the spindle bearings , after removing seals and ensuring hi temp grease in them , replace the top  seal and leave the lower seal out , on bottom bearing , reverse that   , then add grease to chamber , to be greased with zerk fitting.  on the pto drive, they are the same bearings , some of them can be repacked with a seal removal , some of them can,t . i was able to repack mine , here is a similar picture  of the seal type on an idler pulley , if your seals are like this , its easy , https://www.amazon.com/dp/B087LRYXWB/ref=sspa_dk_detail_2?psc=1&pd_rd_i=B087LRYXWB&pd_rd_w=sxWIk&pf_rd_p=7d37a48b-2b1a-4373-8c1a-bdcc5da66be9&pd_rd_wg=aacpC&pf_rd_r=7K9YMKQX4F1R65AZDXSF&pd_rd_r=17964c8d-3817-49f2-a99e-12ebdd6194f8&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUExRVY1MlFNQ0szR09RJmVuY3J5cHRlZElkPUEwMjk4ODk5MTI2VjFVQUhaQlU2NiZlbmNyeXB0ZWRBZElkPUEwNjIyMjk0QUlJS09MR0YzR1hPJndpZGdldE5hbWU9c3BfZGV0YWlsJmFjdGlvbj1jbGlja1JlZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==, since doing this , i have no bearing noise or failure , let me know , pete

[Goldnboy 910]

1 hour ago, Charbs152 said:

What is the purpose of the giant nut?

To hold the spindle  while  tightening the blade nut.

[DennisThornton 4,769]

1 hour ago, Charbs152 said:

Not a bad idea at all. i just dont want to shell out the cash for a blaster and media right now.  I think i can get it pretty good with a grinder and an array of different discs.  Great advice though, i appreciate it!

Then dig as deeply as possible and Rustoleum 769 around 70F.  Won't soak into the rust pits if cold.  When you're ready the cheap HF blaster works OK just don't expect to blast a rusty wheel with a pancake blaster non-stop.  Save the blaster for the spots you can't get to otherwise. 

[Charbs152 254]

1 hour ago, peter lena said:

charbs,  no silly questions , on the spindle bearings , after removing seals and ensuring hi temp grease in them , replace the top  seal and leave the lower seal out , on bottom bearing , reverse that   , then add grease to chamber , to be greased with zerk fitting.  on the pto drive, they are the same bearings , some of them can be repacked with a seal removal , some of them can,t . i was able to repack mine , here is a similar picture  of the seal type on an idler pulley , if your seals are like this , its easy , https://www.amazon.com/dp/B087LRYXWB/ref=sspa_dk_detail_2?psc=1&pd_rd_i=B087LRYXWB&pd_rd_w=sxWIk&pf_rd_p=7d37a48b-2b1a-4373-8c1a-bdcc5da66be9&pd_rd_wg=aacpC&pf_rd_r=7K9YMKQX4F1R65AZDXSF&pd_rd_r=17964c8d-3817-49f2-a99e-12ebdd6194f8&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUExRVY1MlFNQ0szR09RJmVuY3J5cHRlZElkPUEwMjk4ODk5MTI2VjFVQUhaQlU2NiZlbmNyeXB0ZWRBZElkPUEwNjIyMjk0QUlJS09MR0YzR1hPJndpZGdldE5hbWU9c3BfZGV0YWlsJmFjdGlvbj1jbGlja1JlZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==, since doing this , i have no bearing noise or failure , let me know , pete

So mule drive pulley bearings are the same as the spindles... interesting.  i guess i will need to order 2 more

[Charbs152 254]

1 hour ago, DennisThornton said:

Then dig as deeply as possible and Rustoleum 769 around 70F.  Won't soak into the rust pits if cold.  When you're ready the cheap HF blaster works OK just don't expect to blast a rusty wheel with a pancake blaster non-stop.  Save the blaster for the spots you can't get to otherwise. 

 i plan on painting it in my basement.  should be warm enough down there

[Charbs152 254]

1 hour ago, Goldnboy said:

To hold the spindle  while  tightening the blade nut.

Thats what i was using it for lol..i just wasnt sure if it had another purpose since it seemed overly big and needing a pipe wrench to change the blades didnt seem right but i guess it is.