312-8 pto safety switch removal

[peter lena 8,653]

recent 312-8 w/h going over any faults I can correct. pto safety switch is a problem , tractor # 3114k802 - 21370 , switch has 6 wires going to it that I  would like to eliminate. just rebuilt the pto lever system , and the switch has to go , looking for the ability to wire connect and eliminate switch. thank you for any help on this, pete  

[520hC-120 136]

If the switch is anything like a 520h you should be able to unplug the connectors that lead to the switch and have no more issues.

 

[953 nut 55,393]

2 hours ago, peter lena said:

eliminate switch.

Safety switches are there for a reason and I don't think it is in the best interest of this forum or any of the members to remove any safety device or provide support for this!

[KC9KAS 4,741]

1 hour ago, 520hC-120 said:

If the switch is anything like a 520h you should be able to unplug the connectors that lead to the switch and have no more issues.

 

 

Use this procedure for TESTING ONLY, not a permanent fix!

[T-Mo-(Moderator) 4,507]

Defeating safety switches isn't such a good idea and should only be done for the individual that will be using it, and should be reversible when and if the tractor goes to a new owner.  On some tractor websites, it's against their policy to discuss defeating safety switches due to liability.  We don't have that policy as far as I know, but digression should be applied here.  Defeating safety switches might be okay for you, but what about the next owner, or even your spouse, parent, sibling or child that attempts to use that tractor when the safety switches have been defeated?

 

I, myself, would not like to see this discuss here, but as I said, it isn't against policy.

[rjg854 11,393]

Perhaps it should become policy, as stated above the safety devises are there for a reason. Most if not all, at one time or another, have had our tractors not start because we've left the PTO or something else engaged, unconsciously.  If that hadn't happen and the safety switch wasn't there no telling what may result.  They say stuff tends to happen!  Let's not be some of the stuff that MAKES it happen.  EH?

[SylvanLakeWH 25,618]

10 hours ago, 953 nut said:

Safety switches are there for a reason and I don't think it is in the best interest of this forum or any of the members to remove any safety device or provide support for this!

 

14 minutes ago, rjg854 said:

Perhaps it should become policy, as stated above the safety devises are there for a reason. Most if not all, at one time or another, have had our tractors not start because we've left the PTO or something else engaged, unconsciously.  If that hadn't happen and the safety switch wasn't there no telling what may result.  They say stuff tends to happen!  Let's not be some of the stuff that MAKES it happen.  EH?

 

 

Perhaps the response from Red Square should be simply: "Safety switches are there for a reason. We do not condone or educate folks on how to by-pass them." Then, continue to do the excellent job this site - in particular @T-Mo - does in directing people to the manuals that show us how to fix them...

 

[KC9KAS 4,741]

2 hours ago, SylvanLakeWH said:

 

 

 

Perhaps the response from Red Square should be simply: "Safety switches are there for a reason. We do not condone or educate folks on how to by-pass them." Then, continue to do the excellent job this site - in particular @T-Mo - does in directing people to the manuals that show us how to fix them...

 

Playing the Devils Advocate here.....

 

I for one would still like to have the option to ask the question "how do I disconnect (this or that) to trouble shoot a problem".

Hopefully we all are adult enough to KNOW why safety switches are installed and KNOW the results of by-passing them.

Some folks are more advanced in their knowledge of "how things work" compared to the next fellow. We are here to help each other in making our equipment work for another 30-40-50 years. If tell you how I found/fixed a problem and YOU do something stupid, it is all on you, not me!

[953 nut 55,393]

 

2 hours ago, KC9KAS said:

If tell you how I found/fixed a problem and YOU do something stupid, it is all on you, not me

In today's litigious society it is just a matter of time before an enterprising attorney traces the elimination of a safety device back to an internet post somewhere. I don't want anyone on here to be the subject of that attorney's probe. 

I agree with Randy and Jim, we aught to stay away from safety switch elimination. 

[Dakota8338 115]

Personally, I consider safety switches were only installed for stupid people and attorneys.  Admittedly we all have did some foolish things at one time or another, but that was not the manufacturers fault and if judges would throw lawyers and their clients out of their court rooms for frivolous things the world would be better off. 

 

Safety switches have caused me more grief during the past thirty years than anything else, because in most instances replacing them is the only way to check out their functional operation. 

