New Challenge - a '74 C-160

[dtallon 320]

Picked up this '74 C-160 a few weeks ago and hadn't had a chance to post it yet.  It was a one owner tractor bought new in '74 by the husband of the widow I bought it from.  She was one of those women who had lived her whole life on a farm and could probably outwork most people half her age, myself included!   She was still using the tractor to mow the ditches when it dumped all of it's transmission fluid out the RH axle seal.  The local Toro shop said the bearing and seal needed to be replaced, and the cost to fix it was more than she wanted to put into it, so that's why she was selling it.  

 

I couldn't drive it in that condition, but the engine seemed to run well.  The 48" deck is in very good shape and bearings are nice and quiet.  The pads on the deluxe seat aren't the best, but at least everything is there.  Overall the tractor looks well maintained, but also used pretty regularly it's whole 40-year life.  She gave me the original manual.  In it were lots of notes about services done and when.  The hour meter shows a little over 1000 hours on it, but it wasn't hooked up so who knows how many hours it really has.  The notes don't say anything about engine work, but it looks to have a newer shortblock in it.  It has had some modifications over the years, but nothing that can't be undone as far as I can tell.  

 

I have already pulled the deck off and put it to work on my C-120.  It mows very nice although the C-120 does lug quite a bit if the grass is tall or wet at all.  It will do just fine for now.  I'm looking forward to digging in to the C-160 and getting it back up and running.  I'm sure a few surprises await, but hopefully they aren't too bad

 

Dave

 

 

[posifour11 723]

Wow. It looks very well taken care of. Congrats.

[dclarke 4,040]

Looks like a nice one, Dave. Lookin forward to see what you do to it.

[AMC RULES 37,141]

Congrats...       

really nice  haul there.

[Jparkes43 329]

You did well there !

James

[Lane Ranger 11,022]

Looks like a keeper for sure!

[KC9KAS 4,741]

Looking good! Nice score!

[dtallon 320]

I finally got a chance to tear into the C-160.  When looking up what transmission gasket I was going to need to order to put it back together (P/N 5999), I came across a reference to the in-chassis gasket replacement Since it was the RH side that needed the bearing and seal, the procedure worked well for taking that half of the housing off without pulling the whole rear end out of the tractor.  

 

 

 

I wasn't sure what I would find when I opened up the transmission.  I assumed I would find some debris, but the question was how much.  Inside was a nice assortment of filings, bearing race pieces, needles and ball bearings.  Wait, what, ball bearings?  Oh yeah, the dreaded 1533 bearing, totally trashed.  I proceeded hoping I could salvage one from a parts tractor.  The axle shaft had a few grooves in it from running on the failed bearing, but based on what I saw I believe the seller's story about not running it after it failed and think that was probably just from pushing it around.  The bolt heads on the diff also showed some contact wear from running without the support of the inner bearing.  While none of the wear was necessarily good, it was better than I had feared.  

 

 

 

 

 

Just getting the remains of the outer shell of the old 1533 bearing out of the housing turned out to be quite a challenge.  There was nothing left to grab on to. Even after cutting it with a dremmel in several places it put up a fight but I was finally able to get it to pop out.  The same story on the outer bearing with only the outer shell left and nothing to grab.  Just one cut with the dremmel and it fell right out.   

 

Despite attempting to be careful with the dremmel, I did get into the bearing races a little bit.  I sanded them down to eliminate any burrs, so hopefully that doesn't come back to haunt me down the road.  While I had it apart this far, I decided to pull the axle and gears out of the rear end and inspect the bearings on the LH side.  Of course the hub on that side didn't want to come off, but a combination of penetrating oil, heat and the trick of using a spare hub to pull it off did finally persuade it to come.  Thankfully the LH bearings looked good.  With everything apart, I cleaned it all as good as I could, especially the pump inlet screen.  With all the debris in there, I don't have alot of hope that I won't have to get into the pump and valve too, but the plan at this point is to put it back together and try it and see where I need to go from there.  

 

 

 

[ol550 830]

Might be a good time to replace the differential case bolts.

[posifour11 723]

Looking good. Glad you're taking pictures. I may need that info in the future.

