SO, YOU WANT TO SAVE THAT WH 3 PIECE TRANNY

[stevasaurus 23,034]

Took the casting in post #148 and wire brushed...used brake cleaner and primed and painted today..  Might get to put it together this weekend. 

 

 

Notice the black from the E-Tank.   Wire wheeled and wiped with bake cleaner...then primed and sprayed with Rust-Oleum Regal Red.  It will set until the weekend in the basement to cure. 

 

[oliver2-44 10,219]

Steve I'm anxiously watching this thread since I also have a tranny to rebuild.  However may I share a painful lesson. Brake cleaner is a great solvent for final wipe down before paint or gaskets. However it soaks into the metal pores like the cast steel case. Then the chemical in it can act as a "release agent" for  silicone  or RTV gasket sealers if you don,t give it enough time to fully evaporate out of the metal pores.  We made this mistake at work on a large hydro generator overhaul in the mid-90,s and almost every gasket leaked. After a lot of head scratching and finger pointing the Locktite Engr figured out out problem. 

SO.....the moral of the story is if you wipe gasketed surfaces down with brake cleaner (or other strong solvents). Give them an hour to breathe before putting gasket sealer on them  

 

Edited February 24, 2016 by oliver2-44

[Lane Ranger 11,096]

 

 

I  picked up   my RJ  frame from my welder yesterday.    I  had taken the frame to the welder as it was missing the left  side of the hoodstand welded to the frame.   This is the side that the left handle latch with the knotch on it sets in place  when the rear hitch is lifted up.     This was cut off on the frame I  had purchased -so I needed some  additions.      The little knotch piece rides about 6 1/2 inches  from the bottom of the frame and is about 4 inches long.  It is placed at about a 30 degree angle from the frame.   

 

Picture  # 3 shows the new  left side with the kotch  welded on  before I primed it. 

 

 

 

Photo # 4  is the front part of the frame that  some previous work was done on with  some welding done to the frame.  Looks like  steer bars were added on the sides with heavy weld beads .    I  used a 4 inch angle grinder to drind that all down before  painting with grey primer.

 

Photo # 6  is what the  left side  hoodstand piece with lift handle knotch looks like on a restored RJ.

 

 

I also completed the painting of the RJ  18 hole seat pan seen in photo #  6.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The final  photo shows the  "before"  picture of the hood and frame with the left side of the hoodstand cutoff.

 

 

 

 

 

 

This final picture I added in an edit shows that the weld bead from the fourth photo (above)  has mostly been removed with the angle grinder.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 24, 2016 by Lane Ranger

[stevasaurus 23,034]

Oliver...thank you very much for that information...I did not know that. 

 

Lane that looks very nice Mate. 

[stevasaurus 23,034]

An update on the cracked, 2 piece, differential housing.  Engineguy63 (Eric) purchased this housing, thinking he knew some friends that could fix it so he could use it in his Suburban.

 

His friends decided the best way to fix it, was to turn it true and press a collar on the end.  They did an excellent job, and even succeeded in closing the crack.  Here are the pictures.    Thanks Eric

 

I would count this as #1 transmission saved. 

 

[Lane Ranger 11,096]

 

Glad to see Eric was able to save that differential !  That collar idea is  just what the doctor  ordered !   Should go on working for many more years !

[Retired Sparky 526]

On 2/8/2016 at 11:58 AM, stevasaurus said:

Like Jim said...it is Regal Red from Rust-Oleum.  I happen to like the Rust-Oleum and Regal Red is a very good match for the older Wheel Horses.  Krolyon, makes a good red also...I think it is Cherry something.  If any paint has an IH Red (International Harvester)...it is a good bet you could use that and it would be close. 

Regal Red is what I redid my with.  I gave the hood a light compounding and the color just pops in the sun.

[squonk 42,260]

On 2/24/2016 at 8:21 PM, oliver2-44 said:

Steve I'm anxiously watching this thread since I also have a tranny to rebuild.  However may I share a painful lesson. Brake cleaner is a great solvent for final wipe down before paint or gaskets. However it soaks into the metal pores like the cast steel case. Then the chemical in it can act as a "release agent" for  silicone  or RTV gasket sealers if you don,t give it enough time to fully evaporate out of the metal pores.  We made this mistake at work on a large hydro generator overhaul in the mid-90,s and almost every gasket leaked. After a lot of head scratching and finger pointing the Locktite Engr figured out out problem. 

SO.....the moral of the story is if you wipe gasketed surfaces down with brake cleaner (or other strong solvents). Give them an hour to breathe before putting gasket sealer on them  

 

Brake cleaners come in different formulas. There is chlorinated (flammable) and non-chlorinated (Non flammable) The non-cl evaporates much faster. It is also used as an electric motor cleaner. I use non CL all the time (since I almost burned up my B-I-L's Mark VII in my front yard!)  It is also an excellent Bee killer! My dad was allergic to bees and I bought him a case of it every Christmas.

