C-125 Fluids

[Jim anderson 77]

No explanation required, except having one available for “she who must be obeyed” is always helpful.  Mind you, I have some of this at home already, but being able to get a set for the cabin and not drag them back and forth is awesome!

 

jim

[gwest_ca-(File Mod) 11,080]

14 pages of info on the 1982 C-125 8-Speed model 01-12K803. Kohler serial 12061782 was made in 1982.

https://www.wheelhorseforum.com/search/?&q="01-12k803"&type=downloads_file&search_and_or=or

 

Garry

[WHX?? 48,938]

11 hours ago, Howie said:

IN picture #8 one can see a points cover on the engine.

Good eye Howie ..the plot thickens!

One of the problems with having a "cabin" Jim is you need two sets of everything! I usually don't have too much problem explaining that to SWMBO! She gives ya any grief about havin a duplicate set of tools. for the cabin ask her to drag her kitchenware back and forth!

Edited January 16, 2019 by WHX21

[Racinbob 11,125]

Duplicate tools for a cabin a ways away is one thing. Try convincing the boss that duplicates are needed for a second garage a couple hundred feet away, I'm slowly getting there. 

[WHX?? 48,938]

One of the pitfalls of having too many out buildings and tractor hangouts Bob!

[tunahead72 2,424]

As @WHX21 requested, here's some photos of the engine on my 1981 C-105.  There is a plug-style dipstick, and points.  Except for the dipstick, I think it's very close to @Jim anderson's engine on his C-125 (other than the displacement).

 

I did some research in the parts manuals for both of these engines...

 

Mine is a K241AS engine, spec. 46812d, which came from the factory with a plug-style dipstick (8-3/32" blade), part number 235747.  I believe that's the part number on my dipstick, but it's too cold (and I'm too lazy) to check that out right now.

 

Jim's K301AS is spec. 47742.  The dipstick shown in the parts manual has a handle and blade (13-7/64" long) that look very much like the ones in Jim's photos.  I don't know the original part number.  The number in the parts manual is 45 272 04, which is a newer Kohler number.  There's also a note in the manual that says when you replace this dipstick for the first time, you must also order a new oil fill tube (47 180 05).

 

Jim, can you read the part number on the blade of your dipstick?

 

[Jim anderson 77]

Tunahead-  I left the cabin already due to the impending storm and work, so I will have to wait until next time to read the dipstick.  I will revisit this trail once I get that done, could be a couple weeks as I’m not sure when I head back.  FYI- had about a foot of snow last night, and the big storm is coming tonight, could be 6 feet on the tops, so revisiting an old subject, yup, we get snow!

[tunahead72 2,424]

Good deal.  Stay safe, and enjoy the snow!

 

[WHX?? 48,938]

You certainly have points Tuna which surprises me as I woulda thunk both you and Jims' motor would have had magneto ignitions in the early '80s time period. You definitely have the look of a early block tho. Trouble is I am no where trained enough to know if there were casting dates on the block but I am sure we have some Kohler experts on board who know. We may have to move this discussion to the engines section. 

 

Just to throw another monkey wrench into things I don't think we can run with the name plate data on yours Ed as if the block was indeed replaced the name plate would have followed with the sheet metal work off the original engine/block. I can't read your serial number well enough to get a date code off it.

Does anyone know if there are balancing gears in these motors?

 

That alot of snow Jim drive safe.

[tunahead72 2,424]

2 hours ago, WHX21 said:

… Just to throw another monkey wrench into things I don't think we can run with the name plate data on yours Ed as if the block was indeed replaced the name plate would have followed with the sheet metal work off the original engine/block. I can't read your serial number well enough to get a date code off it...

 

Good point, both for this particular engine and generally for any engine on these tractors.  Unless you know the complete history, you can't assume much.

 

I couldn't read the serial number either today.  I'll check my files and see if I wrote it down when I first bought it.

 

[Jim anderson 77]

So back at the cabin, and finally able to read the dipstick part number.  Almost what tunahead predicted, just one number off.  I was able to get the gear oil changed and finished off with the 30 weight in the motor.  Attached pics include:  dipstick number as requested, overdue gear oil in pan, and diesel wash beside my reward for work done.  Thanks all for the help on liquids!!!

next project is replacing the removable blade on bottom of snow plow.  PO ground everything down too far, and spot welded the current cutting edge onto blade.  Going to involve cutting old piece off, drilling new holes and remounting cutting edge.  Should be fun!

[tunahead72 2,424]

Interesting...

 

It's late at night / early in the morning here, I just woke up from falling asleep on the couch after dinner, and I see a notice that you've picked up this thread again.  It's dark, and everybody else in the house is sound asleep, so I'm not going to go into full research mode right now, maybe later this week...

