417A Won't move??

[GREYGHOST 65]

Purchased this Girl today. It only has 320 hrs showing on the hour meter. But it looks like those were some hard hours. The engine runs, but it won't move in either coward or reverse. It pushes easy. I power washed it when I got it home, easier to work on when its not dripping with oil & grease. I picked this in a package deal with a tiller, 2 wheel trailer, and a roller. Everything looks like it has been rode hard and put away wet & dirty. I doubt any preventive maintenance was done. Drained some real thick dirty oil out of the engine. I'm going to change all the fluids before I do anything else. I did a search here for 417A. The only thing that came up, was changing transmission oil. So, in the morning I'm going to take off both side panels and investigate further. I need to find some manuals. So anyone have any thoughts on what my problem is? Here's some before pics.

[19richie66 17,522]

There are manuals on here for the 418-A that is basically the same operations wise. Other than the wiring(417 has points, 418 is magneto) and the engine, same basic machine. May want to check the motion linkage, belt may be burnt and not turning the trans pulley, idler pulley bad or could not be tensioning the belt properly, low fluid, plugged hydro filter. There’s a start. Eaton 1100’s are very strong hydros. Hopefully its something simple.

[953 nut 55,840]

The 418-C I bought last fall was DOA and the PO gave up on it. The drive belt idler had fallen apart and eaten the drive belt. Only took a few minutes to get it back in action.

[shallowwatersailor 3,213]

Sounds as if the drive belt is disengaged or broken, if it pushes easily. Take the rear fender off to easily check.

[19richie66 17,522]

An Eaton 1100 will push easy and you should hear what sounds like steel balls rolling around as the pump turns while pushing.

[19richie66 17,522]

I sent you some manual links and here is a wiring diagram.

Edited April 14, 2018 by 19richie66

[GREYGHOST 65]

Thanks Everyone. After breakfast, its off to do some more investigating. The belt makes sense, because when I started her. I got a burning rubber smell. I shut it down right away.

[lynnmor 7,354]

Check the belt of course.  With that OK, check the oil level in the transmission, then run the engine at least five minutes before attempting to move, sometimes it takes a while to pressure up.

[GREYGHOST 65]

Well, I think I found one problem. It's just amazing that someone can let a nice piece of equipment go on this long and be so unaware of any problem. The Captain calls these folks IDIOTS. But I find it Amazing that she went on as long as she did in that condition. I guess you can say these Ol Girls are built Tough. Now for the real fun, to find the parts. 

[19richie66 17,522]

That will do it

[953 nut 55,840]

                I can't say for sure, but I would bet that you have the worst idler pulley ever to remain on the !      How that kept from falling off is beyond me.

[gwest_ca-(File Mod) 11,102]

Flat idler pulley - 3.219" OD - 3-7/32" - WH 2-4463 or 24463, 7434, 112426 replaced by 244-63 (Napa 7-05206 with flanges, Napa 7-05434 with flanges, Rotary 722, Stens 280-081 Std Flat OD 3.000" Width 7/8" Flat width 3/4" ID 3/8")

 

Flat idler pulley - 3.219" OD - 3-7/32" - WH 2-4463 or 24463, 7434, 112426 replaced by 244-63 (Napa 7-05206 with flanges, Napa 7-05434 with flanges, Rotary 722, Stens 280-586 HD bearing Flat OD 3.000" Width 7/8" ID 3/8")

 

Garry

[GREYGHOST 65]

Thanks for those P/Ns Gary. Looks like I have a very wide variety of choices. Gotta go to NAPA today for some truck parts so ill try one of those P/Ns. You wouldn't by chance have a NAPA P/N for the trans filter would ya?

 

953Nut, That's one for the books. The inner race was also broken in half. My photos didn't show that to well. The other amazing thing  is I inspected the belt and it looks fine for the age. I imagine its probably stretched . I don't see any c racks or burnt spots.

[19richie66 17,522]

Trans filter is a 1410

[GREYGHOST 65]

Ordered the pulley and filter from NAPA today. It will be Wednesday before I can pick them up. Ill keeplooking ya posted.

Edited April 17, 2018 by GREYGHOST

[Phil902 70]

What is the purpose of the fan attached to the rear pulley? Also a thank you to Gary, as I was coming on today to ask for this exact information. 

[Skipper 1,788]

The Fan blows air onto the hydro units cooling finns.

[Phil902 70]

Thanks. First time I've seen anything like that, not that I'm dripping with Wheel Horse experience   .  

[953 nut 55,840]

1 hour ago, Phil902 said:

What is the purpose of the fan attached to the rear pulley? Also a thank you to Gary, as I was coming on today to ask for this exact information. 

It is important to operate the engine at or near full throttle and regulate your speed with the motion controller. The hydro is going to overheat if you don't.

[Bert 760]

If you need anything besides a pulley and belt I’ve got good extra parts you can have for the cost of shipping, let us know 

[Phil902 70]

Thanks, 953. A neighbor tuned me in to that the first time he saw me going slowly by at low RPM.  The info I was coming on to ask for was the size of the idler pulley. Mine seized, and in taking it off, I found a few pieces shown on the IPL diagram were not present on the tractor: cotter pin, washers, and a nut. The pulley was marked nhi, and a Google search revealed that to be New Hampshire Industries out of Claremont. I began wondering if the pulley was correct, or a "close enough". A search of the forum led me to Gary's post with the info I was looking for; love this site.

[lynnmor 7,354]

1 hour ago, 953 nut said:

It is important to operate the engine at or near full throttle and regulate your speed with the motion controller. The hydro is going to overheat if you don't.

 

I had the bolt holding the fan come loose causing the fan to slip and run slowly.  It is unbelievable how hot the trans got in short order.  That bolt has threadlocker on it and it is hard to tell just how much it is clamping the plastic fan.  Since I am off on a tangent, look for cracks where the fan blades meet the hub.

[peter lena 8,734]

love the response to this neglect, Garry and others came thru with quick positive answers, I also like the multi point details, that's what you want , when it hits the fan. greyghost is very lucky to be properly steered  toward this repair. this will give him the insight and confidence  to go on to getting this tractor right. glad to see you getting help , Pete.

[GREYGHOST 65]

Finally got a chance to get back to work on this gal. I'm wanting to drain & flush the hydraulic system. I've got a new filter from NAPA. I'm not finding any drain plug and I'm not sure if I can use John Deere Hydraulic Fluid? 

Edited May 22, 2018 by GREYGHOST
Typo

[Bill D 1,941]

Use 10w-30 or 10w-40.  The drain plug in on the bottom of the transmission near the hitch.  Take the hitch off to make it easier to find.