Why do I even try?

[adsm08 2,022]

So I rebuilt my starter, and it didn't work. So I rebuilt it again, and it did work.

 

Tonight I tried to run the mower, about 10 minutes in it started making a noise. Noise is coming from inside the starter. Sounds like the rear armature bearing is bad already.

 

Stuff like this has been happening often lately. I'm starting to wonder why I even try to take care of my own stuff. Things like this don't seem to happen when I work on other people's stuff.

[ebinmaine 67,265]

Doodoo occurs brother man.

Don't give it up.

[rjg854 11,349]

Murphy's Law 

 

Whatever can go wrong.   Will

[adsm08 2,022]

The noise is 100% in the rear. It is either the rear bearing or the brushes are in upside down.

 

I have the old bearing, which is still good, just needs greased, or the brushes are easy to flip. I am just getting frustrated with this tractor because every time I think I finally have it fixed something else goes wrong.

[Cee245 818]

"Why do I even try?"

 

Because when you finally figure out the problem, it makes me feel proud to accomplish it. 

 

Keep plugging away(my suggestion), OR,  imo it's completely fine to pay someone to figure it out.  I do that occasionally. 

 

Either way, Good luck!

 

 

 

Cory

 

 

Edited October 10, 2019 by Cee245

[ebinmaine 67,265]

Understandable.

 

Call it a learning experience.

 

It'll all come out in the wash eventually..

 

[The Tuul Crib 7,336]

Its one BIG learning curve that 

give you more  knowledge ! 

Things do and will get better! 

DONT GIVE UP!!

 

[pacer 3,168]

But wait..... if you are 'running' then the starter should not be at all engaged... right?? If you are running and the starter is noisy then it didnt disengage from the flywheel and the motor is spinning the starter??

[ohiofarmer 3,265]

 The solution is simple. Buy another one for a spare. Have two runners and if you have work to do, it will get done, even if you rob a part  and trade around occasionally.   [ let the addiction begin]

[Stepney 2,325]

I agree ... why is the starter running with the engine? Unless of course you mean a starter generator. 
If that's the case, a cheap bearing likely will fail. I've had that countless times. Always buy quality, inspect your work, and get it right the first time. These are quite simple. A shop manual and quality parts go a long way, even in simple repairs. 

..This isn't a vintage British sports car. You can't give up this easy

[adsm08 2,022]

10 hours ago, pacer said:

But wait..... if you are 'running' then the starter should not be at all engaged... right?? If you are running and the starter is noisy then it didnt disengage from the flywheel and the motor is spinning the starter??

 

10 hours ago, Stepney said:

I agree ... why is the starter running with the engine? Unless of course you mean a starter generator. 
If that's the case, a cheap bearing likely will fail. I've had that countless times. Always buy quality, inspect your work, and get it right the first time. These are quite simple. A shop manual and quality parts go a long way, even in simple repairs. 

..This isn't a vintage British sports car. You can't give up this easy

 

It is a starter/generator unit. I am going to tear it back apart tonight when i get home.

 

I wish finding a spare unit was that easy. I tries robbing the one off my other horse but it is too different. Its shorter  and doesn't fit the mount, and the mounts don't swap either.

 

Since it started making noise in only 10 minutes it should be obvious once i am inside, i am just tired to tearing it apart.

 

At least it isnt a Ford where I would have to spend three hours removing other parts to get to it.

[pfrederi 17,662]

1 hour ago, adsm08 said:

 

 

It is a starter/generator unit. I am going to tear it back apart tonight when i get home.

 

I wish finding a spare unit was that easy. I tries robbing the one off my other horse but it is too different. Its shorter  and doesn't fit the mount, and the mounts don't swap either.

 

Since it started making noise in only 10 minutes it should be obvious once i am inside, i am just tired to tearing it apart.

 

At least it isnt a Ford where I would have to spend three hours removing other parts to get to it.

 

I submitted 3 files on Delco-Remy Motor Generators and regulators to the manuals section.  You may find them helpful. That is where i read that both field coils are involved in cranking but only one is used in charging.

[JoeM 7,871]

Not a failure..........just an opportunity!

I bet the next repair will go much better.

 

[WHX?? 48,762]

I rebuild SG's all the time with no problems other than getting those field coil screws out. One of these days I am going to get off my rear and do an instructional.  Let us know what you find.

[adsm08 2,022]

Well I took it apart again, the bearings where OK, the one brush showed a bit of unusual wear that may have been related to just getting broken in, but there were no other obvious oddities, so I put it back together and tried to localize the sound a little better with it running.