 

But that's not the interesting part.  This is -- the dipstick you pictured may not be the original/correct one for your engine, it may be the wrong length, and so your oil level readings may not be correct.

 

When you get a chance, find the Kohler K301 parts manual here on RedSquare (hint: it's part of the link that Garry provided in post #27 of this thread).  If you've never had the pleasure of studying one of these, take a few minutes to read the first 3 pages to understand how it's organized, and then dig into the "dipstick" group to see if you come to the same conclusion I do.  I'll do the same, and check back later.

 

Also, how much oil did you add when you did your oil change?  Did you happen to notice how much old oil you drained out?

 

And finally, those two fluids in your last photo...  I'd like to try the one on the left, please. 

 

Edited January 29, 2019 by tunahead72

[shallowwatersailor 3,213]

I believe that the Kohler K-241AS engines (10 hp) came with the pipe thread plug dipstick as a cost saving measure, or part of a purchase agreement with Kohler. I have a 1983 C-105 that has the plug dipstick - whereas my 1981 C-145 with the K-321 has the dipstick tube. Both engines are on the Black Hood shaker plates.

Edited January 29, 2019 by shallowwatersailor

[Jim anderson 77]

So when I changed the oil I added just slightly under 1 1/2 quarts.  The reason for that is I had a full quart and one that had been opened before for something else.  The owners manual called for 1 1/2, and the dipstick shows 3/4 of the way up between “fill” and “full”.  The reading makes sense to me from the amount I added, any slight residual, and where I would expect it to be.  I will take a look at the parts manual as suggested and see what I can dig up. Again, thanks for all the great help!

[ClassicTractorProfessor 5,314]

On ‎1‎/‎16‎/‎2019 at 6:40 PM, WHX21 said:

You certainly have points Tuna which surprises me as I woulda thunk both you and Jims' motor would have had magneto ignitions in the early '80s time period

My K301 in my C125, and the K321 in Ray's C141 are both points ignition, and both have the tube type dipstick. I'm by no means an expert (far from it) but every K Series engine I have ever worked on was points type ignition

[Jim anderson 77]

Well Tunahead-  that ended up being an education in understanding the manual.  However, I believe that the dipstick is correct for the motor.  From the engine spec number (47742) I come up with variation number 65.  I assume this is actually variations 6 or 5, because there is no variation “65” in the chart.  Since variation 5 has my dipstick part number in it (452703), I’m going to guess that all of this was original to the engine.  The final supporting evidence I’ll use is the oil level on the dipstick matching expectations after the oil change and adding 1 1/2 quarts.  Definitely took a little bit of time to figure out how to use the manual, but a fun exercise, and very useful understanding the source document.  

 

As as a side note:  WOW it can be cold out in the central U.S.!  Landed in Chicago early this morning, the temperature was -31C.  That could convert to -24F, all before wind chill.  All you folks out East bundle up at take care of yourselves!

 

cheers

[tunahead72 2,424]

4 hours ago, Jim anderson said:

 

...  From the engine spec number (47742) I come up with variation number 65.  I assume this is actually variations 6 or 5, because there is no variation “65” in the chart.  Since variation 5 has my dipstick part number in it (452703), I’m going to guess that all of this was original to the engine...

 

 

Almost...  Variation 65 is correct for the dipstick.  But in the "chart", I think you're looking at the Index Number, which refers to the particular picture in the set of drawings above the chart.  If you look about 3/4 of the way down the left side of the chart, you'll see Variation 65 associated with part number 45 272 04, which looks like picture 2.  The "*" next to the part number complicates things, you have to look at the dipstick tube section in the pages that follow.

 

I love these parts manuals, I find them incredibly helpful, but BRAIN HURT!

 

[Jim anderson 77]

Yup-  I was reading it wrong and you are correct.  I had checked the stats on the two dipsticks and there is a difference in the length of a little over 1/2 inch.  So that brings up a few possibilities:

1). The oil is reading incorrectly

2)  the markings on the two dipsticks are placed at different lengths, could be reading correctly, or too much/ too little.  Can’t really tell unless you measure the marking positions on the dipsticks side-by-side

3)  the dipstick was changed out but so was the dipstick tube, (need to look at that part now), and readings are correct.  

4). ???

Leaving me with:  Right now the readings roughly equate to expectations from the oil change which followed required amounts.  

 

Fun stuff!

[Jim anderson 77]

Funny thing is:  if you look at the drawings of the different dipsticks, mine actually looks like part 45 272 04.  The handle is not shaped like the handle on 45 272 03, even though that is what the part number on it is.