Is a M16 Truely Enough?

[Wheel-N-It 2,968]

No, I'm not talking about machine guns LOL

Here is my plan. I'D REALLY LIKE SOME FEEDBACK FROM THOSE IN THE KNOW ON THIS.

OK Boys, time to streamline a bit. I just sold the 312 Hydro, and am considering selling the 417A, again in an effort to thin it down a bit.
So what I am thinking of is putting in storage the M12 Kohler mounted to my (bought brand new) 312-8, and replacing it with a M14 Kohler in the 314 Hydro. The M12 has 540 hours on the clock, the M14 has 530 hours on its clock. The practical reason for this swap is to gain a bit more power for mowing with a 48" SD deck.

Then to keep a hydro mower in the herd for mowing when I feel lazy is to install a M16 Kohler with 745 hours on it in the 314 Hydro. The practical reason for this is to give the 314 more power to spin the hydro and power a 48" SD deck. So all of this should be an easy bolt in / plug in project, the kind of projects I like.

So the feedback I need is how well does a M16 really perform in this application? Does it truly have the horsepower and torque to do what I want it to do? Over the years here I have read the inquiries of people curious of what to do with their 520 once the Onan engine has expired, and some people say replace it with a K341 or a M16. Thats all well and good for an idea but is it a real life solution?

All replies to this will be much appreciated.

Van

[shallowwatersailor 3,213]

Van, after getting the C-145 with the K-321 the other day I am surprised at the additional horsepower compared to the K-241 in the C-105. The difference in power wasn't as noticeable when I got the 312-A. My plans are to use the C-145 with my Johnny Bucket so the additional power will be handy. I'll finally put Matt's kit on a tractor after having one for two years as well!

 

I would say that as long as you don't mind swapping the engines around, the plan sounds good.

 

I know what you mean by needing to downsize. I'll need to do the same. One of my beloved 5xi will probably be offered for sale. When I bought the 523Dxi last year, my plan was to go strictly to that chassis. My problem is the Johnny Bucket. It won't mate to the 5xi without a large amount of revamping. So I need to use a "Classic" for the JB. It's tough to have that nice a tractor and use it only 10 hours a year.

[Wheel-N-It 2,968]

Thank you John for understanding my situation, and for your reply. Sorry to hear you too need to downsize. I think we just need to make sure the ones we sell go to a good home. I never sell a Wheel Horse to someone who has no idea what they are. I don't want to see any more of these get abused and end up in the scrap yard.

I'm headed out to work on the driveway a bit before the rain sets in. I'll check back later this afternoon to see what the other members think.

[squonk 41,016]

DO IT! I love the sound of Kohlers in the morning!   I don't see a downside to any of it I have a K321 sittin on the shelf just waiting for the day it's needed. It can replace my K341 or K301. 2 horses either way shouldn't be a problem! 

[MalMac 1,331]

I mow with a C145 auto and a 48 deck. Does a fine job. Now if you go out there in 5" tall green sticky grass you might have to raise the deck and slow down a tad bit. I also put a 48 on 314-8 only difference I notice is the auto use's a tad more fuel, ethier way there both better than mowing with my 520. The 520 does not do any better and uses three times the fuel with same size deck. So if the 14hp does ok I am sure the 16 will be fine.

[zieg72 209]

Well I've put a K341 on a 520H but didn't have it long enough to thoroughly work it but I can tell you the M14 on my last 414-8 was awesome.  It did everything my 520H did using 1/2 the fuel.  It cut the same lawn using the same deck in the same time.  It stands to reason that if the Hydro's really take up 2 hp roughly the M16 on a 314H ought to work out fine.

[wallfish 16,980]

This is an easy one. DON"T DOWN SIZE and keep them all

 

Not sure it would make too much of a difference between the 14hp and the 16hp so I would swap that 16 into the 12 and leave the 14 alone.  

