The Blue Falcon—a dune buggy thread!

[PeacemakerJack 10,738]

As I mentioned earlier today, I bought a used but well cared for Carter dune buggy powered by a Chinese made GY6 150cc single cylinder engine.  

 

It is air cooled with a CVT tranny.  It has forward and reverse and a top speed of about 40mph.  It is a super fun little cart to run around on and weighs about 400#.  I bought it for Caleb in the summer of 2016.  He drove it into the fall and early spring of 2017.  It started and ran great until one day in early May when it just decided it wasn’t going to start anymore...

I played with it for about two months off and on but couldn’t get it to fire.  It’s almost like the mag kill was grounded out...if any of you guys have experience with these, I’d appreciate the insight.  I’m gonna Scout around and see if I can snag some info on YouTube because if I don’t get this going soon...there just might be a coup at the Stertz house

[Achto 27,506]

It looks like that engine uses a CDI ignition. Here is one place that has a lot of parts for those engines as well as other parts for those buggy's.

 

https://www.extrememotorsales.com/xcart/Parts/go-cart-kart-parts/adult-go-cart-150cc-200cc-parts/electrical-parts/

 

If worse comes to worse would you be able to put a 212 Predator in it??

[PeacemakerJack 10,738]

Not sure on a swap Dan based on the tight space requirements of that cage on the back—however if that is what it takes to get this thing up, running, and reliable for the kids—I’m willing to do it.  

 

Thanks for the link, I’ll check it out

[Tractorhead 9,064]

This Engines are also similar on several cheaper Quad bikes.

Mostly there the CDI dies, but that‘s a cheap replacement.

Test allway’s with a fully charged Battery.

 

just see one, where the Pickup for the cdi aside the Flywheelpoint was loosened from the rattling Engine.

gap should be somewhat of about 0,3-0,4mm from the Flywheel.

But this Pickups are also cheap available, but as allready told mostly not the pickup died.

 

to check it out you can use a meter in mV setting and rev the Engine.

put the meter on the CDI connevtor between the Pickup coil in Ac setting.

best will be a scale meter,  if the Scale wobbles while rev and no spark occurs, the Pickup is worse.

Otherwise the CDI gives up.

if you get a spark on revvning, Use a flashgun, so you can verify the Timing.

Maybe the keeway is broken and flywheel so dejusted.

 

On most flywheeld i know is a point, that marks the ignition timing to check.

 

If no spark occurs, it‘s in 90% the CDI itself.

cheap chinese replace and you are good to go.

 

shall be somwhere about 15-20$

[Pullstart 62,799]

Josh, I’m there with the others.  Try a CDI box... they are cheap enough and are quite prone to failure.

[Lee1977 6,647]

Modify it for the 212 Predator and save yourself a lot of trouble.   

[WHNJ701 4,165]

we got one of those knock off tao tao chinese atv's for free.  it's basically an imitation honda quad, anyway the ignition cdi wouldn't start, but I got it to fire by jumping the selonoid, I ran 2 heavy gauge wires to push button, it's been that way for I guess 4 years now

[PeacemakerJack 10,738]

Thanks for the thoughts guys. I dug out some manuals for the buggy and have begun to pour over those.  I told the kids that we need to finish getting Comanche back together before we start another mechanical project, especially one that could get “a little messy” before it gets better.  As I looked over my notes from a couple of years ago, it dawned on me that I was looking for that quick and easy fix instead of troubleshooting the problem.  In the end I changed a handful of parts and got discouraged.  This caused me to focus on other stuff in life and the buggy got stuck in my uncle’s barn—sound like some of the horses that have been brought back to life on this forum by someone who cared!  

 

One way or another we are gonna get the Blue Falcon up and running for the kiddos again👍🏻  I’ll keep you posted as we do.  Thanks again for all the insight...

[PeacemakerJack 10,738]

Now that Comanche is back up and running with the IronMan genny engine, Judge reminded me that I had promised him we would get working on the blue Falcon.  So, this evening I left Caleb working on a home made bench project for his mother and we went to pick up the buggy.

 

It was buried in my uncles barn with three years of dust/dirt on it but otherwise not to much worse for the wear.

We loaded it on the trailer and brought it back home.  I told the boys that it needed to be cleaned up first before we start the troubleshooting process. 

Judge said, “How can something that looks so good, not run?”  Good question son...hopefully we can get to the bottom of it soon and have this machine back up and going.  I am excited to get working on Blackbeard with Caleb.

[Pullstart 62,799]

Awesome update Josh!  Judge didn’t waste any time getting you on the buggy, did he?

[Tractorhead 9,064]

Nice project.

 

Is it a 150ccm automatic tranny Engine?

 

I think i know that Engine types.

simply to bring it to run, but urgently needs regular Oil Services.

 

[WHX?? 48,788]

[PeacemakerJack 10,738]

On 6/9/2020 at 12:09 PM, Tractorhead said:

Nice project.

 

Is it a 150ccm automatic tranny Engine?

 

That is correct!  It is a CVT tranny similar to our snow mobiles over here.  I was doing some research and it looks like this particular engine is good for about 10hp stock. If we can get it running good, I might just do a few performance modifications to it over the winter if the kids want to.  They have a 180cc big bore kit that is pretty inexpensive along with some tranny, carb, and exhaust upgrades.

