Sundstrand Challenge(s)

[coldone 35]

 

I'm disappointed with the result of using LT 680 as well. The bolt and washer at the front with a splined washer behind the coupling took up all of the side to side / top to bottom wiggle but not the small amount of rotational play. Dismantling and adding some extra Loctite appeared to do the trick but after a day's curing the rotational play was back again.

 

I guess the compound shrinks a little as it cures and the wear gaps are too large for the compound to take up. I can't help wondering if just some heavy grease would have been better alongside the additional bolt and washer in terms of reducing long term wear.

 

I would think that one of the Metal filled epoxies could be used to reduce the rotational slop. I toyed with the idea of cleaning the coupling and filling the grooves with the epoxy. Spray the pump shaft with release agent and push the two together.  That should fill up any voids and provide a solid mating surface. There should be a lot of surface area to spread the load also.

 

I would not use grease. To me,this would defeat the purpose of the splines and reduce friction. IMO, it would make it more likely to strip the splines on the shaft.

[wheeledhorseman 574]

Decided to start the weekend early today and spent the afternoon starting to get things back together at the front end.

 

In fixing the engine back to the coupler and chassis I discovered an issue with the idea of leaving the bolt and washer in place - the engine won't slide far enough back for the mounting holes to line up with the chassis. Took a couple of attempts before I guessed the problem which can't actually be seen at this stage.

 

The bolt

 

 

comes into contact with the end of the crankshaft

 

 

Using a thinner washer would probably still not have allowed the engine to move far enough back so as the splines aren't too bad and the rubber coupling will provide some preload, I decided to leave the bolt and washer out.

 

It was a bit disappointing in that it really locks the coupling onto the pump shaft eliminating all but a little bit of rotational play. 

 

The idea of using it to hold things in line while the Loctite cures or in the case of a well worn spine, as Brit suggests, metal filled epoxy, seems to be a good one though even if you can't leave the bolt there permanently.

 

If dealing with really poor splines then there might be a work around by using a thin washer, allen key bolt ground off a little, and a shallow hole to receive it drilled into the end of the crankshaft.

 

Getting the two bolts that go into the flywheel to start threading in was almost too easy so I guess that so far things seem to be lining up ok Paul, though I have noted the bit about slots in the Service Bulletin. I've managed to get a mains powered digital xenon strobe / tachometer on fleabay for a song, Unused still in it's box only the instruction booklet was missing. Seemed a whole lot easier than the method suggested in the bulletin - more about that in a future post.

[wheeledhorseman 574]

Managed to get a bit further over the weekend but as I've also got the first military vehicle show coming up next weekend so time continues to be tight for my tractor project.

I was glad a took a pic of the motion control arrangement before dismantling - it would have been more difficult to reassemble without given the weeks that have passed since.



Everything seems to move as it should which is encouraging,
 

Andy;  great work.  I remember that the the Tech Bulletin indicated you mighth have to slot the hole in the end of th mounting bracket to get good alignment.  That would replace the need for your extra washer...I think.

​The bulletins Paul drew my attention to can be found here: http://www.wheelhorseforum.com/applications/core/interface/file/attachment.php?id=57310

and here: http://www.wheelhorseforum.com/applications/core/interface/file/attachment.php?id=57311

The slotting carried out when my tractor was previously repaired can be seen below.



With the washer I added the slotting need not have gone so far back in the panel as it did at that time. The upper panel that overlaps this had also been slotted.

When remounting the motor on the C-121 part of this sort of combined C & D  project, I'd found using two taps as guide pins helped hold the gasket in place and also the motor itself while securing the top mounting bolts.


It would have worked for the D-200 had this one not been fitted with turning brakes where the disc gets in the way of offering the motor up to the guide pins in its correct vertical orientation. I had to remove the tap at the rear so that the motor could be tilted forwards to get it onto the remaining guide then bring it upright again once the motor was clear of the disc. having one guide was certainly still a help though.

So with the strainer that's complete, a new motor gasket, and the motor bolted on the manifold was finally attached to the motor with new o-rings and backup rings.



