1981 C-105 K241 Not Running Yet

[Newman38 12]

Just found this for my son (12) who has been begging for a tractor for his "lawn/leaves/snow business" . He has been pulling everything around in our old red wagon. Gave it some time to see how serious he was and here we are. We bought this tractor, not running but turning over after researching and the praise this forum has given them.

 

Was told mechanical fuel pump was bad and a electric one was put on and wired in to headlight switch for power ???  Also told would not start because the gentlemen thought carb needed adjusted and was fouling the plug out. It turned over pretty well so I told my son my thoughts but told him it was up to him. He said he loved it, let's get it and was very excited which impressed me.

 

Got it home on the trailer and we started to investigate. Fuel system full of Brown gunk from tank to carb. Cleaning and redoing with a Faucet fuel pump from Kirk Engines and Dorman #55240 glass fuel filter. 

 

Now to the ignition system, ignition wire worn badly with boot half gone. Points had some build Up. After reading about Kirk Engines here I went and checked his site. Ordering parts list is ---

 

1) Trandenser II Electronic Ignition System: $35.00
(1) Bosch Blue Ignition Coil: $65.00
(1) High-Performance Ignition Wire: $8.00
(1) Genuine Kohler Breaker Points: $15.00
(1) Breaker Points & Cover Retaining Screw Kit: $2.00
(1) Facet Solid State Electronic Fuel Pump: $57.00
USPS Priority Shipping - $12.00
Total - $194.00

 

I thought this might be a good way to make this as bullet proof as possible for my son after some training. Also have a back plate for fuel pump, NGK 3212 and gas cap on the way.

 

Any thoughts  and/or guidance would be greatly appreciated. Still have receipts. 

Thanks 

 

[ebinmaine 67,265]

 

 

Sounds like you've got a great plan going there.

 

 

[Newman38 12]

Thanks. Just getting started. First tractor and this is all new to me (us) so this site and the people who keep it going are a true blessing.

[ebinmaine 67,265]

10 minutes ago, Newman38 said:

Thanks. Just getting started. First tractor and this is all new to me (us) so this site and the people who keep it going are a true blessing.

Agreed.

Great bunch of folks.

 

Stick around awhile and you may even make a friend or two.

 

[Mikey the Monkey 697]

dont be afraid to take carb apart, clean, and use a rebuild kit. 

[953 nut 55,059]

       Father/son projects are a great way to build lasting bonds.          

Sounds like you have a good plan for correcting these deferred maintenance issues, cleaning and tightening all electrical connections including grounds is a good idea also.

[SylvanLakeWH 25,489]

 

I love my C105s!!! Great tractors!

 

You have a great plan! Make sure you really clean out the gas tank including the screen at the Shut off...all new fuel lines etc.

 

I added a marine style pressure bubble to mine a month or so ago because it cranked too much on start even with a full tank. Wow what a difference!!! Fires right up now... Here’s a picture:

 

 

Edited October 13, 2019 by SylvanLakeWH

[Newman38 12]

Thanks. I did put a new shut off valve on tank after cleaning. That pressure bubble looks like a good idea, would that be useful with an electric fuel pump. Has anyone ever ran a strip of hard rubber or something on bottom of plow to help from catching raised edges. Also what tire chains would work best so my son doesn't tear people's drives up. I wasn't even sure if him using this to plow was a good idea because of traction and damage issues but he is really set on using.

[SylvanLakeWH 25,489]

Unlike most, I don’t run with chains for the very reason you mention. Many run the rubber chains with good results.I have heard that some run with a hard rubber strips or you could adjust it up a bit so it rides just above surface (that’s what I do) using adjuster knob lower left of shifters.

 

Need to be very cautious doing other people’s drives with a plow. They will plow poor condition asphalt right up and will rip a garage door or siding right off if you clip it...but they work fast and great!!!

 

Don’t know about your electric fuel pump q. Smarter folks than I hopefully will chime in...

[ZXT 2,401]

Looks like you've got yourselves a plan! Looks like a pretty nice tractor as well.

 

Was there anything wrong with the ignition coil? Just my $.02, if it isn't bad, I'd save the $65. Coils rarely go bad.. And when they do, you go to tractor supply and get a new one for $20.

 

I've never seen the fascination with electric fuel pumps on these tractors. The regular mechanical fuel pumps are plenty reliable. You might have to crank for 10 seconds or so to pick up the fuel if its been sitting for months, but if its been run recently it'll still have fuel in the bowl and will fire right up. An electric fuel pump is just an unnecessary draw on the electrical system... and if you ever do have issues with the charging system, you'll run the battery dead far quicker. 

 

Is there any way to put insurance on your son/the tractor? The first time he tears up someone's driveway, runs into their car, or as Jim mentioned above, rips off someones garage door, the price to fix any one of those things will likely amount to more than he'll make all winter. Not saying he's for sure going to do any of the above, but there is always a chance, especially if you aren't very experienced. 