 

Right now, I just need to get it running so that the kiddos can enjoy it😉😁

[rmaynard 15,428]

Wow. How did I not see this thread? My grandson has a Fox Carbide Reverse with 150cc GY6 engine. Spent the better part of 2 weeks diagnosing and fixing a no-spark issue. Bought a new CDI only to find out that I was sent an AC version and his is DC. After getting it running again, we rebuilt the carburetor and the CVT. There isn't much I don't know about this go-kart now.

Edited June 17, 2020 by rmaynard

[Tractorhead 9,064]

If ignition works, exchange the suicidal Suction carb. with too weak performance, on them often the diaphragma rips.

I would use instead a minkuni flat aftermarket Carb with accelerator pump. Cost about 40-60$ in the *bay

That is a huge step in performance and no significant changes in the Engine itself.

Oversize bore will be another step later on.

 

Carb changes give you more performance against oversize with that sleeptime carb.

there are dimensions between them both in performance and agility.

Also check the Exhaust, some have on the exhaust manifold welded reducers.

 

If you plan to speed it more up, the Engine site on the CVT there is a little spacer between both plates.

if you able to use a lathe, shorten that spacer between in the CVT Clutch about 2-3mm, so that the Belt runs on highest setup,

that will increase the speed to about 5-20 Km/h depending on second Gear ratio.

 

😎

 

[PeacemakerJack 10,738]

7 minutes ago, rmaynard said:

My grandson has a Fox Carbide Reverse with 150cc GY6 engine...After getting it running again, we rebuilt the carburetor and the CVT. There isn't much I don't know about this go-kart now...

 

Awesome!!! I will likely need some insight as we tear into this thing next week...I’m encouraged that you have been into it and know the machine well!  Thanks for chiming in👍🏻

[WHX?? 48,788]

Question tho Bob why is the old man on the ground getting dirty and the kid getting seat time? 

[Tractorhead 9,064]

Edit the CDI‘s are mostly the parts they give up first.

I would exchange it with a programmable high performance CDI.

 

As suggestion https://ignitech.cz/en/

 

They are real Bad ass,

may be you have a dealer in USA or an US pedant similar.

 

I use this on my Quadbikes and even on my Badass Duke.

Basic setup is given for Quickstart.

 

[rmaynard 15,428]

1 hour ago, WHX24 said:

Question tho Bob why is the old man on the ground getting dirty and the kid getting seat time? 

Once I'm down there, I don't get up again until the job is done. Too danged difficult. The young man sitting in the seat spent his hard earned lawn cutting money to buy this thing, and he had just heard it run for the first time since he'd bought it. Don't worry, his hands had been dirty too. They were clean there because he had just cleaned the pool. If you notice, coincidently we were all wearing Wheel Horse shirts that day.

[Tractorhead 9,064]

That means in other Words hard earned.

 

Respect!

 

[PeacemakerJack 10,738]

After the wrangle this morning all the way to north Iowa to pick up the FEL for the 523D, I got home determined to start working on the Falcon now that we had the parts in hand. 

 

We removed the passenger side of the motor covers to replace the stator and pickup.  The carb that was on the machine was completely varnished up from sitting for 3 years and so I elected to spend the $30 for a replacement carb and we installed that with all new fuel line, filter, and petcock.  Caleb was at a graduation party today and so it was the little guys and I.  They got plenty of wrench time, especially Judge since he is the one who really wants to get this thing going.  Next up we need to check timing, valve lash adjustment, and change fluids.  

Hopefully it will work for us...if not, we keep troubleshooting until it does.  We are searching for spark at this point and it seemed like there was an issue with the stator based on some multimeter testing...

[Tractorhead 9,064]

Great to see the Boy‘s wrenching.

👍

 

[PeacemakerJack 10,738]

So...we continued our pursuit of a running machine today. After installing the new stator, we did some testing and found out that the older stator indeed was bad.

The excitor coil circuit was broken somewhere which is the circuit that actually powers the CDI.  We checked and now we had continuity from the stator to the CDI, we checked the valve lash next.  As we had read up on it, the valves were tight.  Couldn’t get a feeler gauge in and they needed to be set to about .004”. 

Since Judge was the one who really wanted to get this thing working and he is the one who has done the least mechanical work with me over the last couple of years, I got him into the thick of it!

He pulled the valve cover and I showed he how to loosen the jamb nuts and adjust the valve lash.  It was so fun to see him working hard on the machine and getting his hands dirty.

 After that was set and reassembled, we tried to see if we had spark...

 

NOTHING.

 

So, back to the old drawing board.  Thankfully I had a new replacement CDI.  After trying several other wiring related things, I pulled out the diagram and studied it carefully.  It reaffirmed the fact that pretty much everything was dependent on that CDI.  We changed it out and HAD SPARK!  At this point, with a dry fuel system, we had to crank it awhile before it turned over.  However...it started!!!  As it had been sitting for three plus years, we drained the oil, cleaned the filter screen, refilled the oil, and started it again.  This time I had caleb drive it with Zach in the right seat.  Then it was Judges turn.  It still needs some adjustment since it stalls out above half throttle.  Not sure if the carb needs adjustment or what but we have a running buggy!!!

 

Caleb will Be posting a video later!

[Coulter Caleb 532]

 

Even though the carburetor wasn't working quite right it still brought so many memories and it was so fun

It was great to bring it out again after 2 years of sitting in a barn!! Thank you dad @PeacemakerJack and my bros for helping make this whole project possible, love them all

[Pullstart 62,799]

Awesome job, boys!  You’ve got a great teacher to help you learn!  The pictures and videos will be a great way to preserve the memories, as you know!