PTO kills engine, seat safety switch ok

[Armin Buehlmann 2]

Hi,

I read through a few related posts but my symptoms sound different.

Have an '89-'90? Wheelhorse 520-H,  model 4120OE01.

When I engage the PTO, the engine stalls. No fault indicators.

However, everything else seems normal:

- all lights work when pressing 'TEST'

- when I engage the PTO without sitting on the seat, the engine also stalls, but the 'SEAT' light comes on. Normal.

- when I try to start the engine with the PTO engaged, it won't start and 'PTO' lights up. Normal.

- after disconnecting the load (2-stage snow blower belt in this case) from the PTO, I get the same problem, engine stalls immediately. PTO pulley turns along fine with the remaining motion.

 

And I also need to mention: the first time it happened it was intermittent. The tractor and snowblower attachment were used over a month ago, without any problem.This time got above symptom upon startup. I didn't feel like shoveling so after revving the engine for a minute or two and a few 'encouraging' words, it worked.  I switched the PTO off and on several times afterwards with no problem (engine warm, obviously). Today, with the engine cold, the problem is back.

 

I think there's enough reason to rule out the PTO- and seat- switches. But what else should I check? 

This is my first time writing in the forum and I hope I've given enough clues without boring you.

Any hints and advice are appreciated.

Armin

 

PS any good tricks to counteract the belt tensioner on the 2-stage snow thrower (model 79361)? It is a bear to connect and disconnect.

 

[gwest_ca-(File Mod) 11,102]

These diagrams should help you solve the problem.

Check the 9-pin connector between the tractor wiring and the engine wiring. Look for a darkened plastic connector from overheating and if so the wiring is corroded. The wire connectors could also be corroded without showing signs of overheating.

 

The seat switch has two positions. One powers the idiot light and the other powers the ignition circuit. It is possible for only the ignition side to fail and not power the ignition. A test light or voltmeter would determine the condition.

Keep us posted on your progress.

 

Garry

[953 nut 55,860]

Your PTO switch serves two functions, Half of the switch is tied into the "START" circuitry and the other half is in the  "IGNITION" flow path. If one of the wiring connections to the PTO switch is loose or corroded it could be the problem.        Also, many newer wiring harnesses use relays to kill the ignition. They are located below the battery and the connections are subject to corrosion due to fumes from the battery. 

Edited January 21, 2020 by 953 nut

[Armin Buehlmann 2]

On 1/20/2020 at 6:04 PM, gwest_ca said:

These diagrams should help you solve the problem

........

Thank you Garry,

very prompt, informative and encouraging to keep looking.

It is back up and running but as it was as sporadic problem, I'm not yet sure of the root cause. It's all about knowing about the double switch functions, and studying the wiring diagram.

Bought a test light, found no weak connections and wound up replacing 2 switches. If the issue comes back I'd replace the lower of the two orange wires (seat switch to 9-pin). I'll post again after extended use.

Some forum experience that might help other first-time users:

I only looked at the email, got encouraged about the additional information, and dug up my own wiring diagram. Spent quite some time just to figure out which switch is which, as they are unlabeled, just as on the one provided on the email. Only to see today that the forum post contains more detail. Lesson learned: read the forum replies

 

[Armin Buehlmann 2]

On 1/21/2020 at 6:32 AM, 953 nut said:

Your PTO switch serves two functions, ....

Thank you Richard, 

yes it is important to know that the magic happens in multiple three-way switches, and the PTO lever activates two. Actually de-activates, because turning on the PTO releases them into their neutral position.

Armin

[Armin Buehlmann 2]

Hi, 

apologies for the long delay in closing this, but as you all know, times got weird.
Yes, it was the PTO switch. After replacing it, we had no more snow but all was well throughout the mowing season. After a long time on the workbench, the switch did occasionally fail to connect - 

Case Closed. Thanks again for all the help.