Plumbing & Heating

[WHX?? 48,821]

1 hour ago, JCM said:

 Nice that the way I set it up no more bleeding the air out of 28 radiators. @WHX??

The big old skool standing cast iron ones Plunge? We do basement purge valves on baseboard but I would have no idea how to do it on radiators. The radiators would have to be piped top bottom and that's rare to find. Even then ther would be an air pocket on top. An old converted steam system maybe? 

Edited December 13, 2021 by WHX??
Fat Fingers

[JCM 9,168]

These radiators are piped bottom taps both sides and the sizes vary. I do have some with individual valves but not all because of no access without opening up the floors when the need arises, try to stay away from that but have done a bunch of them when remodeling bathrooms and dressing rooms. Super nice well maintained property with 25 acres.

[WHX?? 48,821]

So how do you get the air out without opening coin vents that are gonna leak? We cheated on a couple jobs with beaucu by plugging off the 30 pound  relief valve and jacking the pressure to 50 lbs. Radiators filled much faster but remember to put the relief valve back on before firing. 

[JCM 9,168]

Hahahahaha, I send the caretaker up to vent the radiators, only thing is I tell him don't unscrew that vent out to far because you know what happens, then he says here , you better do it. Those things are a pain in the neck, to put it politely. Short story, many years ago went to replace a coin vent and as I backed it out I heard a crack, you guessed it cracked the radiator and had to pay for a new one and install it for N/C. Cost me 600 clams for the iron plus a days labor and helper to replace it. Nice Huh. Of course it was on the second floor to boot.

[WHX?? 48,821]

I feel for ya Plunge ....busted one off once and had water flying everywhere and you know what that old black water in radiators is like. Ended up having to drill it out, re-tap to 1/4 npt. Hours shot in the rear on a bid job! 

[JCM 9,168]

The start of another project. The Cast iron oil fired boiler and 80 gallon indirect will remain for now. Changing from zone valves to circulator pumps on this 6 zone system. Trying to work around all the existing piping and wiring has been quite a challenge on this job between the Plumbing & Heating. This is in a 2 Family dwelling with the first floor vacant and a tenant on the 2 nd floor. Usually all the related piping for both would have been removed first, but because of the tenant and time of year and basically doing this alone it has been difficult. Hydronic baseboard heat was the first to get replaced now this and hopefully after the Electricians do the wiring it will be a long day to get it all operating before I can leave.

Edited January 3, 2022 by JCM

[formariz 11,987]

 

Beautiful neat work there. Makes something that most times no one appreciates something enjoyable to look at and proud to have in one’s house. Not your everyday workmanship any more sadly.

[JCM 9,168]

 In April I posted a picture of the Viessmann Cast iron block in the basement of another customer and have a few more pictures here. This is before wiring and burner install. Still more piping in the basement to do , but up and running well. These manifolds were 2'' copper with 1 1/4 '' branches which supply and return the 80 gallon indirect H/ W tank and 28 cast iron radiators. Will save the rest for a nice mid-winter job .

[Handy Don 12,232]

On 1/1/2022 at 2:46 PM, JCM said:

These manifolds were 2'' copper with 1 1/4 '' branches

Yikes, materials on that job must have been a fortune!

Will that piping get insulated or is it the source of heat for the basement?

[Jeff-C175 7,202]

@JCM

 

Hot water recirc?  Or ??

 

 

How many of these have you installed that have NOT leaked?

 

 

 

[JCM 9,168]

@Handy Don  Nothing is insulated in that basement. Yes it does help the basement stay comfortable. And yes, the material was a fortune. @Jeff-C175  yes, that is a recirc line.    I have had very good luck with Watts water feeder/ back flow preventers and since 1976 probably installed in the hundreds.

[Jeff-C175 7,202]

1 hour ago, JCM said:

installed in the hundreds

 

I'm probably only in the tens, but it seems that 1 in 4 or 5 leaks from around the diaphragm.  Eventually they seal themselves, but still, they should not be leaking at all!  

 

 

[squonk 41,124]

I never  one of those feeders / regulators leak. I've had them plug up or leak by. Check valves always seem to corrode and leak.

[Jeff-C175 7,202]

On 1/3/2022 at 7:57 PM, squonk said:

I never  one of those feeders / regulators leak. I've had them plug up or leak by. Check valves always seem to corrode and leak.

 

I must have really bad luck!

