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Ed Kennell

What have you done to your Wheel Horse today?

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Brockport Bill
4 minutes ago, Sodaking27 said:

Finally after being sidelined for almost 2 months with ankle and Achilles tendinitis was able to spend a little time working on the C175. Removed all the hoses and lift valve. Rebuilt the lift valve. Discovered the rear finder mounting bracket where it normally breaks was in need of welding. Have a friend who has a welding service and he’s going to stop by one evening to take care of it. 
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did the master hydraulic lift valve job on a c175H last year -- absolute nightmare getting that in and out of that location in hoodstand --  replaced the "O" rings and the 4 hoses -- i still have the wounds on my hands from trying to manipulate the unit into that space and remove and then install the bolts -- Unfortunately i have another c175 h that is leaking fluid from the master valve and have to do that job --UGH !!!

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Sodaking27
3 minutes ago, Brockport Bill said:

did the master hydraulic lift valve job on a c175H last year -- absolute nightmare getting that in and out of that location in hoodstand --  replaced the "O" rings and the 4 hoses -- i still have the wounds on my hands from trying to manipulate the unit into that space and remove and then install the bolts -- Unfortunately i have another c175 h that is leaking fluid from the master valve and have to do that job --UGH !!!

I hear you. The long oval seal was a pain to keep in place when putting back together. Hopefully no leaks when I get it all back together.

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Brockport Bill
1 hour ago, Sodaking27 said:

I hear you. The long oval seal was a pain to keep in place when putting back together. Hopefully no leaks when I get it all back together.

actually i was never able to determine what or where was the leak??????? Was it "O" ring leaking at the piston valve -- or a connection of a hose?? so i just went the $130 to get 4 hoses and also do the O ring replacement  -- thinking might as well make it right and not have to do job a second time.

wh c175 hydro master valve removal.jpg

wh c175 hydro master valve -used.jpg

wh c175 hydro master valve used 2.jpg

wh c175 hydro master valve piston.jpg

wh c175 hydro hoses new.jpg

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peter lena

  @BBQVultureWings   just your  insight into electrical  enhancement , would go handily here , often suggest anything that  has helped me out , we all share an interest to common problems , regularly experiment  with a cure / improvement , any other  electrical grounding insight that could be used on a  wheel horse wiring set up ? pete 

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peter lena

 @Sodaking27 noting the belt drive idler pulley , original ? come with a very small bearing that , is known for failure / noise / rough , while you are there , might  be worth an inspection and a re fit . since going after anything with a bearing , don't even think about not replacing or RE GEASING IT , is that a wanna be HEIM JOINT on that linkage ? use them regularly , anywhere , pete 

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MainelyWheelhorse
4 hours ago, BBQVultureWings said:

 

Not a bad idea.... Retired Electrician here. I did Primarily Inndustrial Process control work as well as Some commercial & the dreaded residential wiring (dreaded as it is really pretty boring repetitive work mostly lights, light switches & plugs....) I don't have too much trouble with electrical systems & I Certainly do Not know Everything either as there is Always something else to learn...  I haven't decided what all accessories or improvements will be added but I like the LEDs because they draw very little current & at 12V DC it can get to be an issue really fast with resistive loads like lights but the LED improvements in recent years have nearly eliminated that problem. By the way I would use NoAlox anti corrosion compound such as Ideal 30-030  or equivalent Rather than dielectric grease

Thanks for the suggestion.


I did find an interesting difference between the 92 312-8 and the 87 308-8. Apparently sometime between the 308 and the 312 there was a change where the 308 has to be running to use the lights. The 312 doesn’t. The 308 also has an interesting flicker at idle with the lights on. The 312 doesn’t. Probably a connection issue as everything on the 308 is looser.

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ebinmaine
7 minutes ago, MainelyWheelhorse said:


I did find an interesting difference between the 92 312-8 and the 87 308-8. Apparently sometime between the 308 and the 312 there was a change where the 308 has to be running to use the lights. The 312 doesn’t. The 308 also has an interesting flicker at idle with the lights on. The 312 doesn’t. Probably a connection issue as everything on the 308 is looser.

 

 

 

That could be two different electrical systems. 

Others would be better at explaining that. 

@Ed Kennell

@wallfish

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wallfish
22 minutes ago, MainelyWheelhorse said:


I did find an interesting difference between the 92 312-8 and the 87 308-8. Apparently sometime between the 308 and the 312 there was a change where the 308 has to be running to use the lights. The 312 doesn’t. The 308 also has an interesting flicker at idle with the lights on. The 312 doesn’t. Probably a connection issue as everything on the 308 is looser.

The 308 runs the lights on AC straight from the stator I believe. So RPM would make a difference and only produces power when running.

The 312 is going to run that AC to a rectifier/regulator so the power is 12v DC and consistent and connects to the battery

The charging stators under the flywheel are different set ups

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MainelyWheelhorse
27 minutes ago, wallfish said:

The 308 runs the lights on AC straight from the stator I believe. So RPM would make a difference and only produces power when running.

