Swap a Eaton Hydro into an 8 speed hole...

[mikeeyre74 289]

I've seen a bunch of posts where people have blown up their hydros and are swapping in an 8 speed in it's place, and that's cool.. but I have always wanted a hydro and all I have are 8 speeds. ;-D So here's the scoop.. 

 

I've got a good 310-8 and a rolling 312-A without an engine and other front end parts.. but the hydro I'm told was good and a bench test spinning it with a drill for a while shows that it turns just fine. I'm willing to spend the time and take the risk that it's gonna be fun and worth the experience. Is there anything i'm overlooking with this swap that's gonna comeback bite me? I realize I'm down two hp, sure.. but I mow with the other tractor, and this will be used just for backup and pulling a yard cart. Since I don't have the original engine with the pulley, is that a problem? is the engine pulley different from the 310, and is that going to increase or decrease speed drastically/problematically? What else am I missing? 

Edited May 18, 2017 by mikeeyre74
Hydro, not hydrant. :-)

[oliver2-44 9,875]

Seem like it would be easier to move the engine and other front end parts to the 312-A

[Bert 760]

I believe you will need the larger pulley for the hydro, your 10 horse will likely have an inch and one eighth crankshaft so the correct pulley should be easily found. 

[slammer302 2,155]

It's totally possible to do but the linkage for the motion control will be a pain. It would be a lot easier to swap engines. If plus the hydro trans in a 312-A is not the best.

[mikeeyre74 289]

The control tower is all beat up on the 312A as well. The electricals are mangled as too. That's why I was going this route. Trading trannys is easier than trading control panels, I figure? What's the tricky part about the motion control swap... It doesn't look too bad to me? What am I missing?

[slammer302 2,155]

Getting all the bits and pieces out of the donor tractor with out breaking anything and putting back in the other and making it work as it should. It may be easy depending on witch style motion control lever you have.

[bmsgaffer 2,045]

Off the top of my head, the things you will need from the hydro tractor:

Belt cover

drive pulley (they are very different size)

Idler pulley/tensioner

The idler pulley goes through the tunnel differently than the clutch so you will need the whole assembly 

Motion control assembly  (rocker, brake and all linkages in the tunnel, there are lots of peices here, if it is column shift then you will need the whole tower from the hydro)

Hydro and hoses

If you plan on making hydro lift, you will need the rock shaft in the middle for attachments and the hydro cylinder. I dont know if mounting holes for this are in all tower assemblies, if not you will need whole tower.

Brake return to neutral linkage.

Left side cover (without lift lever hole)

 

 

You pretty much have to pull off everything but the front tires to get a hydro completely installed correctly (unless you skip hydro lift, then you can leave the engine in). 

 

If you have an eaton 700 you dont have to worry about hoses and lifts, but i dont think its worth the swap you would want a stronger eaton 1100. I think a 10hp will feel anemic running an eaton hydro.

 

Edited May 17, 2017 by bmsgaffer

[mikeeyre74 289]

This is not hydro lift.... It's old school hand raised. The donor tractor was well taken care of before someone cut the front end all up so the motion control pieces won't be a problem to remove... They're all in good shape good Intel to know with the pulley and belt cover tho... That's what I was looking for, thanks!

[mikeeyre74 289]

A couple hours later and I've gotten the Eaton out of there. The biggest challenge was just ring all the old nasty cotter pins out of the interior portion of the tunnel. I've got one stuck in there so good I'm sure if it's coming out at all.... 

 

 

See? A little rusty. But it's all out now. I love how WH used different bits and pieces and left the frames alone, allowing these kinds of swaps easy enough. 

 

 

And there we are. The other tractor that's getting the swap should come apart easier, since I've already had it apart not long ago...

[mikeeyre74 289]

Anyone know off hand the difference in diameter between the 8 speed engine pulley and the hydro pulley? Is it a huge difference? If it is, I have a c120 Automatic engine and drive pulley on my bench, will that be a direct bolt in swap for the M10 that originally had the 8 speed, but now has the hydro? Is the diameter going to be correct on that, if so? It originally had a Sundstrand in it..  

 

Mike

Here she is now, all controls in the tower swapped over and back on four wheels. Just need a drive belt now...

 

 

[mikeeyre74 289]

Swapped the engine pulley today for the correct one and all seems well. Took her out for a 1/2 hour drive on the backyard hill and found no slipping.. So I buttoned it up and installed the deck the rain came as I was doing this, so results for mowing with the hydro will have to wait till tomorrow.. but it seems be good. 

[19richie66 17,523]

Good job. That should make a good worker.

[mikeeyre74 289]

The motion control lever keeps moving on me.. I think I just have to tighten up the lock nut a pinch that's on the top of the trans to keep that in place, yes? And in my googling, I find that there's "no filter and no drain", for the hydro tranny... Except that there actually might be? I'd like to do that, if it's possible. The gearbox oil is new. I'm still u decided on which oil to use.. original was 20w straight... But I hear 30w was reccomended in later years and now synthetic is being used quite well? 

[19richie66 17,523]

Not sure about that one. Mine are all Eaton 110 models and they have filter adapters. Not sure if you could adapt one to those or not. You should be able to set the tension on the motion lever right at the pivot in the tunnel. There is a spring and adjusting nut in there. I have seen it on here but cant find the post

[953 nut 55,875]

4 hours ago, mikeeyre74 said:

there's "no filter and no drain", for the hydro tranny.

312 A came with an Eaton 700, no filter and manual calls for no oil changes.

[mikeeyre74 289]

Well,  I mowed the lawn with it for the first time since the transition over to hydrostatic. It took 40 minutes to do, so I know it's all healed up well.   It does not appear to slip to me, other than the motion control liver kind of tries to return to center on its own every once in a while…   More of a concern though, is that if I said it at a good speed for mowing, and then I start to go down one of the many hills in my yard, it seems to freewheel quite easily and gets up a good head of steam… Which is not good for mowing or my safety.  I thought the hydrostatics would not freewheel so much?  Does that mean there something wrong?   The only way to combat that freewheeling is to hit the break, which starts to move my motion control lever back to the center and loses the position that I was in from mowing… It's a small detail, but it would be nice if I could set it to one speed and it would just maintain that speed all along. 

[19richie66 17,523]

I think the eatons do freewheel some. 

[pfrederi 17,895]

As they age (and wear) hydros become more and more prone to speeding up down hill and slowing down up.  On hilly terrain I like the 8 speed  like the TV commercial said "Set it and forget it"

[dcrage 628]

You can also control the speed with your MCL when it starts to freewheel. My "new to me" 418-A does the very same thing as you describe. I continually adjust the MCL to maintain speed. Foot controls are supposed to cure these problems. 

[mikeeyre74 289]

Yes, that's what I've been doing, but it kind of defeats the purpose of "not having to shift" when you have to do that. I was more concerned that something was amiss is all... If this is "normal" I can handle it.  

[melonman 5]

Hi, congrats to you on your swap! I was glad to hear it went easy enough for you. I have had both a 312-A and now have 417-A and although both had some substantial hours on them both; they both seem to freewheel a bit going downhill AND I seem to CONSTANTLY have to be tweaking the speed ie. MCL to stay at speed...After 12 yes. I have learned to live with it. Tighten pivot at the cam can help a little but still seems to slow up if it isn't tightened up-which then can be TOO tight for smooth transition from fwd to rev...