 

After a few minutes of listening I wasn't any closer, but the S/G got really hot all of a sudden and let out the magic smoke. Tore it back down, new armature is smoked. A section of epoxy is busted out, two strands of winding are torn out, just like the old one did. 

 

The armature must have been slightly out of round and catching the plates that go inside the field coils. It kinda makes sense that may have been the issue because I was riding it around a bit before it blew and there was a vibration that was never there before. I could feel it in the stirrups and frame, like something was spinning out of balance.

Edited October 10, 2019 by adsm08

[kasey54 305]

Do you have ball bearings, or bronze bushings? If ball brgs, maybe the housing it fits in is worn.

Good luck, don' give up.

[Tractorhead 9,064]

Keep fingers crossed, you will be found the issue!

 

maybe add some picts, so possible any advice could given.

 

 

Edited October 11, 2019 by Tractorhead

[adsm08 2,022]

9 hours ago, kasey54 said:

Do you have ball bearings, or bronze bushings? If ball brgs, maybe the housing it fits in is worn.

Good luck, don' give up.

 

The armature was running on bearings. The fit to the housing is still good and tight. I need to try to contact the guy I bought the parts from and see if there is any warranty on them. I'm a little annoyed right now because when I bought the rebuild kit it was all that was available. Now I am finding remaned units for about $20 less than I paid for the rebuild kit.

 

 

6 hours ago, Tractorhead said:

Keep fingers crossed, you will be found the issue!

 

maybe add some picts, so possible any advice could given.

 

 

 

I'll get some pictures today, by the time I got that far yesterday my phone was almost dead and I had bigger fish to fry.

 

 

 

I got ahold of the guy I bought my 800 from and he has a few S/G units sitting around. He is supposed to get back to me today if any of the ones he has matches this one.

[Tuneup 1,433]

On 10/10/2019 at 8:27 AM, adsm08 said:

 

 

It is a starter/generator unit. I am going to tear it back apart tonight when i get home.

 

I wish finding a spare unit was that easy. I tries robbing the one off my other horse but it is too different. Its shorter  and doesn't fit the mount, and the mounts don't swap either.

 

Since it started making noise in only 10 minutes it should be obvious once i am inside, i am just tired to tearing it apart.

 

At least it isnt a Ford where I would have to spend three hours removing other parts to get to it.

 

OK, I was reading through just to make a Ford comment and, there it is!!! You sound like a Ford man -  they're all around you and you're wondering why, why, why! My sons now have them and they appear often to have me look at this or that. I don't think there is anything I haven't done to a Mustang or Ranger. Even the 2013 Escape has had its hood up. Keep at it. When you win, the Miller tastes all the better.

[adsm08 2,022]

12 minutes ago, Tuneup said:

 

OK, I was reading through just to make a Ford comment and, there it is!!! You sound like a Ford man -  they're all around you and you're wondering why, why, why! My sons now have them and they appear often to have me look at this or that. I don't think there is anything I haven't done to a Mustang or Ranger. Even the 2013 Escape has had its hood up. Keep at it. When you win, the Miller tastes all the better.

 

I am a Ford guy, in general, but I have also decided that I never want to own anything newer than 2010, no matter who built it. I am also not so blindingly brand loyal that I can't see their flaws, especially when I deal with them every day.

 

One of the reasons that I get so frustrated with this tractor is that I am a Ford Certified senior master tech with a combined 13 years of experience under my belt. I can, and in the last month have, torn the engine out of an Escape, tore it down to the long block, put it all back together, and had it run down the road without any issues on the first try. My mechanical skills are, by most measures, rather formidable. However this 1965 tractor, which is by any modern standard a very simple machine, regularly kicks my butt.

Edited October 12, 2019 by adsm08

[Tuneup 1,433]

Great skills! I'm old enough now that I have to stop before buttoning it all up to consider if every nut was torqued and all tools accounted for. Frustrating, and only 57! So, you've got that to look forward to - keep plenty of beer in the fridge.

[Digger 66 3,478]

On 10/9/2019 at 7:56 PM, adsm08 said:

The noise is 100% in the rear. It is either the rear bearing or the brushes are in upside down.

 

I have the old bearing, which is still good, just needs greased, or the brushes are easy to flip. I am just getting frustrated with this tractor because every time I think I finally have it fixed something else goes wrong.

It's not "the tractor" it's just a bunch of little things that need to be taken care of .

You know what it is , that's the good part .

Like when folks say " this car is no good in the snow " and they're driving on all season tires  .