The 312 is going to run that AC to a rectifier/regulator so the power is 12v DC and consistent and connects to the battery

The charging stators under the flywheel are different set ups

Ok, thanks, that makes sense.
 

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Handy Don
1 hour ago, MainelyWheelhorse said:

The 308 also has an interesting flicker at idle with the lights on.

I just took a look at the wiring diagram for the 308. It appears that the lights are connected directly to the stator--no regulator or diode. This means alternating current and voltage dependent on the RPM.

Edited by Handy Don

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MainelyWheelhorse
24 minutes ago, Handy Don said:

I just took a look at the wiring diagram for the 308. It appears that the lights are connected directly to the stator--no regulator or diode. This means alternating current and voltage dependent on the RPM.

@Handy Don Ok, thanks I figured it would be a bit more direct and bare bones than the 312.

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BBQVultureWings
4 hours ago, peter lena said:

  @BBQVultureWings   just your  insight into electrical  enhancement , would go handily here , often suggest anything that  has helped me out , we all share an interest to common problems , regularly experiment  with a cure / improvement , any other  electrical grounding insight that could be used on a  wheel horse wiring set up ? pete 

I am pretty meticulous about my main Ground connection. If I drill a hole or use an existing hole, I will also scrape away just enough paint for the flat side of the crimp connector (lug) to have clean metal to electrically bond to. I use a good amount of No-Alox (any of those products from Ideal or GB work) The purpose is to eliminate oxidation & corrosion from the disimilar metals reacting with each other over time as current is passing through them & the frame or engine block of our machine.

 Most of the time it is a bigger concern when joining an aluminium conductor to a lug or to a splice with copper under a split bolt or something like that in a big & older piece of electrical equipment.  which, unless you are an electrician, you probably will never see such a thing...

Anyway the best thing to do is put the stuff on like somebody else is payin' for it. tighten it down with an appropriate fastener ( :soapbox:  meaning: the diameter of your fastener shoud be as close as possible to the same diameter {at a Minimum} of your conductor (wire) for example #3 copper is 0.229 inch so We would  thiMk We should use at the very least 0.25 or 1/4" bolt for this connection, BUT let's consider this about the bolt & its diameter inclluding threads, is 1/4", 

:soapbox:  including threads :soapbox:.

  So, how much material was removed from the round stock to make the threads & the resulting bolt? in this example of 1/4-20 the inner diameter is  0.196 inches. so we lose 0.054 of material. this is now much less than the diameter of our #3 conductor (wire) 0.229  Or  that being said, if this is the Main ground, you suggested 3/8" & I DO agree with that because our inner diameter of 3/8-16 is 0.307 inch which is larger than the conductor in ouir example setting.... or say #2 copper is 0.2576 inch so our suggested bolt of 3/8 has an inner diameter of 0.307 inch  So the 3/8 bolt will work here as well.

  Also when making my own cables I use Extra Hard usage SO conductors or welding cable because the insulation is very flexible & Exremely tough stuff. I use the correct type of crimping tool & I also like my Shrink tubing to keep dirt, oils, gasoline, water & other foreign debris out of my crimp connections. Kinda like fuel hoses, when they are brittle & dry, it is time to replace them. Cables Last a Lot Longer than fuel lines do & copper wire is Never cheap. Once in a whlie I will find a welding cable in good condition at a garage sale or swap meet & IF the price is right, I will buy it. 

  So to give a shorter simpler answer to Enhancing a connection, Get some No-Alox anti corrosion compound & apply it to the threads of of your bolt, a dab of it in the barrel of your crimp on lug, the surface you plan on bolting to, the lug & any washers you are gonna use. torque to your desired tightness yet, remember that "Too tight's Broke" (Journeyman Jay....a guy I worked around a lot as an apprentice) & as electricians we have a tendancy to overtighten these connections sometimes. A lot of bolted connections on the machine will leave enough room for a Ground connection. Do As YOU Like. The points I mention are based on my preferences & what TO ME seems like common sense based upon My experience. These are some things to consider when making these connections Permenant, Efficiently & Safely.....  I hope that helps.

  As I get things going on my "Herd", I will try to remember to at least take pictures & maybe even make a video to help the people who are often intimidated by electrical stuff as it can seem like teaching a fish to climb a tree in some cases & The unfamiliar territory factor can be intimidating for anyone with anything. For Moo-Wah, hydro static transmissions are new territory & somewhat intimidating because I am Not familiar with them.

 Well I tried my best to Not Nerd anyone's eyeballs out with a super long response here today...  Just some points I have considered over the years in my experiences which I Hope will be able to help someone. As for improving a wheelhorse set up, I have yet to really tear into a system yet but I will certainly Chime in If I find something that I need to rant or rave about.... not that anyone really cares about opinions because we all know what they say about opinions.....

