pacmanfan1977 8 #1 Posted May 4, 2015 Hey all- I have a 702 Wheel Horse that belonged to my grandfather. (he purchased it new in 1962! ) I've owned it for many years now, and has always been a great tractor. The drive belt began slipping a bit here and there, so I decided to replace it, since it was old. I looked up the belt replacement online and several places have cross referenced to a 4L700 (1/2 x 70 OD). I installed the new belt, and it now grinds the gears when you attempt to put it in gear from neutral. I tried another belt, and it does the same thing. I have done some research and everyone states to make sure the belt cover is re-installed- which mine is. My belt still turns when I am in neutral with clutch pushed in. (cover is on). I have also read about a clip, or belt brake that is supposed to catch the slack and prevent the belt from moving when the clutch is pushed in. I don't see anything on my tractor, and I cannot find any pictures or much information on this. Can anyone provide further insight on this? I also tried adjusting the clutch pedal rod without success. With the warmer weather here, I really want my 702 back up and running! Thanks in advance for any help! Mark Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wallfish 16,982 #2 Posted May 4, 2015 You are definitely on the right track. The belt is "grabbing" the engine pulley which causes it to turn and will grind the gears. You'll need to figure out why the belt isn't completely releasing from the engine pulley. Sometimes a new belt is stiff and just needs to get a little wear. Putting it under load should help. With a new belt, I usually drive up to a wall or tree and put a heavy load on it for a couple of minutes. You can also try loosening the bolts around the engine for the belt guard and try moving the guard around in different postions. Sometimes a slight movement is all it takes. Usually it needs to be pulled up to support the bottom loop of the belt. Check the bend in the belt guard around the engine. It's possible the 90 degree bend isn't 90 degrees any more. If it has opened up some, it could cause the issue. Sometimes they go right on with no problem, others need to be played with until you stop it from grabbing the pulley. Post some close up detailed pics of the belt guard around the engine pulley if none of this solves your issue 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pacmanfan1977 8 #3 Posted May 5, 2015 Thanks for the reply! Last night I did go out to the garage and took another quick look at the 702. I tried adjusting/ repositioning the belt guard and did not have any luck. I also did try putting a heavy load on the belt at least a dozen times or more. (I let the tractor roll backwards on a hill and then let the clutch out hard to have it engage and pull it back up the hill) Is that suffient? I was worried about damaging my grill/ hood by putting it up to a tree. Any other suggestions- if not I will have to take some pictures and go from there. (my belt guard does have a half broken mounting tab where it screws into the engine, but he screw still catches it and holds it tight) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,706 #4 Posted May 5, 2015 Try taking a little steel wool to the inside of all 3 pulleys (to clean them) and then wipe the grooves with mineral spirits. Some will say to wipe the belt with spirits also...I have not tried this. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AMC RULES 37,127 #5 Posted May 5, 2015 (edited) The sheaves of those pulleys should be clean, nice and shiny, with no rust showing. Edited May 5, 2015 by AMC RULES 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RedRanger 1,468 #6 Posted May 5, 2015 Did you adjust the clutch pedal linkage out for the new belt? This should give you more slack in the belt when the pedal is fully down. I had the same problem with my 867. Eventually I took a DA sander to the sides of the new belt and scuffed it up. That fixed it about 99%. After some usage, it now works perfectly. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pacmanfan1977 8 #7 Posted May 6, 2015 I tinkered some more last night without sucess...I tried cleaning up all the pulley's and made more adjustments to the belt guard but mothing seemed to get it right. It actually did work correctly for a bit, but after a lap or two around the house it went back to grinding the gears. Here are some pictures, maybe I'm missing something? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bmsgaffer 2,043 #8 Posted May 6, 2015 Isn't there supposed to be a belt-guide tab on the clutch pulley? So that when you push in the clutch the belt wont fall off, and it pushed it forward to get it off the engine pulley. You would have had to remove it to change the drive belt, could you possibly have set it somewhere and forgot to reinstall it? (i havent yet changed the belt on my 854, so I am going off of what I know from the later models) 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,706 #9 Posted May 6, 2015 Did you buy that belt from TORO...sometimes the belts are not quite the same from NAPA or the like?? I'll pull off my 702 guard and check out that idler pulley and tabs. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,706 #10 Posted May 6, 2015 Well, I think I found your problem. I pulled off my 702 guard and there are no tabs on the inside of the guard. The 3/8" bolt that helps hold the guard on has a roller on it. This would act like a tab. I have no piece of metal bent over the idler pulley to hold the belt there. This is what you are missing. I have a tab made out of like 12 or 10 gauge wire that is attached to the engine by a short 3/8" bolt. The height of the wire from the belt is adjustable and is about 1/4" to 1/2" above the belt. Although, I do not have one below the belt at this point...there is another bolt hole and another tab could be made to fit there. Hope that helps. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
