Wheelhorses & Snow Removal

[RMCIII 838]

You know I hate to be a "anal retentive" SOB, but I did some research. I have yet to find another Breco blower on youtube that even comes close to the height and distance he is pushing it. Most I found, my single stage, pushed snow further and had a better plume. Sorry but I call that one B.S. Unless it came stock with an improved impeller kit already installed. I spent a better part of 2hrs. just searching, nothing. So something is up with that specific set-up.

[jimmycrackcorn 4]

You know I hate to be a "anal retentive" SOB, but I did some research. I have yet to find another Breco blower on youtube that even comes close to the height and distance he is pushing it. Most I found, my single stage, pushed snow further and had a better plume. Sorry but I call that one B.S. Unless it came stock with an improved impeller kit already installed. I spent a better part of 2hrs. just searching, nothing. So something is up with that specific set-up.

Oh yeah..LOL..? It could be... I did see others but that one was easier to veiw.. I can say that the video i posted up did sound quite different than most I've seen in person. Who knows, maybe it was fluffy snow, maybe he upped the tractors governor?

Without drinking the kool-aid go to the guys site & read the FAQ's. He claims over & over that they throw significantly further than all other setups. Some of the questions are ppl retiring their current tractor brand blowers, i don't he would be in business if he was selling BS. If you got the time to search for clips, punch out an email & ask him yourself..? See what he has to say, pick his brain... Id be curious to see what he says.

[baerpath 517]

It don't mean much but I have had both a Berco and a WH 2stage. I've sold my WH 2 stage and am looking for another Berco/Bervac for next year. Yes they will throw farther than a horse but I think thats because the shoot is larger and the impellor seems to spin faster(never checked).  I do have a single stage tall shoot that I will use if I need to but that is for sale also. 

I also have a 72 inch bucket on a JD for the icey stuff or if worst comes to worst a JD 1010 dozer LOL

[jimmycrackcorn 4]

Haha.. A dozer! Yeah.. Could i get a wrote on plowing my sidewalk? Lol.

Sounds like you've run them all, that's some good insight, thanks my friend!

[leeave96 487]

Well that's quite the line up, why so many? Arent the attatchments simple enough to just pop on & off? I can't see the purpose of that many.. haha.., unless of course you just like having them which is fine too.

Personally, I'd rather have one that can do it all thus the reason i brought up the Walker brand machine. I think I'm going to sell my Wright Stander & get one down the road when affordable.

Tell me why you don't think it's a fair comparison? Earlier on in this thread i entertained the fact & said it myself that these zero turns & tractors might be two different poisons but no one really got into detail on it. I would argue the fact that you say the zero turns are just for mowing as the Walker brands accepts implements & most other brands accept attachments. Also, every WheelHorse I've seen around here was bought specifically for mowing & blowing, nothing more. Then WheelHorse went under & ppl moved onto newer designs. But that is just my demographic, it could be different elsewhere. With that said, i think it's comparable, just two different eras.

Why a two stage? Well as I've mentioned a few times in this thread we've been getting hammered with snow the past few years. I also happen to live in a valley where the wind whips through & creates some big drifts, i don't want to just chug along, i want the machine to process it & toss it into the woods that are 30-80 feet away depending on where I'm at. I've also been doing some research & have come across quite a few threads where ppl say the single is better & they like it better than the two stage, i then go look at there location & it will be down south somewhere, it pretty much discredits the post as they most likely get 8" of snow once a year. There's a reason that the two stage was developed & is now more common than singles, it moves more snow. Understanding that the two stage is heavier & requires alot more maintenance, I've been considering a Bercomac blower as well. My reasoning is that they are still in production & i could probably get a newer one for the same or less money than a collectable wheelhorse blower that most likley needs work unless brand new. I've mentioned the berco a few times but haven't heard any feedback from y'all. Have you ever heard of them? I'll post up a video for ya. Its pretty impressive. Sorry it's not on a red tractor, throws pretty far though considering it's all stock & run by a 16hp Deere.

