1962 wheel horse 502 predator swap

[ebinmaine 67,592]

15 minutes ago, APG2 said:

I know it's not the carb. It's getting fuel, ran perfect. Literally ran great, shut it off to let it cool down before I park it in the garage and wouldn't refire. Spark seemed weak, replaced points, condenser, coil and wire plug, battery. Always burned a little oil not bad though. No change in spark, unless I got a new bad condenser, plug, or coil, won't even take off on ether. Combustion chamber wasn't carboned up at all. Pretty much one of those throw in the towel frustrated things

 

Definitely understand the frustrations but I'd lean towards the engine NOT being the actual issue. 

Luckily the older models had little or no safety switch system. That makes the schematic diagrams simple to run through. 

 

My inclination is to advise you to start a new thread explaining the situation in entirety the best you can and let the Awesomeness of Redsquare help you run step by step to a solution while you learn how to repair it. 

 

Maybe the engine is bad. Maybe it's a bad component. Maybe it's even a bad connection somewhere. 

 

Take some pictures. Start a thread. Let's get it figured out....

[Pullstart 62,905]

 @APG2!  I’d start with a voltmeter.  If and when it refuses to start, check for power at the coil posts with the key on.  That might tell a lot!  Hard to say parts are bad without troubleshooting...  @953 nut always says before anything, always have the battery load tested, even if it is new.  I’d also confirm all grounds and electrical connections are clean and intact as well!

[Pullstart 62,905]

I agree with EB though.  A GX swap would be rather backwards as far as progress goes.  If you do decide to junk the engine, I’d be glad to re-home it for you!

[APG2 5]

On 11/21/2020 at 7:45 AM, 953 nut said:

If you intend to use a PTO you probably need to look for a Kohler unless you plan to use an electric PTO. The force exerted on the end of the crankshaft would hurt an engine without thrust bearings.

Just saw the reply. Where's the thrust bearing on a K181?

[Pullstart 62,905]

17 hours ago, APG2 said:

Just saw the reply. Where's the thrust bearing on a K181?

It’s part of the crank bearing design, being a ball type roller bearing on both sides.

[APG2 5]

55 minutes ago, pullstart said:

It’s part of the crank bearing design, being a ball type roller bearing on both sides.

So I guess I'm not understanding the talk of not being able to use the manual PTO on an engine swap because of the bearings. If a Honda GX240/270 for example has 6206 main crank bearings, and a kohler k181 has  6206c3 for crankshaft bearings, there's absolutely no reason Kohler is able to take axial crankshaft load any better than anything else. A C3 bearing is the ball size for slop, has nothing to do with ability to take load, they're both deep groove bearings made to be able to take axial load.

[Pullstart 62,905]

24 minutes ago, APG2 said:

So I guess I'm not understanding the talk of not being able to use the manual PTO on an engine swap because of the bearings. If a Honda GX240/270 for example has 6206 main crank bearings, and a kohler k181 has  6206c3 for crankshaft bearings, there's absolutely no reason Kohler is able to take axial crankshaft load any better than anything else. A C3 bearing is the ball size for slop, has nothing to do with ability to take load, they're both deep groove bearings made to be able to take axial load.

Feel free to prove the theory wrong... but that’s what we’re told.  

[ebinmaine 67,592]

49 minutes ago, APG2 said:

A C3 bearing is the ball size for slop

Did you define that a little better please? What do you mean by slop?

[APG2 5]

1 hour ago, ebinmaine said:

Did you define that a little better please? What do you mean by slop?

Internal radial clearance in the grooves

[ebinmaine 67,592]

3 minutes ago, APG2 said:

Internal radial clearance in the grooves

 

Ok gotcha....

 

So how does the Honda bearing differ from the Kohler bearing?

[APG2 5]

3 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

 

Ok gotcha....

 

So how does the Honda bearing differ from the Kohler bearing?

Apparently the Honda is only listed as a 6206, for normal clearance. Kohler has the extra c3, which is more internal clearance than a standard 6206. I can't find any additional info other than those are the 2 standard numbers Ive consistently seen

Edited December 2, 2020 by APG2

[ebinmaine 67,592]

36 minutes ago, APG2 said:

Apparently the Honda is only listed as a 6206, for normal clearance. Kohler has the extra c3, which is more internal clearance than a standard 6206. I can't find any additional info other than those are the 2 standard numbers Ive consistently seen

 

It's been 20 plus years since I've messed with bearings and seals as a career or engines as a hobby.

Makes me wonder if the extra clearance speced out by Kohler engines would make a difference such as having flexibility on the side load.

I do remember that bearings with suffixes and prefixes that are different could easily be night and day in real world usage so even though it's the same main number they aren't necessarily interchangeable in task ability. 

 

[Maxwell-8 4,277]

On 12/2/2020 at 4:58 PM, ebinmaine said:

So how does the Honda bearing differ from the Kohler bearing?

The Kohler bearing can handle the heat and thus expansion better

But what I can find is the K181 is using bearing 231625-S and not 6206c3. 

 

[APG2 5]

4 hours ago, Maxwell-8 said:

The Kohler bearing can handle the heat and thus expansion better

But what I can find is the K181 is using bearing 231625-S and not 6206c3. 

 

What you found was the Kohler part number, 6206c3 is a Timken part number