[paul414-8 3]

On 8/31/2018 at 8:17 PM, 953 nut said:

Safety switches are there for a reason and I don't think it is in the best interest of this forum or any of the members to remove any safety device or provide support for this!

safety switches have their place and purpose but owners have to weigh their value through the life cycle of the tractor. My 416-8 has two pto safety swtiches and a seat switch and an neutral switch. Now does this suggest that the WheelHorse from 1968 with one safety switch is antiquated and should be modified to add modern safety switches ? Of course not. Im at the point now that I am trying to get my lawn mowed and I have a malfunctioning PTO switch. There is no safety issue at stake, no one is going to put their hand under the deck while the PTO is engaged. Everything has a place and time. Im glad WheelHorse designed the 416 the way they did, I love it but the owner should use his common sense and put safety first in the best way that they know how.

Edited July 22, 2021 by paul414-8

[Handy Don 12,281]

4 hours ago, paul414-8 said:

safety switches have their place and purpose but owners have to weigh their value through the life cycle of the tractor. My 416-8 has two pto safety swtiches and a seat switch and an neutral switch. Now does this suggest that the WheelHorse from 1968 with one safety switch is antiquated and should be modified to add modern safety switches ? Of course not. Im at the point now that I am trying to get my lawn mowed and I have a malfunctioning PTO switch. There is no safety issue at stake, no one is going to put their hand under the deck while the PTO is engaged. Everything has a place and time. Im glad WheelHorse designed the 416 the way they did, I love it but the owner should use his common sense and put safety first in the best way that they know how.

Unless I missed it, I didn't hear anyone suggest that an owner not be able to do whatever they want to their own tractor.

I DID hear strong discouragement for helping someone remove safety devices. 

The earlier comment that we cannot know the capabilities of someone we are helping and therefore cannot really assess the risk of helping them defeat a safety item resonates with me. So does the near certainty that a personal injury lawyer would pursue anyone who provided such help if money was involved--there is no disclaimer that is airtight against that sort of legal action.

IMHO, you are free to do what you will to your own machine, but grant me the rights to choose what help I will give you and to politely share my opinion about it.

[adsm08 2,103]

I get around the whole safety switch debate by simply buying tractors that are old enough to not have them.

[pfrederi 17,743]

12 hours ago, adsm08 said:

I get around the whole safety switch debate by simply buying tractors that are old enough to not have them.

 

 

 

I only have a couple new enough for safety switches and i am not buying any more 3,4,500 series.  Running down electrical gremlins is not a favorite pass time.

[paul414-8 3]

17 hours ago, Handy Don said:

..

IMHO, you are free to do what you will to your own machine, but grant me the rights to choose what help I will give you and to politely share my opinion about it.

 

I appreciate your insights and am grateful for you. This forum has helped me get a discarded 400 series up and running and I can now really appreciate the WH design approach. I have a cub cadet and a John Deere but the WH attachments, the ease of putting them on as well as the PTO design are un equaled. Simple, durable and efficient. Im sold.

 

[tom2p 2,394]

1 hour ago, paul414-8 said:

 

I appreciate your insights and am grateful for you. This forum has helped me get a discarded 400 series up and running and I can now really appreciate the WH design approach. I have a cub cadet and a John Deere but the WH attachments, the ease of putting them on as well as the PTO design are un equaled. Simple, durable and efficient. Im sold.

 

my thoughts also - simple, durable, efficient 

 

[JohnnyO 9]

Somewhat of a newbie, here...but for my two cents: I was a Court Stenographer (Court Reporter) for three judges, served in the USCG doing Courts Martial (it isn't Court Martials)...I've worked in my time also with the Fed. Govt. in that capacity and I'll share with you this: Of the probably two hundred lawyers I've worked with, or had occasion to deal with in my capacity I would venture to say that I would trust about FIVE OF THEM...and the comments about possible liability is very real. Testing switches is one thing. Eliminating them, and condoning it? That's opening a can of worms for some "ambulance chaser" to try to nail this site, Lord Forbid, or some individual who advocated safety switch removal. So I must from personal experience, agree with the general opinion, that advice for "removal of safety switches should be avoided". Yes, it's a real problem at times. I just ordered a new PTO switch that are very hard to find for the older WH's..but..overall, I strongly agree with eliminating "advice" on permanent removal...for the reasons I've stated. This is a great site and I do appreciate being a member. Thank you.

[953 nut 55,393]

9 hours ago, JohnnyO said:

This is a great site and I do appreciate being a member. Thank you.

We are glad to have you with us and thank you for your input.                

[Handy Don 12,281]

11 hours ago, JohnnyO said:

I would venture to say that I would trust about FIVE OF THEM

Wow