RANT (sorry) Allis Chalmers Blues

[ACman 7,618]

Sorry haven’t been around. For some reason everything I was following just stopped  ? Anyways these guys are giving you good advice. I’m still up for coffee when ever you want to meet up . If you have questions and my dad ever answers the phone he’ll try to help you best he can . There’s pullers around these parts who will only let him touch/rebuild their carburetor . They swear by his abilities to have them spot on when they bolt them back on .

[Pullstart 62,913]

Yeah Jeff, we need to set a date for some coffee and chats...  I'll get the ole girl chirpin' along some day, I've got a few acres of food plot to tend to come spring!

[Pullstart 62,913]

So I was able to get some time out in the shop.  I drilled and tapped the broken studs, they just wouldn't come out with an easy out, and with extension cords I couldn't get good enough penetration to weld a nut onto the broken studs, they kept shearing off.  So now the intake/exhaust manifold is sealed to the head and I have good vacuum at the carb. 

 

still no start, not even trying.  I noticed gas coming from the intake part of the carb, so I pulled it apart last night thinking maybe it's flooding out.  there was a reasonable amount of rust and junk in the bowl, so I parts washed all the pieces, blew it all out with air and re-assembled.  at midnight, it was time to come in.  I'll toss it back on and see if I can't get it to fire.  I also loosened the valves about 1/8th of a turn, they seemed to be tight after the lifters received oil pressure after so much cranking.  I'd rather tighten them up once it gets fired up than run them too tight.  The distributor hasn't moved since it was running strong on #1 only, so I can't see timing as a problem.

 

more to come.

[C-101plowerpower 1,605]

how is the distibuter cap thing? might be old and porous letting moisture in and shorting things out, our cub does that every once in a while, especially when its foggy out

[ACman 7,618]

Pullstart could you pm me a picture of the exhaust manifold and muffler . I’m just curious how all the water got into the engine. All the WD’s we own get a can over the muffler without problems . I’ve seen problems on the B’s and C’s especially with aftermarket mufflers (not shielded like OEM) letting in past the threads on the manifold .  

[Pullstart 62,913]

2 hours ago, C-101plowerpower said:

how is the distibuter cap thing? might be old and porous letting moisture in and shorting things out, our cub does that every once in a while, especially when its foggy out

 

Hey Koen!    I have good spark to the plugs, the funny thing is that it sparked enough (strength and timing wise) to fire the thing without hassle on just 1 cylinder.  I figure if I boosted compression to all 4 cylinders, the thing should chug right along, right?  I even for grins pulled 2-4 plugs to see if #1 would fire it again and nothing still.

 

1 hour ago, ACman said:

Pullstart could you pm me a picture of the exhaust manifold and muffler . I’m just curious how all the water got into the engine. All the WD’s we own get a can over the muffler without problems . I’ve seen problems on the B’s and C’s especially with aftermarket mufflers (not shielded like OEM) letting in past the threads on the manifold .  

 

I'll see about a picture of the exhaust, but the muffler slides into the top of the exhaust manifold, the shield is only on the outside where the bolts hold it on... so even with a 5 gallon bucket over the top of the pipe, water flying sideways in the wind was able to run down the side of the pipe into the manifold.  It's less than slip-fit  but I ran it for a bit with no muffler (I like loud) and think some day I'll be inclined to do a 2 or 3" straight stack with a rain cap, incorporating a rain guard onto the manifold/mount.

[C-101plowerpower 1,605]

maybe the sparkplugs fail under pressure? wont be the first time it happened. also our cub has great spark but sometimes it doesnt because the moisture

[Pullstart 62,913]

Fair enough, I'll pick up a set of plugs and see if that helps... and go from there.  It must be something simple I suppose!

