701 push button starter switch failed

[pfrederi 17,663]

12 minutes ago, Achto said:

 

This must have involved a special solenoid. I'm not familiar with any newer solenoid coil functioning that way.

 

12 minutes ago, Achto said:

 

This must have involved a special solenoid. I'm not familiar with any newer solenoid coil functioning that way.

 

 

Knowing WH maybe that got a good deal on that style.

 

Still make them used by Western on their plows...

 

 

Edited April 29, 2020 by pfrederi

[squonk 41,021]

There are about 50 different solenoids made. Depending on how they are grounded, type of contacts, duty cycle ect. I have an Echlin book that would keep Jim entertained for hours.  I used to sell those “snowplow “ solenoids all the time 

[Lane Ranger 10,945]

14 hours ago, pfrederi said:

Read back through this   Why did you replace the solenoid you talked about switches but I didn't see solenoid.  Do you have the old one? Test it?? Richard may be on to something.

 

 

Paul  The original solenoid  was long gone.   My understanding is the original 701  (and as Richard says the 550 and 551 also)  had a solenoid that was  what I would call a negative ground one that when the push button switch would be pressed it became grounded.    Dan's rewiring suggestion is proably the way to best wire a positive grounded solenoid   -like the one I bought.

 

 

As the package on the solenoid says it is chassis grounded  -so grounded upon placing it on the wheel horse frame metal.

 

 

 

Edited April 29, 2020 by Lane Ranger

[pfrederi 17,663]

Or for 9 bucks by the original type.. either way could work...

[Lane Ranger 10,945]

13 hours ago, Achto said:

@Lane Ranger Looking at the wire diagram I think that it is wrong, or at least it won't work with the solenoid that you have. I have never seen a solenoid wired the way it is on the diagram.

Here is the fix - Run a hot "+" wire to one side of the start button, run a wire from the other side of the start button to the small post on the solenoid. The body of the solenoid will serve as your ground for the coil in the solenoid. Connect a large "10ga at least" wire from the battery to one of the large terminals on the solenoid. Connect a large wire from the other large term on the solenoid to the starter gen "+" terminal.

 

Your start system should work with the above set up.

 

 

Dan:  When you say attach the the second large terminal on the solenoid to the + positive terminal on the starter/generator exactly which one?   

 

 I thought they are all positive on the S/G  as it is grounded by the housing and bolts to the frame.   

 

Are you talking about the A or F post on the S/G  or the ACC positive on the regulator?

 

 

[squonk 41,021]

I like the starter button grounding the solenoid. All the juice stays at the solenoid where it belongs 

[Achto 27,502]

17 minutes ago, Lane Ranger said:

Are you talking about the A or F post on the S/G  or the ACC positive on the regulator

 

Sorry Lane I should have said A terminal. I always consider A "armature" as + and F "field" as -. When dealing with a Neg ground system.

[Lane Ranger 10,945]

I thought it was A but wanted to make sure.  

So the only real changes in wiring on a  Grounded Solenoid is one wire to Positive + Battery post wire to the Push Button Starter switch, 

 

Plus a heavier  10 gauge or so wire from Positive Battery Terminal  to one of the Big Posts on the Solenoid.

 

 

Or  do like Paul indicated and buy a new  snowplow type solenoid which duplicated the basic function of the original 701. 550 and 551 solenoid used in those wiring systems.

 

 

Edited April 29, 2020 by Lane Ranger

[WHX?? 48,775]

2 hours ago, Lane Ranger said:

Or  do like Paul indicated and buy a new  snowplow type solenoid which duplicated the basic function of the original 701. 550 and 551 solenoid used in those wiring systems.

The stay original guys in MN would prefer that!

Mike's got a good point about keeping the juice at the  solenoid. 

[Lane Ranger 10,945]

The 701 was back at it today!  Finally, running with vigor again! Carrying a cut up walnut tree to my neighbor for winter 🔥 wood!

[WHX?? 48,775]

Crap. .. ther goes my 701 right out the window! ... oh well guess I'll just have to get seat time on Dan's!  

What did you settle on for the wiring/solenoid Lane?

Edited April 30, 2020 by WHX24

[Lane Ranger 10,945]

The one I had but I may order the correct one Jim!