That will also leave more time to start another project like the front end leaf blower

[Wheel-N-It 2,968]

This is an easy one. DON"T DOWN SIZE and keep them all

 

Not sure it would make too much of a difference between the 14hp and the 16hp so I would swap that 16 into the 12 and leave the 14 alone.  

That will also leave more time to start another project like the front end leaf blower

 

Seriously everybody thank you for jumping in and giving your input and ideas. Mike, I think I remember when you bought that K321. I'm glad you are holding on to it. MalMac, you know what I'm thinking about in terms of the 5 or 6" sticky green grass. I'm hoping the M16 will put a little more power to the deck so I don't have to slow down much. I love the seat time on any Wheel Horse but don't like mowing at a snails pace. Zieg, you are on it with regards to the 414-8 I have on of those too and the extra 2hp over the M12 makes it a terrific tractor. It has enough power to do whatever I need as long as it gets tracton. John, you and I think too much alike! Thats why it's a good thing we live in different States. You and I would get in way too much trouble if we were neighbors LOL! Seriously, I thought about putting the M16 in the 312 but the hours on the 314 and 312 are almost exactly the same, so there not any wear difference mecanically between the rolling chassis and the powerplant. The combination would almost be like original equipment. Plus, I have a 416-8 with a K341 so fortunatly I have that series of tractor covered. Really if I did not have four more off colored LAGT's I would hang on to the extra WH's but I'm of the opinion that four or five WH's are the perfect number for me.

BTW, if any of you guys are interested in the 417, shoot me a PM.

[squonk 41,016]

 Mike, I think I remember when you bought that K321. I'm glad you are holding on to it. 

Nobody was selling pie so I had to spend my money on somethin!   

[WH nut 553]

Down sizing???? Me no understand  

[Wheel-N-It 2,968]

Nobody was selling pie so I had to spend my money on somethin!  :

I've been thinking about that rhubarb pie ever since you wrote this. The Big Show can't get here soon enough now!

[Stigian 1,234]

I say go for the M16, a very nice engine.. I have fitted one in my GT-14 which isn't the lightest of WH's, and it has bags of power

[Forest Road 594]

Kohler singles rarely die. Can't go wrong w the big single.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ericj 1,578]

Kohler singles rarely die. Can't go wrong w the big single.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

not to start any problems but i have had my share of blown kohler single. it all depends on how well the motor was maintained. whether it was a kohler, onan, briggs or tecky. although i would agree that a kohler is more forgiving if not maintained properly. the kohler balance gears are a problem for the k series.

  i guess what i'm say is depending on you view they are all good or bad and it gives us something to argue over just the same as ford, chevy, dodge or foreign make argument. basically if you run a motor to low on oil it will go BANG or if you over heat it, it will not end well        

 

 

 

 

 

 

eric j    

[Wheel-N-It 2,968]

I say go for the M16, a very nice engine.. I have fitted one in my GT-14 which isn't the lightest of WH's, and it has bags of power

Quite true friend! The GT-14 is a heavy machine. Never havfing one in the herd, I did not take how well a bigger Kohler single powers one of these tractors into consideration. Thank you for bringing this to my attention. It's a good confirmation that I'm on the right track  

[can whlvr 993]

I mow with a c160 auto and 48 deck,she is a beast,it will go through any thing with in reason,i also mow with a 414-8 with 48,very hard to find a difference in power,the k series and m are basically the same engine,justdifferent ignition,and some other things that don't play into power comparisons,so go for it you wont be disapointed

[squonk 41,016]

Power is power. My Power King is only a K321 put it will pull a house down! 

[Don1977 604]

 You can remove the balance gear from any K-Series. From what I have read M-Series all used the same crank shaft and the M16 has three balance gears because of the light crank. I have been afraid to remove the ones in the M-12 as I'm not sure if it would be alright with out them. I would like to know If anyone has removed them from an M-12. I'm sure I wouldn't remove them from a M-14 or M-16.