[stevasaurus 23,034]

Going to try to do this with pictures.  Going to put together a transmission for a RJ 58...it will be the same for a Suburban transmission.  As you know, I have the guts from about 4 RJ & suburban transmissions to chose from.

 

 

I start with the right side plate (input shaft side) in a vise so when you place the differential, you will have room for the axle to stick through.  Good time to place your gasket.  Wheel Horse did not use gasket sealer, and neither do I...you need to be able to slide the gasket around. 

 

 

I used a little Lucas Oil in the bearings and on the shafts as I put this together.  The 1st thing to place is the input gear/shaft.

 

 

Next, place your mushroom gear and then the assembled differential.  Should look like this.

 

 

This shot is to show how little room there is under the large gear of the mushroom gear...for welding broken nubbies back on.  This picture also shows why you have to take the casting and snake it down and around the differential and then to lift the mushroom gear a little to get the casting to sit on the gasket. 

 

 

Once you get the casting in position, adjust the gasket alignment and put in about 3 of the bolts to hold the casting in place.  The bolts do not have to be tight, but you can snug them.  You need to do this, so the forks line up over the input gear.  The forks are set in the casting and if the casting is moving around, you can not line up the fork gears and the spline shaft.

 

 

Now, place the 2nd/3rd fork gear in the bottom fork, with the groove up.

 

 

Now take the rev/1st fork gear (the larger of the 2 fork gears) and place that in the top fork with the groove down...facing the other fork gear.

 

 

Take your spline shaft and place that down through the 2 fork gears and seat it into the bearing in the input gear/shaft.

 

 

Now the fun part...small hands help here.    See that bearing with nothing in it just above??  This goes in there...the cluster gear shaft with a keyed reduction pinion and the cluster gear on the shaft (large gear down).  This can take a few tries, and you want to make sure that key does not fall out of the shaft and pinion.

 

 

Make sure, before you even try to fit this that you put the transmission into 2nd gear.  That means move the shift rail on the right up one notch.  This makes room for the cluster gear to slide in and the cluster gear shaft to seat in the bearing.  This can be the hardest part.

 

 

Only thing left is the large, cluster shaft reduction gear.  This is also keyed, and when seated should be the same height as the splined pinion that it mates with.  There is enough slop to get this gear to pass the casting rim and go down.

 

 

Put here back into neutral, and check out that everything spins free and as it should.  You can put it into different gears and turn the input shaft counter-clockwise to make sure things work.  Remember, you still have the slop in the shafts from not having the other side plate on yet. 

     Seat the side plate, and bolt together.  I use about 12 ft/lbs torque.  Try turning the input shaft in all gears again...sometimes bolting the sides together can pinch things that were not just right.  Don't be surprised if you have to open it back up and try to figure out what is binding when bolted together.  It does not take much to bind it. 

 

 

I put the seals in last, I never know if I have to take it apart again.  When all is fine, put the seals in and the oil. 

[AMC RULES 37,144]

As comprehensive as it gets Steve. 

Very nicely done brother.  

[Racinbob 11,634]

Excellent write up Steve!  

[WNYPCRepair 1,923]

Nice work! I realized after I watched your video that I had actually watched other trans videos a few months ago that you have done.

[Racinbob 11,634]

11 hours ago, squonk said:

Brake cleaners come in different formulas. There is chlorinated (flammable) and non-chlorinated (Non flammable) The non-cl evaporates much faster. It is also used as an electric motor cleaner. I use non CL all the time (since I almost burned up my B-I-L's Mark VII in my front yard!)  It is also an excellent Bee killer! My dad was allergic to bees and I bought him a case of it every Christmas.

Excellent Mike and correct. I've used non-chlorinated for many years starting out on firearms then found it did such a good job I use it as a final cleaner for most anything. I didn't know about the bees though. I can certainly use that idea.

[squonk 42,260]

11 minutes ago, Racinbob said:

Excellent Mike and correct. I've used non-chlorinated for many years starting out on firearms then found it did such a good job I use it as a final cleaner for most anything. I didn't know about the bees though. I can certainly use that idea.

Back in the days before V.O.C. laws, Castle brand brake cleaner would shoot about 20 feet out of the can straw. Great for those long range kill shots! 

[can whlvr 993]

nice tutorial steve,this will be a big help for guys doing their own,its scary the first time not knowing but this will take that unknown out

[dclarke 4,055]

Thanks for all those pics, Steve. Lots of good info in this thread for those of us that haven't had one of these apart yet. I'm following this so i can refer to it when I need to. 

[Lane Ranger 11,096]

 

Steve:  The detailed explanations and photos for the RJ reassembly are very , very good !    You have highlighted the with great skill and cautions the issues you can face with each step-sequenced in the best manner!

