mrshaft696 131 #1 Posted February 27, 2018 (edited) Im gonna start a thread on this tractor so I can keep track of progress on it. I got the tractor the other day from a guy on CL for 50.00 in unknown condition basically. Anyway this is it, a commando 8, 3 speed, 1969-70? with a original tecumseh engine. Plans are to get it running & clean it up, I dont really want to change the paint, the sun weathered look something you cant duplicate. Probably detail the engine a bit, clean up the wheels and try to keep this one kind of original looking since most of my tractor builds are modified. Get a seat, a headlight lens, no idea how I could fix that chrome fender trim, probably just leave it. There are two holes in the hood I dont know what they are for. Edited February 27, 2018 by mrshaft696 8 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshaft696 131 #2 Posted February 27, 2018 (edited) So tonight was the first time i messed with it, and after freeing up the starter and starter gear I got it to crank. I have proven I have good spark, but I am not sure yet about the fuel. This thing has 3 lines going to the pump on the carb, so i need to re-run or at least check all the lines, this happened to me on another tractor that the fuel pump line was clogged. So if i squirt carb cleaner in, it will run for a second... I do get a funky whine of some kind, not sure if it is a belt/pulley or what, I had to wrap up and go inside. So I will mess around with it again tomorrow. I cant believe you can't take off the engine cover without pulling the flywheel? At least i think that is the case... Edited February 27, 2018 by mrshaft696 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Howie 886 #3 Posted February 27, 2018 I would think the pulley would come off the top of flywheel. Looks like it is on there. to wrap a rope on to turn engine over. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshaft696 131 #4 Posted February 27, 2018 8 hours ago, Howie said: I would think the pulley would come off the top of flywheel. Looks like it is on there. to wrap a rope on to turn engine over. OK maybe the 3 posts on the top hold that pulley on, seems logical, I was thinking they were all together for some reason. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
classiccat 548 #5 Posted February 27, 2018 (edited) 45 minutes ago, mrshaft696 said: OK maybe the 3 posts on the top hold that pulley on, seems logical, I was thinking they were all together for some reason. it may seem like it when you go to separate...they're the same posts that a serrated receiver is secured to (for the recoil dogs.) that should be fine being gravity fed (bypass the fuel pump) at least for troubleshooting... unless you're working on the side of a hill Edited February 27, 2018 by classiccat Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshaft696 131 #6 Posted February 27, 2018 (edited) 14 minutes ago, classiccat said: it may seem like it when you go to separate...they're the same posts that a serrated receiver is secured to (for the recoil dogs.) that should be fine being gravity fed (bypass the fuel pump) at least for troubleshooting... unless you're working on the side of a hill That is interesting , I was kind of wondering why they bothered with a pump, heck the rebuild kit for it is almost as much as I paid for the tractor. I'm sure it will work but that will be a easy way to trouble shoot the fuel issue. Edited February 27, 2018 by mrshaft696 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Howie 886 #7 Posted February 27, 2018 Looks like the tank is high enough for it to gravity feed the carb. Not sure why they would put a fuel pump on there. If one were going to be used there are others that are cheaper. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshaft696 131 #8 Posted February 28, 2018 (edited) 7 hours ago, Howie said: Looks like the tank is high enough for it to gravity feed the carb. Not sure why they would put a fuel pump on there. If one were going to be used there are others that are cheaper. ok I played with the carb/pump a little tonight.. When I got home the carb was leaking a little so I dropped the bowl to inspect it & it looked ok, not too dirty & the float seemed ok, I didnt verify that it floated but the engine wasn't flooding. I pulled off all the lines and blew into them, the main fuel line was ok, the line behind the governor arm was ok, but the one at the bottom was clogged and when I remove it oil is draining out of it? I checked the oil and it is missing the dipstick thing but it is almost full to under the cap, so i think it might be overfull. Another sketchy thing is that the lines plugged into the bottom of the fuel pump are friction fit into it basically, so they can pull out of the bottom of it easily. Either way it still will only start on carb cleaner for a second, I guess i should pull and inspect the entire carb, clean it out. I am afraid to take apart the fuel pump, but might have too. Gonna replace all the lines too. I could test it without the pump but i would need one of those threaded barbed fittings. Edited February 28, 2018 by mrshaft696 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