The motor is from a later type transmission with drum and brake band parking break. It would be essential for my other later D-200 but in this case the transmission has the parking brake pawl on the other side of the casing. I'd have left the drum mounted on the motor were it not for the fact that it is not possible to mount the brake caliper back on the axle with it still in place. I've got to find something slide over the axle to keep dirt and wet away from the seal. Suggestions welcomed as I haven't thought that far ahead yet.

I'm not going the reconnect the hoses (top left) from the damper valves to the motor until after I've had a chance to run the system to check it out. The motor appears to have the two ports for this underneath which have blanking plugs in them at present. From previous experience there's only a little oil lost when when you disconnect the hoses with a full transmission of oil.

With a show coming up to prepare for, filling with oil and running the engine etc will most likely have to wait till next week.

[wheeledhorseman 574]

It's been a few days since I've had time for this project but yesterday I put enough bits back on the tractor to be able to start the engine and see if the hydro worked. Despite not having been run for over a year now the engine fired up ater a couple of turns - that's the joy of having fitted an electric pump! The hydro primed in next to no time, rather different from the old pump and motor which I recall took two or three minutes for the buzzing of air being chased out to stop. A good sign perhaps!

The motion control worked both forwards and back, also the mid lift. (There's no 3-point at the moment as it's been on the other D while this one was broken. No visible oil leaks either. Couldn't run the tractor for too long though as even with the windows and door open it was getting a bit fuggy in the shop. Time then to start putting bits back.


With  the brake caliper mounted back onto the axle you can see why I've had to leave the band brake drum off the motor. It also explains why turning brakes as an option were dropped from the subsequent year's model (1978) which had this type of motor and band brake rather than internal parking brake pawl.


The 1977 D-200 had damper valves which were also dropped the following year but it was possible plumb them to this motor by removing the blanking plugs underneath the motor.


Both the blanking plugs and hydraulic fittings have a tapered thread as a seal. The hose in the foreground hasn't been partly rubbed through - its been squashed a bit where it sits inside the guard box thingy.


It was a windy wet afternoon so I jumped the gun a bit and reassembled the front of the tractor and put the hood back on when really it should have gone outside for trials at this point but it looked so much better that I started loving it again rather than asking myself, as I have off and on since it broke,  'Why did I buy a D? Worse than that why did I get a second one?'


If the weather's better tomorrow I hope to get it out for trials though I'll have to stand on the footplates as there's no point putting the seat etc back untill I transfer the three point back from the other tractor and plumb it in.

Getting tantalisingly close now to having successfully transplanted the pump and motor from a C-series transmission onto a D. Famous last words!

[wheeledhorseman 574]

Epilogue: Got the rest of the tractor put back together today including transferring the 3-point hitch back from my other D-200 (PITA job) and it all works!!

So, yes it's possible to use the pump and motor from a C-series though I got lucky finding a later transmission with a pump that had the motion shaft that protruded out of each side of the casing. In theory it's been suggested that for the older style with the shaft available on one side only, it should be possible to turn the casing through 180 but I leave that for someone else to have a go at.

And here it is out and about again....


By the gate in the distance above the seat in the first pic is where it had died pretty much a year ago now.

I still have to dismantle the old pump and motor to find out what went wrong (a job for next winter perhaps)
Also I've got the C-121 that I bought as a parts tractor but now has the good transaxle that the pump and motor for the D were taken from so it may be a resto project rather than for parts now (again, next winter maybe).

Hope all this has been useful to somebody out there or may be at some point in the future. Thanks to all who have joined in with suggestions, help and encouragement. Appreciated.

Andy

[pfrederi 17,734]

She looks great Andy...Thank you for sharing info on the journey!!!

[otrelwood 32]

i was hoping you had flipped the c housing and reported it worked great but since you did all the other hard stuff i just did it and am putting it in tomorrow will report as to the success when its done thanks for the post

[Reynold 0]

I have a c121 automatic and can't find the brake shaft seal anywhere. Did you replace yours any idea where I can find one, The shaft diameter is .57 inches and od of seal is 1.1 any help would be greatly appreciated