Phoenix from the flames - I hope.

[meadowfield 2,595]

Some of you may recall I had a pretty bad workshop fire 4 years ago. We lost a lot of stuff, but I hung onto a few bits as I couldn’t part with them. Here’s one such item, a commando 8 tranny that was burned and full of water.

 

 

the hubs were really seized on, my 6 ton jack failed to pull them and just stripped the 5 rods I used. 

So I had to use the big puller, lots of heat and a big hammer!

 

 

which did the trick, then there was the ubiquitous seized hitch pin...

 

 

before it finally split

 

 

its not a pretty sight, however the main bearings are ok. The needle rollers and seals will need doing.

[Digger 66 3,488]

Looks like fun .

What's your plan to get the caged rollers out ?

Fill the cavity with grease and press in a correct sized blank to force them out ?

Or are you going to just drill them ?

 

[tunahead72 2,435]

Two posts into this story, and I can tell it's going to be a good one!  Can't wait to see how this turns out! 

 

[peter lena 8,733]

the main bearings are ok??. are you serious?, there is no rotational bearing or mounted seal that I would not replace. that corrosive wet slurry will surface score any bearing, making it something that should be replaced. I would also use a 10-30 oil for a run in and further flush to ensure you got all the crud. then refill with 85-140 . you have this completely apart, you don't  rebuild it, and then say , " I should have " as a noisy bearing grinds back to life. having done a lot of gear drives, now is not the time, to hope a bearing is ok. Pete

[meadowfield 2,595]

On 21/04/2018 at 5:14 PM, peter lena said:

the main bearings are ok??. are you serious?, there is no rotational bearing or mounted seal that I would not replace. that corrosive wet slurry will surface score any bearing, making it something that should be replaced. I would also use a 10-30 oil for a run in and further flush to ensure you got all the crud. then refill with 85-140 . you have this completely apart, you don't  rebuild it, and then say , " I should have " as a noisy bearing grinds back to life. having done a lot of gear drives, now is not the time, to hope a bearing is ok. Pete

 

well the main bearings aren't seized - but equally they are hard to obtain in the UK. So I will be cleaning them out and seeing how smooth they run. The transmission hasn't turned since the fire, so it hasn't had bad stuff grinding it up.

All the torrington bearings are shot, they are seized - so will all be replaced as well as the seals. The casings and gears will be cleaned so there shouldn't need to be a flush. Once the bearings are out they can be steam cleaned and possibly e-tanked.

[peter lena 8,733]

do you know the main bearing numbers?  I was just looking at e bay , and various bearings are available. pete

[stevasaurus 22,871]

@wheelhorseman is a vendor here on Red Square.  Lowell sells the whole kit...bearings, seals and gasket, + the #1533 bearings if you need them.  Mark, that transmission #5053 will be like new when you get it finished.  The gears should clean up great.  Clean it all in diesel fuel and then sand blast it all with the plastic pellets. 

[meadowfield 2,595]

30 minutes ago, stevasaurus said:

@wheelhorseman is a vendor here on Red Square.  Lowell sells the whole kit...bearings, seals and gasket, + the #1533 bearings if you need them.  Mark, that transmission #5053 will be like new when you get it finished.  The gears should clean up great.  Clean it all in diesel fuel and then sand blast it all with the plastic pellets. 

 

I'm from yorkshire in England, we are like Scotsmen only our arms are shorter  (we don't like spending money - or rumour says we don't)

 

Ask Chris and Stormin, they know Yorkshire men are tight and at over $40 a bearing plus shipping and import it would be cheaper to buy a working tractor. 