classiccat 548 #9 Posted February 28, 2018 keep digging! This old tec will be growling at the neighbors in no time. Give the float a shake to see if it's holding fluid...it probably is due for a good cleaning. I believe the line you're finding some oil is actually the pulse line...the modulation of crankcase pressure pulses the fuel pump diaphragm. check fleabay for a rebuild kit for the fuel pump... do you think this one would fit? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Howie 886 #10 Posted February 28, 2018 Drain that crankcase before doing much else. I kind of wonder if the leaking carb drained into there. If the crankcase is that full it will push it out that pulse line. Could probably rebuild that pump or use one like Briggs uses. I would clean and rebuild carb also. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshaft696 131 #11 Posted February 28, 2018 10 hours ago, classiccat said: keep digging! This old tec will be growling at the neighbors in no time. Give the float a shake to see if it's holding fluid...it probably is due for a good cleaning. I believe the line you're finding some oil is actually the pulse line...the modulation of crankcase pressure pulses the fuel pump diaphragm. check fleabay for a rebuild kit for the fuel pump... do you think this one would fit? Yeah I believe that is the right kit, I did see it on parts tree and it was more expensive... Anyway why are there two lines, maybe I can figure out which one is which, my other mowers with a pump just have one pulse line? If the lower one is the pulse line there is no way it is working because it is leaking oil, which doesn't seem right. Either someone overfilled it or the gas leaked into it possibly. Ill pull the carb off later and start disassembly, on this model the bolts are really hard to turn, its very annoying. My engine is a #VH80-148001 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
classiccat 548 #12 Posted February 28, 2018 7 minutes ago, mrshaft696 said: Yeah I believe that is the right kit, I did see it on parts tree and it was more expensive... Anyway why are there two lines, maybe I can figure out which one is which, my other mowers with a pump just have one pulse line? If the lower one is the pulse line there is no way it is working because it is leaking oil, which doesn't seem right. Either someone overfilled it or the gas leaked into it possibly. Ill pull the carb off later and start disassembly, on this model the bolts are really hard to turn, its very annoying. My engine is a #VH80-148001 Ahh! I think you're confusing the breather tube with a second pulse tube; there is only 1 pulse tube. To clarify, that tube right next to the fuel pump is coming out of the breather / valve-cover. That's what allows air to escape on the piston down-strokes (then on the up-strokes, the reed closes and you maintain partial crankcase vacuum)... that tube doesn't connect to anything...just exhales outside of the block. You can also buy an aftermarket (plastic) fuel pump... I think Larry Winn sells them on fleabay as well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshaft696 131 #13 Posted February 28, 2018 (edited) 13 minutes ago, classiccat said: Ahh! I think you're confusing the breather tube with a second pulse tube; there is only 1 pulse tube. To clarify, that tube right next to the fuel pump is coming out of the breather / valve-cover. That's what allows air to escape on the piston down-strokes (then on the up-strokes, the reed closes and you maintain partial crankcase vacuum)... that tube doesn't connect to anything...just exhales outside of the block. You can also buy an aftermarket (plastic) fuel pump... I think Larry Winn sells them on fleabay as well. Quote I think you are 13 minutes ago, classiccat said: Ahh! I think you're confusing the breather tube with a second pulse tube; there is only 1 pulse tube. To clarify, that tube right next to the fuel pump is coming out of the breather / valve-cover. That's what allows air to escape on the piston down-strokes (then on the up-strokes, the reed closes and you maintain partial crankcase vacuum)... that tube doesn't connect to anything...just exhales outside of the block. You can also buy an aftermarket (plastic) fuel pump... I think Larry Winn sells them on fleabay as well. haha maybe but ill illustrate my confusion to clarify.....the ones I labeled "upper" and "lower" the one that says lower leaks oil when unplugged.... Edited February 28, 2018 by mrshaft696 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