Impressive video! There used to be a post years ago showing a 2 stage Wheelhorse blower throwing snow from the front of the house, over the top of the roof to the back side of the house.

Its cool to see how far the blowers will blow, but is that really necessary? Reason I ask is, aside from the awe factor of the long distance throw, IMHO the goal is to get the snow off the driveway or in my case the street. Not everyone has enough space to throw snow 30 or more feet. I've read some folks will plow snow as it's faster, but sometimes you run out of room to push it and out comes the snow thrower. All that is necessary is to throw the snow over/past the pushed/pile of snow. In my case, I had/have trouble with my single stage snow thrower not putting snow on the neighbors porch.

Great thread!!!!

Edited March 8, 2014 by leeave96

[bigfkd22 11]

I don't think there is any argument that the Berco throws snow farther. It's because it spins faster. There are 3 points that need to be made about the video first is that its an onan 18 and wheel horse 520s an some 416 have the onan 20/16 so it does not matter if it green or red all that matters is rpm at the pto. Second is the temperature and texture of the snow is VERY important because 1 inch of rain at 32 degrees is about 5 inches of snow and at 15 degrees it's about 15 inches. The lighter it is the farther it will be thrown. My third point is (that I keep reiterating) cost a 318 with a Berco is going to cost a bunch more than a typical wh with a single or even a 2 stage blower.

Whoever reads this thread in the future nobody here is talking about a walker zero turn with attachments as comparable to our beloved tractors. Sorry your talking 12-15k it's just a ridiculous comparison. Sorry but I think the original poster is pulling our collective chain.

[jimmycrackcorn 4]

I don't think there is any argument that the Berco throws snow farther. It's because it spins faster..

Whoever reads this thread in the future nobody here is talking about a walker zero turn with attachments as comparable to our beloved tractors. Sorry your talking 12-15k it's just a ridiculous comparison. Sorry but I think the original poster is pulling our collective chain.

The berco was indeed being discussed. Multiple ppl have mentioned it blows just as far & there are those who have said it doesn't. Honestly most of the feedback is all over the map.

How is the comparison ridiculous, they are both the best machines of their time designed to do relative chores. I don't understand what 12-15k has anything to do with it. A dollar in the 80's is now almost 3. My only point in the OP was how a 15-20 yr old tractor is still worth the same as a 5-10yr old commercial machine that will do similar, if not the same tasks, but faster with more professional looking results. Now that Walker had been brought into the conversation it's even more of a valid comparison as they run a whole assortment of implements that are gear or belt driven & can be had on the used market for thousands less than 12-15k. A Walker is just one of a few that do such chores. But price points have already been discussed by quite a few & are now understood, no need to go backwards or accuse me of pulling chains.

One question that I've asked that hasn't been discussed is, what happened to wheel horse, why did they go under or get bought out? Why did they never get into the newer commercial designs like everyone else did. I would imagine if they were the top dog of there time they would have rode the wave into the emerging commercial market. Was it a case of not evolving with the times or was a case of owners that were done & wanted to cash out?

[bigfkd22 11]

Again I've had the bervac which is essentially the Berco and a wheel horse tall shoot single a short single and a wh xi 2 stage on the 522xi as seen in my avatar. Bervac/Berco blows the farthest it spins the fastest. I didn't keep it because I wanted power steering which I have in my current set up. Farthest isn't always best.

A walker has been brought up before by the op. It's a commercial mower not a residential (for the most part). Wh was always a residential mower/tractor. It's a a very expensive zero turn.

I'm talking in today's dollars you can buy an awesome used wh package for 2-2.5k. I'm using this number as it's much higher than most of the guys here bought there rig. I'm taking tractor, blower blade tiller etc. Yes you have to hunt for them yes they will be used yes they will have some rust need a little work.

They stopped making wh because of economic factors. People want cheap stuff painted green from china. They get 500 hours on a mower and that's a lot then they throw it away. My c160 is built like a tank it would cost a fortune to build today. Plus people today if they have 5k+ to spend they are buying a zero turn. This is all IMHO. Rant over.