 

Edited by BBQVultureWings
forgot address a point near the end...
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BBQVultureWings
17 hours ago, MainelyWheelhorse said:


I did find an interesting difference between the 92 312-8 and the 87 308-8. Apparently sometime between the 308 and the 312 there was a change where the 308 has to be running to use the lights. The 312 doesn’t. The 308 also has an interesting flicker at idle with the lights on. The 312 doesn’t. Probably a connection issue as everything on the 308 is looser.

  New owners were most likely inadvertently leaving the lights on & draining the battery & causing :angry-argument: complaints :ranting: with :angry-cussing: dealers :angry-cussingblack: & shops even though it is their own fault for not checking when leaving the machine..... I have done some :teasing-dunce: hairbrained :teasing-dunce: stuff in my time as i Believe we All have.... I have accidently hit the light switch on my 1995 Crapsman LT1000 & I have also left the key in the on position, :angry-banghead:   both incidents drained the battery   :angry-screaming: ... I haven't looked at any schematics :scared-shocked: for the wiring in the models you mentioned but I would bet they changed the lights to only when running for that reason Which to Moo-Wah, makes good sense & I would actually prefer it to be that way so I dont leave lights on during the day when I am mowing & don't realize I  brushed up against the switch or a branch sprung :auto-layrubber: back & hit it or something like that. As for the flicker at idle, that will just be that way because the Higher RPMs are going to increase the output by design. This is Not a Pickup truck alternator & the space available to include that sort of assembly under the flywheel of Any small engine is, well, quite small.   that's my best guess & opinion... We all know what they say about opinions....

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peter lena

 @Sodaking27  noting your ankle tendinitis , hope its better , have a hip replacement coming up , in a few weeks , actually looking forward to it  , its a very regular thing today , 1, 1/2 hr  operation , up about  very shortly afterword . better to get things done than collect them. this aint 1950 , glue a mako lazer set up on you , and the work is spot on , tech / doctor , follows x rays , pete 

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MainelyWheelhorse

On today’s episode…. I fixed some of the rattles with some o rings on the 308-8, with the big one being the worn hood hinges. After putting them on twice backwards, I figured it out. Just to realize that the 312’s hinges are and have been for a year and a half backwards🙄🤬And… I attempted to do a more recent profile picture. I might try again tomorrow with that.

 

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Edited by MainelyWheelhorse
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ebinmaine

 

There's some engine swapping in the future around here.  

Cinnamon Horse C160-8 has a ticking I'm not fond of. 

Also another C160-8 for a future project. 

Possibly an 8 HP for the BBT.  

 

I stopped in to see my small engine repair guy for a minute. 

Told him what I was looking to do for my two 16 HP Kohlers. 

Basic mostly stock rebuild but if I can squeeze a couple or five extra HP out, why not?

 

He said he can do everything but turn the crank and may have sources for that.

Said he hasn't done one for a while but seemed like he would look forward to messing around with fully rebuildable old iron instead of the disposable garbage he normally does.

 

No balance gears.

Milling the head 40 or 50 thousandths. 

Overbore to be determined...

 

 

 

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MainelyWheelhorse

@ebinmaine Hey..while your at it Amazon supercharger or eBay turbo one 😎 I haven’t seen that often.

Edited by MainelyWheelhorse
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ebinmaine

A supercharger ehh......?

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MainelyWheelhorse

IMG_2560.png.7adbccabd92b49106ad3120073cde2b0.png
 

It sounds like I’m convincing you…😁

Edited by MainelyWheelhorse
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ebinmaine
33 minutes ago, MainelyWheelhorse said:

 
 

It sounds like I’m convincing you…😁

 

 

If I was building a "show only" tractor I'd absolutely install a S/C just because.....

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MainelyWheelhorse

Still might be fun to bomb around on…,

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Handy Don
59 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

A supercharger ehh......?

A while back I saw someone in Vermont (?) selling a 520-8 that he’d modded to use a Subaru turbocharger. Video showed it had run at one point. It was a real Rube Goldberg install, though. Maybe he’d planned on a modified class for pulling?

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Bill D
3 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

A supercharger ehh......?

Ask @fast88pu about turbocchargers.

Edited by Bill D
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BBQVultureWings

Yesterday the 257 had a Flat :angry-cussingblack: so I put some slime in it for the time being.... I hate to use that stuff as it is really messy when changing the tire....  After some slime & some air I put it back on the Tractor & then spun the tire as fast as i could for about 5 minutes to hopefully thoroughly Coat the inside & eliminate the leak.... Today I found some keystock at the big box store today while getting other stuff for other projects that require attention before the "Herd" gets their much Needed Attention. At least I have stuff at the ready when I can escape these other tedious & Not as cool projects.... Hoping for a full day on sunday with Real Progress to share.

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ML3

Although it might be early.....got the 654 ready for snow plowing duty. Now that leaves are falling the rear discharge deck doesn't work good for leaf pick up so I'm using my 33" Troy Bilt walk behind mower.

 

Changed oil, greased all fittings, removed mower deck & installed plow, installed weights, & upgraded to led lights. 

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Edited by ML3
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