[Racinbob 11,040]

1 hour ago, Newman38 said:

Thanks. I did put a new shut off valve on tank after cleaning. That pressure bubble looks like a good idea, would that be useful with an electric fuel pump. Has anyone ever ran a strip of hard rubber or something on bottom of plow to help from catching raised edges. Also what tire chains would work best so my son doesn't tear people's drives up. I wasn't even sure if him using this to plow was a good idea because of traction and damage issues but he is really set on using.

 

With an electric pump you wouldn't need the primer bulb. I thought about one for my 05 and even bought one but ended up going with an electric. Best thing I've done to it.

 

 

We're about to move to a place with a blacktop drive about 300' long. I just put these Terra Grips on it. 

 

The hard rubber edge on the blade sounds like a good idea. I may do that. 

[The Tuul Crib 7,336]

 This is a great father son bonding project!

I do want to warn you that theses tractors 

have a way of  multiplying ! 

to the bestest tractor site on the planet!

We are all family here at!  Will be watching 

and listening in on this one for sure!!

 

[Newman38 12]

13 hours ago, ZXT said:

Looks like you've got yourselves a plan! Looks like a pretty nice tractor as well.

 

Was there anything wrong with the ignition coil? Just my $.02, if it isn't bad, I'd save the $65. Coils rarely go bad.. And when they do, you go to tractor supply and get a new one for $20.

 

I've never seen the fascination with electric fuel pumps on these tractors. The regular mechanical fuel pumps are plenty reliable. You might have to crank for 10 seconds or so to pick up the fuel if its been sitting for months, but if its been run recently it'll still have fuel in the bowl and will fire right up. An electric fuel pump is just an unnecessary draw on the electrical system... and if you ever do have issues with the charging system, you'll run the battery dead far quicker. 

 

Is there any way to put insurance on your son/the tractor? The first time he tears up someone's driveway, runs into their car, or as Jim mentioned above, rips off someones garage door, the price to fix any one of those things will likely amount to more than he'll make all winter. Not saying he's for sure going to do any of the above, but there is always a chance, especially if you aren't very experienced. 

 

Thanks ZXT. Sorry for late response. Work, flag football, pumpkin walk 😊..

 

I here ya. I am a big fan of " if it ain't broke don't fix it " especially in the realm of $$$. BUT

 

(1) My son will be using this at least 50% or more of the time without me ( at work etc.) and I don't have regular access to a trailer if it would break down when he's out and about. Since there isn't much to these I look at it like invest in it now. My WIFE already said " Why would you buy something that isn't running" 😒... Deep Breath, I said " I thought it would be an easy fix, your going to have to just trust me here"

 

(2) Not real sure of its "history" maintenance wise, and seems like it has been sitting for awhile especially with how bad the fuel and lines were. And with some research and input given here about Kirk Engine parts I decided take a step of faith that his parts/upgrades would get this thing off on a solid foot. Thought about not buying the coil $$$ but it is the main part of the ones I am replacing and I'll hang onto the old one just in case. 

 

(3) I am not real found of going electric neither, like I said I am new to this and wanted to stay original as much as possible. I wasn't planning on modifying. It has an original metal one with a bad diaphragm and I wanted to rebuild it but I couldn't find any kits for it. I hate plastic and thats all I saw for new ones. Was reading on here how much the electric ones have helped so figured I'd give it a go. Not really sure on where or how to wire it. Last guy wired it to the lights 😕.

 

Thanks for the heads up on insurance. Never realized that as being an option. I will be on the phone this week asking around. Everything you said has crossed my mind and been stressed to him and there has'nt been a drop of snow yet. 😅.. On top of that i can't even speak from experience  so there will be plenty of practice for the BOTH of us.  

 

 

[Newman38 12]

14 hours ago, SylvanLakeWH said:

Unlike most, I don’t run with chains for the very reason you mention. Many run the rubber chains with good results.I have heard that some run with a hard rubber strips or you could adjust it up a bit so it rides just above surface (that’s what I do) using adjuster knob lower left of shifters.

 

Need to be very cautious doing other people’s drives with a plow. They will plow poor condition asphalt right up and will rip a garage door or siding right off if you clip it...but they work fast and great!!!

 

Don’t know about your electric fuel pump q. Smarter folks than I hopefully will chime in...

 

I know, Its going to take some practice. Can't buy experience. Good to know the rubber ones are an option. Thanks for the tips.

[Newman38 12]

12 hours ago, Racinbob said:

 

With an electric pump you wouldn't need the primer bulb. I thought about one for my 05 and even bought one but ended up going with an electric. Best thing I've done to it.

 

 

We're about to move to a place with a blacktop drive about 300' long. I just put these Terra Grips on it. 

 

The hard rubber edge on the blade sounds like a good idea. I may do that. 

 

Nice tractor.. So this is how they multiply.. I'm already thinking of a bigger one and still one on the trailer. Thats a nice fuel pump setup. Did you put a filter in also. Also the pump in getting says 7 gph, thats just what its capable of not what tractor would use correct. Is it a bad idea to drive this around town doing yards and driveways as far as wear and tear on the tractor. I assume it may use a lot of gas.

[Newman38 12]

12 hours ago, The Tool Crib said:

 This is a great father son bonding project!