[Pullstart 62,913]

Still no fire with new plugs, charged the battery up and found this excerpt from www.yesterdaystractors.com:

 

In order to get it timed roughly and get the engine started, put the TDC mark in the middle of the inspection hole with #1 cylinder at top of compression stroke. May have to take #1 spark plug out and hold your thimb over the hole while someone else turns it over with the crank to determine when it's coming up on the compression stroke. After TDC mark is in hole, take cap off distributor so you can see the points. Loosen the bolts holding the two clamps that hold the distributor, then grab the outside of the distributor and turn it back and forth a little (the motor doesn't turn over) and watch the points. Clamp it in place at the spot where the points are just starting to open. Now put the rotor back on and where it's pointed will be where you want to hook up #1 spark plug wire. Put the cap back on, and hook up the wires. Remember the firing order is 1243 clockwise around the distributor. Now, start the tractor. It is best to use a timing light and while the engine is running wide open, loosen those clamps again and turn the distributor so that the Fire mark appears in the hole while using the timing light. Also, you can just do it by ear and get pretty close. TUrn the distributor back and forth while the engine is running wide open. You'll hear it labor when too far advanced and also too far retarded. Set it about halfway in between where the engine runs nice and free. Make sure you have the point gap set correctly, too.

 

http://www.yesterdaystractors.com/cgi-bin/viewit.cgi?bd=ac&th=48509

 

Maybe that will help, just checking to see that the points are opening when they should.  I think I'll make sure the gap is between .018 and .022 while I'm at it!

[Pullstart 62,913]

Moral of the story... check your points!  If the gap is good, clean them and check the gap again!  My gap was about .030" instead of .020".  I gapped the points.. then I lost spark.  So I cleaned them with some fine emory paper and got a good strong spark again.  Then she fired!  Runs great!  I have a good coolant leak where the thermostat housing meets the head (new gasket) so I'll take that apart and goop it with some RTV and try it again.  Ohh it feels so good to pull the lever and it roars to life again!  

[ebinmaine 67,628]

8 hours ago, pullstart said:

and try it again.

and try it again.

and try it again.

 

  Ohh it feels so good to pull the lever and it roars to life again!  

 

Just read the last few posts here... Well done.

Love it when something simple bats you around a bit.

 

If you move the timing - I've had a couple in the past that sounded good at no-load but needed adjustment "in the field"... Try to make the tractor work now while you don't need to and be sure it's happy while under load... before you really need it to be.

[Pullstart 62,913]

Took 'er for a quick spin around the wood pile yesterday, bunch of smoke (I think the exhaust cleaning out from so much unburnt fuel and diesel leftovers from freeing it up) and I need to get the coolant leak under control, but even starting in 4th gear it popped right to life and took off with a charge.  I think once the coolant is sealed up and the exhaust cleans up, everything will be good to go! 

[Pullstart 62,913]

Little update, the t-stat housing that bolted to the head (via head bolts, one blind that wont allow a socket/torque wrench) had a brand new gasket, but the shape of the hole was a bit off and the housing sheared about 1.5" of gasket length off... creating quite the geyser effect.  I pulled it a while back, set up some silicone gasket maker and placed it back together.  I'll have to re-torque/tighten the head studs then filler' up and try again.  6 days to Christmas, do I have time to get the wide front done too?

[Pullstart 62,913]

Ok, head is torqued back down and water stays where water's supposed to be!  Yay!

 

So, I started pulling the narrow front apart.  I've read plenty of posts that say "yes, it can be done"  well here's some pointers that I have figured out so far:

 

For a jack stand I used a big round chunk of fire wood about 20" high on end, then a couple 20" long pieces of 6x6 under the frame rails, once I used the cherry picker to lift the front end off the ground.  I also unhooked the battery, so when the tractor was in gear the starter didn't actually bump the engine over and knock it off the jack stand.

The 8 bolts holding the steering head in are the easy part.  

The distributor drive housing needs to be pulled off the engine.  I think I haven't moved it, but I should have marked the distributor/rotor before I pulled it off.  There's an oil line that needs to be loosened to get the distributor housing off.

With that out of the way, you can drive the dowel out of the steering u-joint.  This is a fun part: separating the steering shaft from the u-joint!  I got the torches out and heated the u-joint casting up red hot, then got behind the wheel and turned to full lock and pulled backwards as I kept spinning the shaft (loose in the hot u-joint casting) until it came apart and I about fell off the back of the tractor (ok, I did fall off but caught myself most of the way down).

Now, the steering shaft is apart and the steering head is loose... or without bolts.  But it's still very much in the frame rails.

I loosened the bolts about 2 turns each that hold the transmission between the rails, and I loosened one frame rail from the rear axle housing.  The front engine crossmember, I pulled one bolt out and left the other in.  The transmission is holding the engine up, but this will keep one frame rail relatively in line and I figured only one needed to come out.  There are two bolts from underneath holding the radiator tight to the frame rail, those went the same way.  One loose and one out.