buckrancher 2,679 #11 Posted May 6, 2015 you are missing the front belt tab on the belt cover I am not at home so I can not post a pic of it Brian 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,706 #12 Posted May 6, 2015 Yes, I was thinking that Brian...I know exactly what you are talking about. It is a flat piece of metal that extends forward from the bottom of the guard. If you have a picture, go ahead and post it Mate. Doesn't look like Mark has that on his guard either. Brian, are you sure one of those tabs is on the 702 guard?? I just went out and looked again...I see no evidence that anything like that was ever there. In fact, the bottom of my guard finishes with a 45 degree angle...I would think it would be a 90. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pacmanfan1977 8 #13 Posted May 6, 2015 Thank you so much for taking the time to pull your cover off!! You are right, I am missing the front tab by the engine. It also appears that I have the wrong hardware for my belt cover. The bottom hole on my belt cover was fastened by a nut and bolt. It looks like your has a fixed stud, with a roller on it. I feel that we likely found the problem. Thanks again for looking at yours. Now I have to find or make some parts! Thanks to all for the help! Mark Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,706 #14 Posted May 6, 2015 That bolt on mine is a bolt that comes through from the other side, it just has a sleeve on the bolt that is free to turn. I think it also has another purpose...it keeps the guard at the correct distance from the frame so it does not rub the pulleys...it acts like a spacer too. I just went out a checked it out. It is a piece of 1/2" electrical conduit 1 1/8" long. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
buckrancher 2,679 #15 Posted May 6, 2015 Yes, I was thinking that Brian...I know exactly what you are talking about. It is a flat piece of metal that extends forward from the bottom of the guard. If you have a picture, go ahead and post it Mate. Doesn't look like Mark has that on his guard either. Brian, are you sure one of those tabs is on the 702 guard?? I just went out and looked again...I see no evidence that anything like that was ever there. In fact, the bottom of my guard finishes with a 45 degree angle...I would think it would be a 90. 701 and 702 may not have had the tab probably started in 63 he could put a belt tab like you have on top under the pulley it should work the same as the one welded to the belt guard not that great of a pic you can see the tab under the belt Brian 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
857 horse 2,581 #16 Posted May 6, 2015 SITTING HERE LOOKING AT BUCK RANCHERS STEED I MEAN,,,,,,,WOW,,,, GREAT JOB 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pacmanfan1977 8 #17 Posted May 6, 2015 Well the plot thickens... I went to take another look at the tractor and I noticed that while riding on it, the back felt kind of loosey-goosey. I decided to lift the rear of the tractor to take a look, and I've found another problem. The frame/ plate that mounts to the rear is cracked. I see this is a common problem with these tractors, and several people have posted their fixes on it. I have a welder, and I plan to repair the cracks, but I also see that people have added a stiffener/ secondary plate to make it tougher. I think I will fix this first, then tackle the drive belt issue....anybody got dimensions on the size of the plate? I want to make something like this: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,706 #18 Posted May 7, 2015 You want to mount a 1/4" plate on the front of the existing mount...toward the front of the horse. This keeps the length of the belt and linkage the same. The only difference is adding 1/4" to your mounting bolts for the transmission. Not to mention...this could be most of your issue. Obviously...fix this first. Depending on the cracks and how bad they are...you could just "v" them out and re-weld...would last another 50 years. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
buckrancher 2,679 #19 Posted May 7, 2015 (edited) 6 1/2" x 6 1/2" square Plate I used one that was 1/8" thick Brian Edited May 7, 2015 by buckrancher 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,706 #20 Posted May 7, 2015 Then add 1/8" to the length of those bolts.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pacmanfan1977 8 #21 Posted May 7, 2015 I think I am going to repair the cracks, and then have a plate made. I have the 6 1/2 x 6/12 size dimension for the plate, but I was wondering if anybody had the hole pattern measurements? I have the ability to get a plate made today, but I haven't torn the tractor apart to take measurements. I know it's kind of a long shot, but does anybody have the hole placement/ size measurements that go on the plate handy? Thanks again guys- I really appreciate all the help! -Mark Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bmsgaffer 2,043 #22 Posted May 7, 2015 Dimensions are here: Hopefully someone who has made a plate already can chime in as to their placement as the above gives hole spacing but no location for a plate. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,706 #23 Posted May 7, 2015 I think I would fit the plate and then mark and drill the holes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
buckrancher 2,679 #24 Posted May 7, 2015 I drilled the holes thru from the back side after I welded the plate in using the old holes as a guide Brian 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AMC RULES 37,127 #25 Posted May 7, 2015 This is the guide you're missing from your cover. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