classiccat 548 #14 Posted February 28, 2018 (edited) We're getting there... I can feel it! The lower (coming out the shroud): EDIT: the mystery line The pulse line is labeled "upper"... EDIT: Connects to the bottom pulse fitting. Looking closer...is that a "T" connection at the bottom of the fuel pump??? if so, that's just going to fill your Crankcase up with fuel (EDIT: if the mystery line is connected to a fuel source)! Edited February 28, 2018 by classiccat Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
classiccat 548 #15 Posted February 28, 2018 if you do decide to bypass the fuel pump for now, make sure you plug that pulse line. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshaft696 131 #16 Posted February 28, 2018 16 minutes ago, classiccat said: We're getting there... I can feel it! The lower (coming out the shroud) should be the coming from your tank (or a filter ...or a sediment bowl); That looks like it's properly connected. The pulse line is labeled "upper"... that I believe should connect to the fitting that you have labeled "fuel". Looking closer...is that a "T" connection at the bottom of the fuel pump??? if so, that's just going to fill your Crankcase up with fuel! yes it is a "T" fitting the I can pull out of the bottom, it is in there basically a friction fit, you can see in the 1st pic, it plugs into the bottom of the pump right next to the fuel inlet. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
classiccat 548 #17 Posted February 28, 2018 1 minute ago, mrshaft696 said: yes it is a "T" fitting the I can pull out of the bottom, it is in there basically a friction fit, you can see in the 1st pic, it plugs into the bottom of the pump right next to the fuel inlet. unless I'm misunderstanding how this particular impulse pump operates, I think we figured out why you got this tractor so cheap! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshaft696 131 #18 Posted February 28, 2018 (edited) 44 minutes ago, classiccat said: unless I'm misunderstanding how this particular impulse pump operates, I think we figured out why you got this tractor so cheap! haha maybe so, it seems logical that the fuel line and pulse line should be the only things going in. Without seeing another setup its hard to say how it got this way. Also wondering what the line coming out at the base of the engine is then.... Edited February 28, 2018 by mrshaft696 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshaft696 131 #19 Posted February 28, 2018 (edited) ok I googled for a while and was able to find a manual close to what I have & yeah where I have a "T" fitting it should just be a elbow for the pulse. So I have to take it off later and look at it, see if it can be fixed or what. Edited February 28, 2018 by mrshaft696 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
classiccat 548 #20 Posted February 28, 2018 1 hour ago, mrshaft696 said: Also wondering what the line coming out at the base of the engine is then.... you and me both brutha! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshaft696 131 #21 Posted February 28, 2018 3 minutes ago, classiccat said: you and me both brutha! I am not the first to wonder this, another guy asked the same question before, no answer on what it is, but this is not unique apparently. https://www.justanswer.com/small-engine/4hzku-just-bought-1970-wheel-horse-commando-tecumseh.html Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshaft696 131 #22 Posted February 28, 2018 jeez searching this forum I found another guy that had one, and his carb is setup the same way check it out.... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
classiccat 548 #23 Posted February 28, 2018 (edited) I'm intrigued... I wonder if this is an old school hack where they put a 2nd pulse line in on the other side of the block in order to get more pulse? go to the 1:39 mark of Larry Winn's video of a horizontal shaft HH tecumseh (single pulse line): Edited February 28, 2018 by classiccat Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshaft696 131 #24 Posted February 28, 2018 2 hours ago, classiccat said: I'm intrigued... I wonder if this is an old school hack where they put a 2nd pulse line in on the other side of the block in order to get more pulse? go to the 1:39 mark of Larry Winn's video of a horizontal shaft HH tecumseh (single pulse line): Yeah I see, I think the sears Tecumseh motors are set up like that and the wheel horse VH80 has the 3 lines of mystery. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshaft696 131 #25 Posted March 1, 2018 (edited) Got all the old fuel lines off, tank drained, and the oil changed, then ran out of time. I am going to try and start it one more time now that the lower "pulse" line is not clogged & the oil is at the correct level. Then rebuild the carb and pump when i get the parts. Got allot of projects to get going for spring. Edited March 1, 2018 by mrshaft696 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