Next step:  Get a porta-power, or a bottle jack.  Push the frame rails apart about 1/2-3/4" and try to get the steering head loose.  Then move the porta-power between the engine crossmember and the steering head and start working it out.  When you're close, wrap a chain around the steering assembly and tie it up to the cherry picker.  Keep working it out, till you've got a 2 wheeled tractor!

 

At this point, I've got to get over to grampa's place to load up the wide front end and get it into the garage.  This should all be doable before Christmas, right?

[AMC RULES 37,130]

      

[ACman 7,618]

You got this handled .... but like Craig said  !

 

[AMC RULES 37,130]

    

 

            

[Pullstart 62,913]

18 hours ago, AMC RULES said:

      

 

17 hours ago, ACman said:

You got this handled .... but like Craig said  !

 

 

17 hours ago, AMC RULES said:

    

 

            

 

 

 

Aww shucks guys, thanks!  Well, hard to deny good comp'ny... Here you are!

 

One might think that Pabst can jumped in for the photo op, but it just so happens a buddy dropped by with a thanks for a snow plow job well done...

 

 

I'm gonna plan to start the install later today, or tomorrow depending on when Grampa will have his loader back from the neighbor's place.  Hopefully the porta-power will be out of the way enough there to start sliding the steering head into the frame rails (assisted by a block of wood and a BFH most likely, along with the cherry picker, floor jack, levers, grunting, etc...)

 

 

Here you can see where the steering u-joint goes, between the block and the frame rail, under the distributor area.  That may just be the most challenging part of the wide front install.  The guy at the tractor junk yard I got it from kept the steering shaft and wheel intact with the front end, he says it's easier that way.  I'd agree, if the engine weren't in the tractor I think.

 

Edited December 20, 2017 by pullstart
commentary..

[Pullstart 62,913]

It's a better tractor than when we picked it up.  It's been a while, but I'd like to say it runs better than ever before, along with having a tight front end.  That narrow front was done worn out, let alone not being wide.  Plus, I lucked out putting the distributor assembly back together, she purred right to life!  The only thing left to do for now is fix the ignition switch... err lack of one.  Since we get it there's been a red wire sticking through an eyelet on a white wire... and you pull the red wire out enough for them to touch... and you have power to the coil.  EEK!

 

 

 

 

Oh, by the way... most of the junk in the background isn't mine.  Just imagine how many tractors and other toys I'll be able to store in that 50x80 building!  

[Pullstart 62,913]

Took a "test" ride (yeah right, I knew it would be fine, I just wanted to drive the dang thing!) this morning, then picked up an ignition switch to finish it up.  The kids and I can't decide if Mrs. Pullstart would like to re-paint it ever, or leave the patina... so she won't be getting any AC orange paint for Christmas... unless she wants it after we open all our gifts and we ask her!

[ACman 7,618]

.....leave it as is  . There only original once and that one has the perfect patina. 

[AMC RULES 37,130]

                                                                     Patiently awaiting the video here. 

                                                               

 

[Pullstart 62,913]

Yep, I'm gonna try to get the kids involved with that... not sure of the quality once it's done.  

21 hours ago, ACman said:

.....leave it as is  . There only original once and that one has the perfect patina. 

 

 

Agreed, but it's not my tractor...  I think it's pretty cool how the front end looks like it's been on the thing forever!  I'll surely have to give her a bath come spring time, there's 60+ years of grease and field stuck in every crevasse of the thing.

[Pullstart 62,913]

Good news, not so great news!  Good (great) news is that she loves the new front end, it was a much better surprise than the 12 ga. Mossberg 500 I got for her last year and we were able to take it for a quick spin in the cold and snow storm with her at the helm!   Not so great news, the video my father in law took for me wasn't of the best quality being a ways away and it wasn't very clear.  She said afterward "I didn't realize how much more I like the look of the narrow front, but now I'll be more comfortable driving it more often" (and that's what counts the most!)

 

Merry Christmas everyone!

[Pullstart 62,913]

Thanks to our little one, I've got something for you all to chuckle at.  Allis-Chalmers is apparently challenging for an 8 year old to say... It came out as Elvis Chompers!