[Wheel-N-It 2,968]

I mow with a c160 auto and 48 deck,she is a beast,it will go through any thing with in reason,i also mow with a 414-8 with 48,very hard to find a difference in power,the k series and m are basically the same engine,justdifferent ignition,and some other things that don't play into power comparisons,so go for it you wont be disapointed

 Ahhh, I was thinking it may would play out like this. Two horsepower to drive the hydro and fourteen horsepower to power everything else. All indications from you guys are telling me this is a good way to go.  I'm firmly convinced this will be a sucessful move. Thank you Don from Ontario!

 

Power is power. My Power King is only a K321 put it will pull a house down! 

Mike, those Power King tractors are great machines. Also on my bucket llist of LAGT's to own!

 

 You can remove the balance gear from any K-Series. From what I have read M-Series all used the same crank shaft and the M16 has three balance gears because of the light crank. I have been afraid to remove the ones in the M-12 as I'm notD sure if it would be alright with out them. I would like to know If anyone has removed them from an M-12. I'm sure I wouldn't remove them from a M-14 or M-16.D

 

Don in NC, now you have raised a curiousity in me regarding removing the balance gears in a Magnum engine. The balance gears in the K341 powering my Cub Cadet 1650 have been removed. The K341 in my 416-8 Wheel Horse is stock, so if it has balance gears they are still in the engine. So is removing the balance gears a practice for only the K engines?

[Don1977 604]

On the K-Series the crank on the 14 and 16 is heaver the weights are round on the bottom. The K 12 has the same crank with 1/2" or so milled off the bottom.

According To Brian Miller "If the Magnum balance gears are left out with any model, the engine will vibrate terribly". That is why I haven't removed mine.

Edited April 26, 2015 by Don1977

[Tankman 3,518]

Kohler singles rarely die. Can't go wrong w the big single.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

My 16 hp single cyl Kohler does it all and, it is a go to Horse. Capable for any task.

 

My M14 at Camp Lejeune was excellent too!  

Edited April 26, 2015 by Tankman

[Wheel-N-It 2,968]

On the K-Series the crank on the 14 and 16 is heaver the weights are round on the bottom. The K 12 has the same crank with 1/2" or so milled off the bottom.

According To Brian Miller "If the Magnum balance gears are left out with any model, the engine will vibrate terribly". That is why I haven't removed mine.

Thank you Don for the education! I learned something new today

 

My 16 hp single cyl Kohler does it all and, it is a go to Horse. Capable for any task.

 

My M14 at Camp Lejeune was excellent too!  

 Yes, the Springfield M14     In my opinion Its The Classic Timeless Quality Military Rifle     Thank  you for your service Tankman!

[Tankman 3,518]

Thanks Wheel-N-It, my pleasure. Was glad to give up my M1, no more thumb crushes!  The well known M1 Thumb!   

 

Picked up an off brand tractor just 'cause it was goin' to scrap. More play time for the grandsons, '66 Allis Chalmers B-10.

Came with snow/dozer blade, mid-mount grader, rear PTO tiller, mower deck. Engine runs, 10 hp Briggs.

 

Edited April 27, 2015 by Tankman

[Wheel-N-It 2,968]

Wow, I really like that AC! I don't understand how people can even think about letting a fine piece of equipment with accessories go to the scrap pile. Just don't make sense............................

BYW, let me know how that AC project goes.

Edited April 27, 2015 by Wheel-N-It

[dcrage 625]

Wow, I really like that AC! I don't understand how people can even think about letting a fine piece of equipment with accessories go to the scrap pile. Just don't make sense............................

BYW, let me know how that AC project goes.

 

Cause my wife and daughter would let up on me having the 8 hp B&S powered AMF 4 speed with 36" deck from the mid 60(?)s setting out on blocks in the back yard (granted it has been setting since I bought my 310-8 back in 1991) -- So they were thrilled when they paid to have someone haul it off with other scrap material