[RMCIII 838]

More to that point..... WH was absorbed into Toro....You can still purchase a Toro GT, but it is not the same.... Toro is, as I have stated in other threads, a remarkable, well talked about product when it comes to golf courses...John Deere, Jacobson, Ransom all have played the "catch-up" game in this area. If Toro were to put forth the effort, they could bring back the WH, but we have had that discussion before also...The price would be staggering and what would the "fit" be? John Deere, Simplicity, Kubota, ect...all have the SCUT market. Introducing a WH into that market would make sense, but the name has been forgotten, except for those who truly know what WH meant...So, how would it sell? Would you put $7k down on a product that has the name WH, just because you wanted a new WH regardless of the ROI factor? I'd like to think that Toro would do it right. But remember, in their market of golf courses, everyone else is still playing the catch up game with Toro...Would it not stand to reason that Toro would need to catch-up with everyone else in the SCUT market?

As for the $2-2.5k package, if you can find one, better jump on it fast because someone else will. There is a 520H rig on TractorHouse. Asking price is $3,900.00. Attachments are mower deck, tiller, 2-stage and a cab...Only 320hrs....That is a deal and a half....Karl, not advertising, just making a point is all.

Final point...Yes, Berco/Bervac are known for their ability to throw snow....But that video is over the top...I realize there are many factors that allow snow to be thrown as stated above....But I promise you the Berco's you purchase today will not deliver that type of performance unless you do something to enhance or modify the impeller clearance/// done with my rant!

[Hydro 131]

I would also suggest the American market place has changed greatly during the evolution of Wheel Horse.  Wheel Horse was almost a necessity in rural America with the gardens and way of life after the war.  Urban society no longer has the same need for gardens and lives on smaller properties.  The life style and the buying culture has changed and with it so has the market.  JD has been able to evolve meeting the needs of the consumer as well as the commercial user.  Toro has been evolving too but not with Wheel Horse.  With all due respect to our beloved little tractors, they lived their day.  Many of us are fortunate enough to be able to own them and use them but in reality there is no market today for what they are.

[Uncle Buck 246]

I would also suggest the American market place has changed greatly during the evolution of Wheel Horse.  Wheel Horse was almost a necessity in rural America with the gardens and way of life after the war.  Urban society no longer has the same need for gardens and lives on smaller properties.  The life style and the buying culture has changed and with it so has the market.  JD has been able to evolve meeting the needs of the consumer as well as the commercial user.  Toro has been evolving too but not with Wheel Horse.  With all due respect to our beloved little tractors, they lived their day.  Many of us are fortunate enough to be able to own them and use them but in reality there is no market today for what they are.

I view the issue a bit differently. There are still a number of other like sized tractors and brands sold, for that reason I disagree with the premise that there is a lack of need. I think the Pond family had great success but ultimately without a family member that wanted to continue in the family business logically Cecil reached a point where he had to find a purchaser that appeared to be a well suited fit for his brand. Toro was a logical choice for the time, but clearly as time passed and technology changed the company rightfully so decided to follow the trends that drove profitability within the industry. The zero turn mowers, walk behind with sulky platforms and models aimed at current trends were where the company had to go to earn profits for shareholders. Also, while there was and continues to be a market for conventional garden tractors like Wheel Horse perhaps Toro decided it wanted to project itself as a product aimed at the commercial industry and not the homeowner. Look at what Deere, International and most other manufacturers of conventional garden tractors have had to do to stay in the market aimed at homeowners, generally models sold at big box stores are not as heavily built as older models like WH, routinely imported and priced competitively at low price points to attract the thrifty minded homeowner. Maybe Tore simply decided this was not a market they wanted to persue with the WH brand.

 

I could keep going but momma says she wants to go to breakfast now! LOL

[Larry Fostano 6]

I have a 520XI with 48" recycler deck and 2 stage snow thrower for sale . Also lookingb for a loader for a John Deere 4100 , the loader model is a 410, thanks