 

I am overwhelmed at how much  great information you have to convey on these three piece transmissions!    

 

We all may have battery or solar power cars in 50 years but it sure looks to me like some  RJ and Suburban Wheel Horse tractors will still be around long after that!

 

[stevasaurus 23,034]

Just so you guys know...I did have to open it back up.  It was the key I used for the large reduction gear on the cluster gear shaft.  It just did not feel right when I put it together.  Sure enough, the gear was up a touch and bound up the works once it was bolted together.  Everything should fit together easily...if you are forcing anything...pull it out and see why.  I had to force this gear over the key and I went with it.  Pulled it back apart...grabbed a different key and the gear slid right on.  Bolted it back up...after checking things and all is good.

   I had a feeling about that key yesterday, so I kind of knew where to look.  What I did to verify...unbolt a few turns the bolts on the side plate (brake shaft side) that are around the cluster gear shaft.  Everything loosened up and turned freely...I knew it was that key.  It does take a little playing around with to make sure things fit nice.  It only took about 1/2 hour to fix this, but it had me thinking about it all night.  When I give this horse an apple, I am going to take a bite out of it 1st. 

[AMC RULES 37,144]

Only one bite Steve?  

 

[WHX?? 50,447]

My take apart was having the cluster gear upside down..... very easy to mistake to make!

If it goes in easier than what Steve described it might in backwards!

[Lane Ranger 11,096]

 

 

A little more progress on the RJ  rebuild.

 

My  rear hitch is all cleaned, primed and painted Rustoleum Regal Red.     A big thanks to Jake Kuhn  for selling  me this one !     I bought before I realized that one of the other 4 transmissions Steve has had a rear hitch on it !

 

 

Also thanks to  Craig  (AMC Rules) for posting the information about the NAPA throttle cable that they sell for $15.99  (Part No  703906)  that lines up perfectly for the holes on the RJ Hood used by the original throttle cable handle base.    Mine was very badly rusted and pitted so I did need to find a replacement.

 

The Kohler K 91 motor is almost ready to use.   I have a new Kohler cup and screen to go under a Kohler recoil  that I have for this 4 HP motor.  This motor was the original motor on another RJ  I bought two years ago.   I had it removed to repair a wire that had been chewed on by mice as they established a major housing complex under the tin of the Kohler while sitting in a barn.   If you have never had to removed one of those mice messes you just have not lived.

 

 

Sunday afternoon I started more work on the RJ  frame.    My  clutch pedal was rusted up on the 3/4 inch foot pedal rod.   Also some previous owner had installed three steel spacers that moved the clutch rod further out from the frames.  The pedal and spacers were all heavily rusted so I started applying PB Blaster  every half hour or so.    I did this for four hours.       Finally a couple hammer taps started to move the clutch pedal.       I then used my pry bar with a flat head surface to knock the clutch pedal off making sure to do so around  the closest points on the clutch  near the 3/4 inch round foot pedal bar.  Off came the clutch and I cleaned rust with  a Dremel  (sand paper head)   and then started work on removing the three spacers.      2 photos of the frame and foot pedal show rust after I removed with Dremel and wire brush.    I did buy three brass 3/4 inch washers ( I wanted stainless steel but the local hardware store only had 3/4 stainless washers that were  large like for auto application)  on the foot pedal to allow the lift handle to set away from the frame about a 1/4 inch but still be able to lock on the hoodstand lift tab.

 

 

Going to start focusing on the motor  work remaining and my wheels and front tires and  then my RJ hood redo for now.

 

 

 

I also did get the underside of my RJ fenders painted with Regal Red today too!

 

 

Edited February 29, 2016 by Lane Ranger

[can whlvr 993]

nice work lane,i had bought a tractor 312-h and it seemed seized,got the tractor for real cheap,anyway it turns out the flywheel was full of nut shells and wouldn't turn over

[Lane Ranger 11,096]

Don:     Yes it is a wonder how much crap they can stuff behind those tins that you can't even get your fingers in !   Nut shells can be a pain  especially walnut.  The squirrel's in my neighborhood  plant walnuts like a 

 

             first year forestry student !  I am always kicking them up mowing!

   

[WNYPCRepair 1,923]

On February 29, 2016 at 9:49 AM, WHX6 said:

 

 

 

Wow, that looks brand new.

[WHX?? 50,447]

Yes it did clean up nice Brian considering the goop that came out of it! I don't think the PO ever had it inside either, just a tarp over it with no shifter boot on it to keep water out. Amazing that just keeping some kind of oil in them can help preserve them. All I did was run them through the ultra sonic then regular parts cleaner. None of this e-tank bussiness for me......yet....

As soon as I am done cleaning all gears & bearings go into a tub with clean 80/90 in it so no flash rust. Prelubed for reassembly that way but messy.

Edited March 2, 2016 by WHX6