Horse'n Around 22 #1 Posted February 23, 2009 Howdy, I want to make a new wiring harness for my 702. Its wiring is intact but pretty messed up. I also have a diagram in case the wiring that is in it has been altered. Here is my problem and question.What guage wires should be used for the various applications? I could just go by the wiring thats in it, but I dont know if its origional and the wiring diagram while very easy to read and all does not say what gauge each wire should be. Can anyone tell me what gauge wire I should use. There appears to be 3 different gauge wires being used in it now but it looks cobbled. Any help you can give me is very apreciated, John Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brian1045 28 #2 Posted February 23, 2009 I used all 14-16 gauge wire for everything except the actual battery connections. It's easy to work with and easy to hide. I believe I grounded my battery with 8 gauge to the frame. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
linen beige 14 #3 Posted February 23, 2009 I'll try to remember to check the wire guages on mine tomorrow in the daylight and let you know. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Horse'n Around 22 #4 Posted February 24, 2009 Thank!!!! I appreciate your help a lot! John Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
linen beige 14 #5 Posted February 24, 2009 :thumbs: Oooopppssss. Can you give me one more day? I got caught up in another project today and although I walked past the 702 a couple times I forgot to check the wires for you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Horse'n Around 22 #6 Posted February 24, 2009 Hi Jim, That would be great,thank you so much. John Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
linen beige 14 #7 Posted February 24, 2009 Well, her goes, From battery + to starter switch is #6 red (Probably a newer replacement wire, original may have been #8.) Starter switch to starter (post toward rear) #8 black. Battery + to ammeter #12 red Ammeter to regulator (center tab) #12 yellow Regulator (left tab) to ignition off/on key switch #12 black Ignition key switch to coil + #14 red Coil - to points #12 (May be #14 with thick insulation) black Battery - to block #8 black Regulator (right tab) to starter (rear post) #14 black Starter (front post) to regulator (center, single tab on front bottom) #12 red. This wire melted on mine a while back and I replaced it. The original may have been a #14. I hope I didn't leave any wires out. If I were re-wiring one from scratch I would consider using NOTHING smaller than # 12 wire. I recommend using type THHN wire, rated at 90 deg. celcius. The outer covering is gas and oil resistant and takes heat very well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Horse'n Around 22 #8 Posted February 24, 2009 Bryan and Jim, I really appreciate your help.Now I can start working on the harness and see how the engine runs. I dont have a starter /generator but it looks like I can wrap a rope around the pulley and start it that way. One more question though.... does it need a battery connected to start it? As I said, I dont have a starter generator or a regulator yet so even if I connect the battery, it wont be connected to all the electrical that are missing. I just want to hear it run so bad Thanks again, youve helped more than you can know! John Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sorekiwi 761 #9 Posted February 25, 2009 You'll need a battery to power up the ignition coil (I'm assuming you have the external coil on your motor, not a magneto). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Horse'n Around 22 #10 Posted February 25, 2009 You'll need a battery to power up the ignition coil (I'm assuming you have the external coil on your motor, not a magneto). Yup, there is a coil mounted to the front of the engine behind the grill.The only small gas engines Im used to working on are the ones that have the magneto such as in push mowers and mini bikes with Briggs and Tecumsehs' etc. Thank you for clearing that up, I will just make the harness and install the battery and give her a try and see if or how it runs. John Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sarge 3,463 #11 Posted February 25, 2009 Not trying to second guess anyone, but isn't that ammeter wiring a bit on the light side ? The rest of it sounds about right though... Sarge Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
linen beige 14 #12 Posted February 25, 2009 Not trying to second guess anyone, but isn't that ammeter wiring a bit on the light side ? The rest of it sounds about right though... Sarge It appears to be the original wiring. But I would agree that you may be on to something since the insulation on the yellow wire is suffering from "post overheating cracked, wrinkled, burned in spots" syndrom. That happened when the starter switch shorted and the tractor went for a starter motor powered ride that lasted until it climbed a stump, wedged against a fence, and kept running until some wiring melted. Tip; Don't get water in the switch if you can help it. # 12 wire should hold a continuous 20 amps of current. I've not checked the max output of the charging system on this but I don't think it will put out 20 amps. John, The 702 came out with a Kohler K-161, spec #28626E. It's a battery ignition engine with a starter/generator setup. This setup HAS to have a battery in order to work. It sounds like yours has been repowered. Not knowing what engine (more specifically what type ignition) is in yours makes it hard to say how it should be wired. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Horse'n Around 22 #13 Posted February 25, 2009 Jim, Its all origional but the starter generator was removed before I bought it. The engine still has all the hardware for the starter , the wires for the starter and all are there but the condition of the wires are poor but they are all different and they have random different connectors crimped on them and it looks like someone just cobbled their own up wiring so I figured I would redo them so I can be sure they are right and made with the right guage wire etc..The spec# on the engine is 28662E and it does have the coil mounted on the side of the engine between it and the grille.The tractor even has the origional ign switch with the key that is split and it has the starter switch that looks like a dimmer switch.From what I can see the only thing that has been changed is the seat which is padded is from a Snapper and the strap that secures the battery in battery tray is home made so I need to find one of those when I can.The belt guards are in nice shape so is the steering wheel (well it has one small crack in it).All the sheet metal is in really good shape also, the hood only has a couple of small dings which will be easy to dolly out. Its never