 

 

Edited January 6, 2022 by Jeff-C175

[JCM 9,168]

Some more piping and wiring this week. Last phase will be to shut down and connect to the existing boiler. Possibility that the 80 gallon indirect H/W tank will be replaced. Waiting on a confirmation on that. Next weeks forecast looks very cold. May have to take a week off and resume when temps are 25 or so to shut her down.

[WHX?? 48,821]

Got the expansion tank off that Spirovent Plunge? What's with the black manifolds never saw those.

Little critique here Plunge you don't mind. 

Tip  on those boiler drains on the ends. Next job put a 90 ell on the end and drop them down to a tee with a capped nipple. Makes for a nice sediment trap.  Then ditch the globe style boiler drains with a ball valve pattern BD  in the tee capped off by a hose cap like the purge valves in case a HO or kid gets curious as to what this. 

Those globe style drains get a little crap in them they never seat. Especially with age and black crude radiators. 

Also you got a small fortune in Webstones  ther  .... I woulda designed with the Webstoner pump isolation valves right under or above the Tacos with the purge valve built in. Can't tell what the flow path is. I always put my purges on the direction of flow unless flow checks in the pumps or external prohibit it. 

 I tend to lessen the threaded connections if at all possible. Not that I am worried about my pipe dope/tape applications or whatever you are using....it's the quality of those threads and fittings nowadays I worry about. 

Gotta like the wiring ....tho .. I got a pic of a Sparky with OCD I'll havta show ya. 

Edited January 7, 2022 by WHX??

[squonk 41,124]

Purging air in an ancient bldg. is a hoot. When I first started my last job the campus was made up of several buildings around 75 yrs old. Was steam long ago but hot H2O now. Bldg remodeled about20 times. We had a wing the first cold day with no heat. I'm tracing a heat coil and the vent is in a corner behind a wall. We had to cut the wall open and I laid on a desk and crawled in up to my waist. Another guy hung onto my feet to keep me from falling in. This was on the 3rd floor and I could see all the way to the basement lights. 

[WHX?? 48,821]

My you do have some sea stories don't  you Squonky. 

[JCM 9,168]

I usually always make my own manifolds with copper tubing and tee's. The labor is more but on this job I was trying to speed things up a bit. Those manifolds are at all supply houses in different sizes and configurations. I capped them off and air tested them up to the circulators and purge valves where those boiler drains are on the end. Many years ago there were some issues with the nipples leaking at the welds and I stopped using them. Also the taps were crooked coming off the main. These were from a different mfg and the quality seemed much better than years back. @WHX??    Yes, the exp tank and water feed / backflow combo will be piped into that Spirovent. Taco circ pumps are the IFC type and pumping away.

Edited January 7, 2022 by JCM

[squonk 41,124]

9 minutes ago, WHX?? said:

My you do have some sea stories don't  you Squonky. 

When you work Industrial/commercial the stories never end. One of my last jobs I almost got stuck in a Hobart dish washer! 

[WHX?? 48,821]

32 minutes ago, JCM said:

I usually always make my own manifolds with copper tubing and tee's. 

32 minutes ago, JCM said:

I usually always make my own manifolds with copper tubing and tee's.

 

Well with the price of copper these days...

I really love these Plunge.

http://www.webstonevalves.com/default.aspx?page=customer&file=customer/wecoin/customerpages/isolator_drain.htm

 

32 minutes ago, JCM said:

 the quality seemed much better than years back.

Got that right ... my boys refuse to use the much cheaper Chinese black fittings. 

You use press stuff Plunge ? Seems to be the latest rage and most of my Plungers use it but since I am retiring and selling out not going to invest. They even have them for refrigeration lines now. 

Edited January 7, 2022 by WHX??

[Jeff-C175 7,202]

23 hours ago, WHX?? said:

Sparky with OCD

 

You sure that was Sparky and not Spidey ?

 

 

 

Edited January 7, 2022 by Jeff-C175

[JCM 9,168]

Jim, if you look at the valves on the bottom manifold those in that link for webstone is exactly what I installed on the return. @WHX??  Have not got into the pro press for copper. I really don't do enough of it to spend the roughly 4 grand for the set up.

Edited January 8, 2022 by JCM

[dola12 116]

I’m more on the commercial side of things 

[rjg854 11,368]

On 1/6/2022 at 7:42 PM, WHX?? said:

 

On 1/6/2022 at 7:42 PM, WHX?? said:

 

Our mechanical guy when I was building houses would do work like that it was picture perfect. In other words a work of art, whether it was electrical or plumbing.