[peter lena 8,733]

good on you ! now you are getting some ware , with a question ,comes an answer.my first reply to you was that you should just get after it. now others are stepping up with response. costly, yes , but like stevasaurus   said your gear box will be like new. look at the opportunity you have, to either buy the whole kit ,or if you can get bearings cheaper in the uk. just get the bigger (  and more difficult  to get ) bearings stateside. you can't nickel and dime this type of job, but you can realize how to take advantage of your options.  hope you get your parts and get this done, pete

[stevasaurus 22,871]

Peter is correct and you can just get the 1533 from Lowell...these are new bearings and at $40 apiece...that is 1/2 what TORO was selling them for when they still had some.  I relish being on the thrifty side myself...that is why I make my own wine.    Mark, I know you have been around long enough to know...buying another horse is no guarantee those bearings will be good either.  You should be able to buy all the other bearings and seals over there...make your own gasket.    BTW...Norm showed me his 1st Euro on Skype the other day.  

[peter lena 8,733]

stevasaurus, that's what I was thinking, I felt that meadowfield ,was complicating the problem ,when if you broke it down into sections , its easier to see. I am used to getting after it ,and if I can improve it along the way , that will happen too. maintenance ideas come with experience, take advantage of this one. pete

[meadowfield 2,595]

Thanks for the advice guys... I’ve popped all the bearings out. Not a lot left! 

 

 

Looking for hints on removing the 5/8 needle bearing from the input shaft. An internal bearing puller with slide hammer isn’t working.

[953 nut 55,837]

59 minutes ago, meadowfield said:

hints on removing the 5/8 needle bearing from the input shaft.

I presume you are talking about the closed end bearing. If you have a 13/16 drill bit (presuming the needles are out of it like the others) you could probably begin drilling it and have it snag on the bit enough to remove the rest of the jacket.

[stevasaurus 22,871]

Sorry Richard, he is talking the 5/8 one that sits inside the input shaft and the spline shaft fits inside of that..   I got a few of those out Mark.  Get the needles out 1st, then take a good, small and sharp screw driver...find the thin side and tap the screwdriver down in there.  Work it around, the metal is so thin and hard it rips easily and you can pull the rest with a needle nose pliers.     Great pictures of nasty bearings.

[meadowfield 2,595]

Thanks Steve, 

 

I tried peeling it in, the casing is very hard!

 

I resorted to the lathe...

[stevasaurus 22,871]

You can see how thin that casing is and that it is already ripping.  Of course, If you have a lathe.........    

[meadowfield 2,595]

22 hours ago, stevasaurus said:

You can see how thin that casing is and that it is already ripping.  Of course, If you have a lathe.........    

 

it was hard work to turn, those casings are hard - not as hard as a single row ball bearing housing, but still hard going...

 

Full set of bearings and seals ordered - I've cheated on some needle rollers and used caged rather than full complement. Will let you know how it goes, I don't think this tranny will ever work that hard...

[peter lena 8,733]

thanks for the heads up, I am glad he is going full route ,on this rebuild, he will be more than happy when done, pete

[stevasaurus 22,871]

Replacing everything should be around $150 to $200.  Well worth it if all of your gears and shafts are in good shape.  Beats the heck out of buying a used one somewhere. 

[Anglo Traction 761]

Hi Mark, Bit late to your Topic here, A rather more challenging job with the condition of that one, than I have on my 5091 8 speed.

Hoping to start on it soon. Been trying to compare spec of the BAM Caged type to the Full Comp, as you know, I have the same dilemma.

So far, it seems only the loading is reduced, but should cope well with what they are exposed to in these Trannys.

I'll be making Bearing Mandrels to fit each one for the ass'y, just to drag the process out and make a 'Knife and Fork' job of it !.

(Actually, it's because I get some Lathe time making them ).

Hope it gets easier and I'll follow your progess and reply to your MoM PM.

Regards    

[meadowfield 2,595]

A bit slow, I managed to order one one bearings wrong twice!   the small 5/8 one from the input shaft...

 

 

I think I've found a better way of putting the shift forks in, which is to fit of fork, then grind a bevel on the end of the other which is enough to push the other ball bearing in as it is inserted then spin the fork to align everything.

 

 

 

 

new gasket being made

 

 

finally, dropping the other half in without ruining two oil seals

 

It's back together and turning smoothly, fingers crossed it lasts another 50 years!

 

 

Edited July 13, 2018 by meadowfield