I do want to warn you that theses tractors 

have a way of  multiplying ! 

to the bestest tractor site on the planet!

We are all family here at!  Will be watching 

and listening in on this one for sure!!

 

 

Sure seems like it will be. I know. I caught myself already looking and still have the first one apart in the garage. Cool graphics. You guys ( and some ladies I'm sure ) are really welcoming. Sometimes thats hard to find even in your own backyard. 

[ZXT 2,401]

3 minutes ago, Newman38 said:

 

Nice tractor.. So this is how they multiply.. I'm already thinking of a bigger one and still one on the trailer. Thats a nice fuel pump setup. Did you put a filter in also. Also the pump in getting says 7 gph, thats just what its capable of not what tractor would use correct. Is it a bad idea to drive this around town doing yards and driveways as far as wear and tear on the tractor. I assume it may use a lot of gas.

Once you get into them they definitely multiply!

 

7 GPH is what the pump can flow, not what the tractor will use. The tractor will not use anywhere near that much.. 

 

How big is town? It might use a little bit of gas but driving it shouldn't put any undue stress on the tractor. K241 and K301's are remarkably fuel efficient.

[Newman38 12]

11 minutes ago, ZXT said:

Once you get into them they definitely multiply!

 

7 GPH is what the pump can flow, not what the tractor will use. The tractor will not use anywhere near that much.. 

 

How big is town? It might use a little bit of gas but driving it shouldn't put any undue stress on the tractor. K241 and K301's are remarkably fuel efficient.

 

Thanks. Towns only 1 square mile at that. He's probably working in a 10 by 10 block radius I'd say. Some days more some less.

[ebinmaine 67,265]

4 hours ago, Newman38 said:

. My WIFE already said " Why would you buy something that isn't running

Please do remind your other half that a Wheelhorse is NOT a cheap tractor.

They are a piece of Equipment.

Like any machine they have areas that could use attention on different models. Overall they are extremely dependable, very high quality machines. Very easy to repair and maintain as you've already seen.

 

 

The metal fuel pumps are rebuildable with a kit from a company in Massachusetts called Then And Now Automotive.

 

You're likely at least as dependable with an electric pump. Cold weather will treat you well going electric as well.

 

 

 

[953 nut 55,059]

6 hours ago, Newman38 said:

Was reading on here how much the electric ones have helped so figured I'd give it a go. Not really sure on where or how to wire it. Last guy wired it to the lights

If the pump is wired to the light switch feed (comes on when the key is on) and you don't have to turn on the lights for the pump to run then it is fine.

[Racinbob 11,040]

6 hours ago, Newman38 said:

 

Nice tractor.. So this is how they multiply.. I'm already thinking of a bigger one and still one on the trailer. Thats a nice fuel pump setup. Did you put a filter in also. Also the pump in getting says 7 gph, thats just what its capable of not what tractor would use correct. Is it a bad idea to drive this around town doing yards and driveways as far as wear and tear on the tractor. I assume it may use a lot of gas.

 

Like ZXT said, the engine will only use what it needs. The pump I purchased came with a filter that threaded into the inlet side. You can see it in the picture. I just 'spliced' it into the fuel line under the seat. The line on the outlet side is as it was originally. Another inline filter and then to the fuel pump. I wasn't certain if I should bypass the original pump but to simplify things I did it this way and it works great. During the summer this tractor seldom sits more than a couple days but I could still see a marked improvement. In the winter it could easily sit 2-3 weeks and last winter I had a few times where I thought I'd run out of battery cranking it until the fuel completed the trip. I'm confident that won't happen this winter. 

 

Bad idea driving around town.....nope. Sure, there will be more hours put on the machine but that's what they are designed to do. The plusses that your son will see will far outweigh the added hours. 

[ronhatch 406]

Remember pumps push better then suck!  So mount it as low and close to the tank As possible. I ran a new wire directly from the pump to the + battery post with an inline 3 amp fuse. . 

[Newman38 12]

11 hours ago, ronhatch said:

Remember pumps push better then suck!  So mount it as low and close to the tank As possible. I ran a new wire directly from the pump to the + battery post with an inline 3 amp fuse. . 

 

Thanks for that much needed info. Was wondering which option to use for power. Wouldn't running to the battery give continuous power or hurt battery though, I'm not sure.

[Lee1977 6,642]

I wired my electric pump with a fuse from the positive pump wire to the key switch. The pump ground wire trough a toggle switch and to ground. With the toggle switch on the pump  starts and stops with the key switch.  If it want to store the tractor for a while I can run it dry by turning off the toggle switch. 

[Pullstart 62,783]

 @Newman38!

 

A couple things haven’t been addressed in regards to your son.  This is a manual lift machine, the plow will be a lot to lift on a regular basis.  Some type of assist lift spring I’m sure would help, maybe someone here has a mounting idea you could borrow.  

 

As for pushing snow, make sure the piles are pushed back far enough to allow for extra snow falls.  Once the piles are there, they don’t move very easy.  

 

Safety safety!  I’d load that sucker up with LEDs so everyone can see him!