been repainted but it sure needs it! The belt guard still has the 702 decal on it.Everything except the wiring is in really good shape, its just been sitting a long time.It needs some TLC and it defineately needs to be restored.The tires look origional but they are cracked pretty bad but still hold air. My other Wheel Horse is another matter, it was left to me by my Dad. It was made in 1962 according to the serial number on the shift decal,and it too is a round nose. Who ever had it before Dad extended the frame a good 7 inches in the front and installed a K181 in it.This one has a gear driven electric starter. From what I can tell origionally it was equipped with a engine with a pull starter,Im guessing it was a 502.The place that on my 702 that has the starter switch(which looks for all the world like a dimmer switch) has what looks like a knock out plug in its place and where the key switch would be is blank.One thing I did notice is that the shifter is straight rather than curved. I dont know which model that would have come on. The trans is a uni-drive like the one in the 702.The hood is an extended 701 hood and its pretty dented up but I can fix it up just fine.Too bad it isnt a 1962 hood but I will make due with it since I dont plan restoring it in that sence of the word.It will look and run like new but it will still be a mutt of sorts. It really runs good, if you pop the clutch it does a pretty good wheelie When Im done with the 702 Im going to undo the extensions that were done to the frame and hood. They cobbled the frame extention, but luckily they did it in such a way where it will be easy to return to the way it should be. I will take a picture of what they did and post it, boy you wont believe it hahahaha. You want to talk about a hack job...... WOW......Like I said it will be a snap to fix though. I think Im just going to remove the extended part of the hood and use it. Im going to keep the K181 in it and make it kind of a 702 clone with a 701 hood. I am going to go thru it piece by piece just as if I was restoring it and paint it up nice! Thanks, John Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
linen beige 14 #14 Posted February 25, 2009 You're aging yourself there talking about a floor mounted dimmer switch John. But, if'n ya was a bit older you'd be saying it was like a floor mounted starter switch (dimmers clicked, starters didn't). Sounds like basically all you need is to find a good starter generator and a regulator. These were made by Delco-Remi. When considering one for purchase be mindful of the rotation. The Wheel Horse ones rotated clockwise when viewed from the drive pulley end. There were different lengths as well. The straight shift lever was probably original to your 502. The bent ones showed up in mid '62 to provide clearance for the pump on the HY-2 hydro lift option. The instructions for the lift installation tell you to either bend the straight shift lever or replace it with a factory bent one. 701 hoods are kind of hard to find. If you want to replace yours with a proper '62 hood it shouldn't be too hard to find someone more than willing to trade. The '62 prefix on the serial number decals was carried over into the early to mid '63 models, until decal supplies ran out, so it can't be relied on solely for identifying year model. Among other differences, if yours has a single tie rod it is a '62. The '63s used double tie rods for a tighter turning radius. I would guess it is a '62 since it has the straight shift lever. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
daemon2525 5 #15 Posted February 25, 2009 I got a lot of crap on the Chat for it (because it was not original). However, I actually replaced the Starter key on both my 1056 and 1057 with the large push button starter switches. I like it better than the key. It appears to be more rugged and handle more amperage. (no solenoids). Also, no key to lose. They are available at NAPA and cost 28$. So if ya wanna try and steal one of my horses, you will not need to bring a key. (just a pork chop for the dogs). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Horse'n Around 22 #16 Posted February 25, 2009 You're aging yourself there talking about a floor mounted dimmer switch John. But, if'n ya was a bit older you'd be saying it was like a floor mounted starter switch (dimmers clicked, starters didn't). Sounds like basically all you need is to find a good starter generator and a regulator. These were made by Delco-Remi. When considering one for purchase be mindful of the rotation. The Wheel Horse ones rotated clockwise when viewed from the drive pulley end. There were different lengths as well. The straight shift lever was probably original to your 502. The bent ones showed up in mid '62 to provide clearance for the pump on the HY-2 hydro lift option. The instructions for the lift installation tell you to either bend the straight shift lever or replace it with a factory bent one. 701 hoods are kind of hard to find. If you want to replace yours with a proper '62 hood it shouldn't be too hard to find someone more than willing to trade. The '62 prefix on the serial number decals was carried over into the early to mid '63 models, until decal supplies ran out, so it can't be relied on solely for identifying year model. Among other differences, if yours has a single tie rod it is a '62. The '63s used double tie rods for a tighter turning radius. I would guess it is a '62 since it has the straight shift lever. If the truth be known, the vehicle that my Dad taught me how to drive in was a 1947 Dodge pickup and yup it had the starter switch/pedal on the floor.Im 45 but thats what I learned to drive in (Dad started teaching me when I was 12 on the deserted dirt roads out here) He was the greatest !!!! I remember the starting drill was to put your toe on the starter switch and heel on the gas pedal since you sometimes had to work both to start it if it was cold out.You also had to double clutch it when you shifted it or the gears would grind something fierce! It had a flathead 6 cyl and the elect system was 6 volt with a positive ground. I really miss that truck.... I wish with all my heart that I still had it, but the engine got really tired and we had it rebuilt buy someone here and he really messed it up bad so we got rid of it.It was a dark green with a black bed and it had red wheels.I have such wondefull memories of my Dad with that truck John Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brian1045 28 #17 Posted February 26, 2009 You're aging yourself there talking about a floor mounted dimmer switch God I miss those days.... :thumbs: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Duff 206 #18 Posted February 26, 2009 God I miss those days.... Amen, brother, amen..... Duff :thumbs: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
