416-8 clutch does not disengage off camber plowing

[JoeD416 0]

Hi all recently picked up a 1986 416-8 installed the plow and wheel weights that came with it, this thing plows like a champ, but when it get twisted up off chamber transmission grinds with the clutch pushed in and does not stop grinding until you knock the shifter into neutral. It's like the clutch can't disengage all the way, anyone with that can give advice would be greatly appreciated ! I adjusted the clutch rod one turn tighter and it did seem to help a little but it still did the grinding afterwards thanks again!

[wallfish 17,094]

22 minutes ago, JoeD416 said:

but when it get twisted up off chamber

Joe

Not sure I understand what "twisted up off chamber" means. Could you please explain this?

The clutch releases tension on the drive belt and this slack in the belt causes it to disengage from the drive pulley at the engine. Without the belt spinning, the drive pulley at the transmission stops turning and this allows shifting into the gears. The tractor should always be a a full stop when changing gears. If the belt continues to spin while the clutch pedal is pushed, this will cause grinding of the gears when trying to shift but should not cause any grinding while it is actually in gear.

Also your transmission has a high / low shifter so make sure it is fully engaged into either one, usually high gear. It is easily kicked or bumped which will cause grinding if not fully engaged into gear. 

Is the belt guard installed? Maybe a pic or two might help with internet diagnosis. 

[JoeD416 0]

By off chamber I mean the tractor is not level side to side while plowing and coming to a stop, I would push the clutch in to stop and I would hear grinding from the transmission and would have to shift to neutral, now if I was plowing and the ground was to totally flat i could push the clutch in and come to a stop and it wouldn't grind I'll check the hi lo selector, that seemed to kind of shift hard ( had it in low twice by did not plow good at all in low) so mabey that had something to do with it, the belt guard is installed as well it was very strange that it doesn't grind all the time, I adjusted the clutch because it seemed there was a lot of free play because when the grinding occurred if I pushed really hard on the clutch pedal it seemed to stop sometimes 

Is there anything to lookout for with hi lo selector?

[wallfish 17,094]

that's what I thought you were saying but tilting the tractor shouldn't cause any grinding of the gears. Is it grinding while the tractor is completely stopped?

Be careful pushing the high /low shifter too hard. the shft forks inside for that shifter are a weak point and will break if they are forced. pushing and releasing the clutch pedal then pushing it again will usually do the trick for getting it to shift back and forth between high and and low.

 

Just thinking "out loud" but could the noise be one of the pulleys hitting the belt guard and not actually gears inside the trans grinding? That will happen sometimes when the tractor is twisted on uneven ground.

Edited January 25, 2016 by wallfish

[JoeD416 0]

Well the tractor is stopped but its still trying to move if that makes sense like it's not disengaging completely I have know idea why that would make a nasty gear going sound though! I am new to this tractor but I grew up using the same year same model when I was a kid! Never plowed with that one though, I am really excited to have this tractor and can't wait to to keep using it for years to come 

[Ed Kennell 38,887]

Pull the belt guard off and check the bearing in the belt tension pulley.    I've seen these bearings completely gone and the tractor still works, but they make a terrible noise sometimes.

Edited January 25, 2016 by ekennell

[wallfish 17,094]

If it's still trying to move then the belt is probably still spinning when the pedal is pushed. You'll need to inspect everything and check that idler pulley like Ed wrote

That thing looks great!

[JoeD416 0]

Thanks guys I'll check it out, I'd be glad if it's just a pulley bearing I can't imagine it's something in the Trans since the noise doesn't happen all the time! I'll post back with what I find !

[Molon_Labe 731]

Also take a look at the transmission mount and make sure it isn't cracked or missing any bolts.

[squonk 41,493]

I think something cracked as well. 

[pfrederi 17,927]

 

Also when you pull the belt guard look for signs the idler pulley was scrapping on it

Edited January 25, 2016 by pfrederi

[WH nut 553]

12 hours ago, Molon_Labe said:

Also take a look at the transmission mount and make sure it isn't cracked or missing any bolts.

Bingo, I agree

[stevasaurus 22,893]

It sure does sound like it could be the mount or bolts. 

[JoeD416 0]

Hey got to take a real quick look at the tractor, the mount is fine snapped a pic after cleaning the grease off of it and then checked the bolts and all were tight, the drive belt does look like it was rubbing the guard on the out side next step would be to get the belt guard off I guess, the pulley for the belt felt tight like there are still balls in the bearing but I'm going to get the belt off and spin the pulley to check for roughness, anybody no a proper free play measurement for clutch adjustment? Or is a trial and error I've adjusted plenty of linkage clutchs on old cars and trucks just never on a horse!!

[gwest_ca-(File Mod) 11,108]

There is no free play adjustment on these tractors. The adjustment of the rod just changes the position of the pedal when the belt is tight to accommodate the height of the operator or leg length.

 

Garry

[JoeD416 0]

Thanks man then adjustment is not the problem!!! 

Glad to have found this website thank you to everyone that's posted with ideas and info

[wallfish 17,094]

You'll need to get the guard off and check the "idler pulley" bearings. Once you get the guard off, you'll see how it all works and then you can make any adjustments from there.

It's the grinding only when tilted and then shifting into neutral to stop it that is puzzling. Any chance you can reproduce what's going on and post a video? Gears grinding inside the trans will sound different than a bad idler pulley bearing and those will sound different than a sheared key. Did this always happen or just start to happen while pushing the snow?

[JoeD416 0]

Well we got the tractor in November, mulched the leaves in the yard with the mower deck once,no issues, and then it's sat until the snowstorm last weekend I plowed twice on Saturday with no noises,then on Sunday I plowed again, and only when I was driven part way up a snow pile it made the noise I'll see if I have time to mess around with it and try and shoot a video of the noise! Is there many transmission problems with these tractors? It seemed to be coming from that area that's what made me nervous I still hope it's something with drive belt pullies

[Ed Kennell 38,887]

Looks like your plow frame is rubbing the pulley and belt.

Edited January 26, 2016 by ekennell

[Kegler 68]

I thought it looked like the edge of the belt might be rubbing the end of the belt guard (at top of picture) definable rubbing something.