[can whlvr 993]

at least youe parking pawl is good,they are usually stripprd

[dtallon 320]

My intention wasn’t to just let this thread die, but updating this has taken a back seat to actually working/playing with the tractors.  I’ll try to get this caught up with my progress.  

 

For replacing the 1533 bearings, I thankfully had resisted scrapping the rear end out of a Commando 8 with broken-out axle keyways.  The bearings weren’t pristine by any means, but definitely usable.  They came out without too much trouble.  I soaked them good with penetrating oil and then used a combination of a slide hammer and mechanic's pry bar to get them out.  After leaving the bearings in the freezer for a couple days, they went in without too much difficulty.  

 

 

In fact, pretty much all the putting it back together went smoothly. A few things to note:

 

Got the 5999 gasket from the local Toro dealer for $9.00.  Probably could have made it myself, but it's nice to support the local dealer, and keep some demand for these old WH parts. 

 

 

I ordered several of the 11124 Chicago Rawhide seals and one of the 6449 seals from my Toro dealer.  CR seals were $6.50 from Amazon, the Toro one was $9.50.  As noted by others, I think they will both work OK, but the Toro one is wider and fills the full recess in the end of the axle housing, whereas the CR one only goes half the depth.  

 

 

After assembly I filled it with 10W30 and replaced the filter with a NAPA 1410.  

 

After getting it all back together…  Drumroll please... It worked!  Well, mostly anyway.  It did make a couple strange noises. The first one took me a few minutes to figure out. It was the PTO pulley floating on the PTO shaft and sliding in and out of contact with the friction material.  Took it off for the time being and that noise is gone.  The second noise only occurred under load and was a rattling sound that seemed to be coming from the belt guard near the tensioner pulley.  

 

After seeing me putting around the yard on my test drives, the boys begged me to let them drive it, so I let them get a little seat time idling around the yard.  The lady I got it from had the seat mounted way forward, so it's a little tight for me but perfect for them.  They had a great time, and it was a great way to circulating the transmission oil, to get it ready for another fluid and filter change to hopefully get out any residual contamination.  

 

 

[doc724 925]

Interesting story, great work, and I love the pix of your children driving it around.  The 1970's C series are are my personal favorites. 

 

PS: that rattling noise is likely the belt guard being pushed in too close to the tensioner pulley or the bearing in the pulley is worn out.  I had the same problem after I put my C141 back together.  A minor adjustment and a new idler pulley and the noise is gone.

[Martin 2,133]

Dave, congrats on getting it back together and working.....

nice pics of the job too!

[dtallon 320]

It’s fun wrenching on and running these things for my own enjoyment, but even better when my boys can get enjoyment out of them too.  When I first got into this a few years ago, I hoped these tractors would be something we could enjoy together.  They still don’t have the patience for working on them much, but they love to drive them, especially the hystats. 

 

Don, you were right about the cause of the noise.  I thought maybe it was some slight fraying of the belt causing it, so I replaced the belt with a new one from Toro, P/N 7478. Unfortunately it wasn’t until after I got the new belt on that I learned how important position of the belt guard is.  Like many out there, this tractor has a broken tab on top of the belt guard, so the alignment is less precise that it is supposed to be.  On my test drive, the belt started smoking and I ended up turning my brand new $40 belt into one that didn't look quite so new.  After adjusting the guard, the rubbing issue was gone, as was the rattling sound that was the initial problem. 

 

The next area I turned my focus to was the engine.  It ran great at 90% throttle and below, but it coughed and sputtered periodically when running at full throttle.  I initially suspected the carb was just gunked up but after running a tank of gas & Seafoam through it, it was still doing it.  I then discovered the screen inside the tank on the inlet of the fuel valve was crushed, and after replacing the valve and fuel line the coughing was cured. 

 

Along with fixing this stuff here and there, I have been getting some seat time on the tractor.  It handles the 48†deck that came with it better than the C-120 that had been wearing it temporarily.  In places where the grass would bog the 12-horse, the 16-horse seems to hardly lug.  When I first put the deck back on the C-160 I did notice it wasn’t cutting as evenly as the C-120 did.  After trying to figure out how to adjust the side-to-side level of the deck (you can’t), I finally tracked it down to wear in the tach-a-matic hitch.  Swapping the hitch from the 120 to the 160 fixed the level problem. 

 

 

 

The grass clippings had been building up so I decided to rake them, mainly because it gave me a chance to play with my rotary rake that I bought to help clean tornado debris out of the yard and hadn't found much use for since.  My oldest son was lobbying for seat time anyway, so it let him be productive while he was making laps.

 

 

 

I have also been playing around with a rear hitch.  I installed a sleeve hitch to help the neighbor plow up his yard.  He gave up on trying to get the glass and debris from the tornado out and decided to just tear it out and start over.  It’s not the kind of project you would do if it wasn’t necessary, but we made the best of it by getting some seat time on our tractors.  Initially I couldn’t get the hitch to go low enough to get the plow in the ground, so I brought out the 854 to get things started.  Eventually I did rig it up to work, but it needs some more work before I use again.  In addition to the C-160 and 854, the C-120 got in on the fun, as well as the neighbor’s Steiner.   

 

 

 

 

Up next is some more parts swapping with the C-120, and a few changes here and there to get it ready for a plow day at the end of the month.  

Edited October 4, 2014 by dtallon

[whtractors24 3,178]

It's not a challenge a c160 is a dream!

[Pullstart 63,183]

buying tools to repair tornado damage must be a bittersweet feeling.  Glad to know glass and debris might be the worst of the neighborhood's worries and I hope everyone made it out alright.  Thanks for sharing the pictures and story!

[bo dawg 516]

Sweet Tractor! I like the homemade hub puller. I need to make me one of those. I broke mine trying to get off now I'm currently getting up the nerve to figure how to cut it off the axle. Lol!

[rollingflat 123]

Great story and pics w/ ur kids. Its really nice to find someone on the fourm thats close. I'm around the carlock aera and have just obtained

a "new" c-160 auto aswell. 

We will have to get together and talk  .

[dtallon 320]

Have been meaning to post some pictures of my snow setup on the C160 for a while but hadn't got around to it.  Finally have gotten to use it the past week or so, although after last winter I am certainly not complaining about having fewer opportunities to push snow so far this year.  

 

My setup for snow is some old Firestone "Town & Country" 6-12's that came with my 854 on the rear, and some surplus snow blower tires on the front.  I've got some Wards wheel weights on the rear and WH weights on the front, plus a couple suitcase weights tucked into the rear for good measure.  The blade is actually a newer 48" blade with a 5-position sector I came across, which I much prefer to the 42" / 3 position one I used on my old C120.    On the recommendation from someone on here, I bought a pair of Cree 18W LED spot lights for the front (love them!), and put them on a mount I built to attach to the front hitch.  I also added a set of LED strobes to make sure I can be seen.  

 

After using a Deere 140 H3 last year with a hyd lift/angle blade I was afraid I would regret getting rid of it and choosing the C160 as my snow mover for this year.  I'm happy to report that so far, so good.  I do wish it could lift the blade as high as the 140 could, but that is the only trade off I have experienced so far.  The weights and skinny tires seem to work pretty well.  They do spin on slick surfaces, but I think anything short of chains probably would.  The tractor is much easier to steer than that 140 was, and so far haven't even come close to running out of power.  I've actually been doing the neighbor's driveway to help him out and to get a little more seat time!  

 

 

 

[dclarke 4,040]

Looks good, Dave.... Thanks for the update.

[Jakeshorsetuff 36]

were did you get gasket 5999

[dtallon 320]

I got gasket #5999 from my local Toro dealer, Wieland's Lawnmower Hospital in Washington, IL.  

[DennisThornton 4,769]

I just downloaded and read the Toro service PDFs for pulling the right hub, splitting the trans case and reinstalling.  I had to chuckle and pass it on.  I'm trying to think of some clever or funny comment, but I'll just leave that to others:

"A FLAT LABOR RATE OF $5 WILL BE APPROVED,  PLUS THE COST OF THE LUBRICANT LOST AS THE RESULT OF THE LEAKAGE."

Dennis Thornton

 

[dtallon 320]

So much for trying to buy WH parts to help make sure Toro keeps making them...

Ordered another 5999 gasket last week for a different project.  After a few days the dealer called back and said they were discontinued.  At least it wasn't too hard to make.  

Also ordered 2 axle seals which thankfully are still available.  One of the Chicago Rawhide ones I put in was already leaking, so I will use the Toro ones from now on.  

Dave