toddsanderson 23 #1 Posted February 11, 2014 (edited) Hi Guys, I am new to the forum so please excuse my ignorance in where to post. I have used the search function trying to find a re-power alternative to my Wheel Horse "Air Horse" tactor / aircraft tug. I did not find what I was looking for so I am asking for some help. This is probably the best aircraft tug available today and I want to save it instead of selling it. It has a KT-17 and hydro drive. The hydraulic pump also drives the wheel lift and steering. I have not been able to make the KT17 run properly since purchasing it. I have changed the plugs, rebuilt the carb and set it according to the manual, changed the fuel filter, etc. Basically, it will not run unless the choke is on and then it runs poorly requiring varing choke and throttle positions. I either need to have an expert go through the engine and make it right or re-power it with something modern. I need reliability as this is used to move many aircraft on a tight schedule. While I am mechanically inclined, I just don't have the time to tinker with it right now. I would greatly appreciate a recommendation of a shop that could fix what I have or re-power this machine for me. I am not afraid to spend money on it and want it correct. I would prefer to take the whole machine to a shop and have it repaired at their shop. I live in NE Indiana (Auburn) and would be willing to travel 100 miles or so. Thank you in advance for your help! Edited February 11, 2014 by toddsanderson 3 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
roscoemi 245 #2 Posted February 11, 2014 Sounds like you need to have a look at the fuel system. I have no idea where to go down there, but some one local will chime in before too long. Kool horse by the way! And welcome to RedSquare! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
leeave96 487 #3 Posted February 11, 2014 (edited) Sounds to me like a fuel delivery problem. Easy to harder: old/fouled spark plugs, carb adjustment, fuel filter clogging, fuel pump going out, dirty carb (read rebuild). If the engine otherwise runs well, I think it's a simple fix. When is the last time the engine had a good tune-up? Neat looking machine. Welcome to R.S. Edited February 11, 2014 by leeave96 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
toddsanderson 23 #4 Posted February 11, 2014 I replaced the plugs, rebuilt the carb with a new float, needle, as well as new gaskets. I could not get the main jet out without destroying the carb, so I made sure it was clean and re-installed everything. Same problem. I then bought another brand new carb with an electric choke (otherwise the same carb - used in generators). I disabled the choke and used it manually. Same results. It would appear that I have a lean condition with possibly a weak fuel pump, but I can see fuel flow through the filter when it cranks and runs. I'm wondering if I possibly just have a worn out engine, bad coil, or possibly points bad. I really would like to stick a Honda or Briggs engine in it, but cannot find anyone that has a kit available. I'm sure a shop could handle fixing the one I have or re-power, just can't seem to find one. It really is a neat machine and moves airplanes well. If I can get it to run correctly I plan to restore it to like new appearance. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Don1977 604 #5 Posted February 11, 2014 A v-twin Honda or a Briggs Vanguard would be an easy repower as you don't have a PTO. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
toddsanderson 23 #6 Posted February 11, 2014 Don, You are probably are correct that it would be an easy swap, but there is still the manufacturing of a mount that will align the engine shaft and pulley properly with the hyro pulley. I was hoping someone had already done it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Foozerush 40 #7 Posted February 11, 2014 I'm right down the road from you in the Fort. Right now I'm short 2 guys at work and working 6-7 days. If I had the time I'm sure I could whip her into shape, or at least help you pinpoint what the deal is with it, you replaced some key components, shouldn't be much more. I'll keep an eye on this thread and see if you made any progress, but work has me busy, and I don't see a 2 day weekend for a while. Gregg Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shorts 182 #8 Posted February 12, 2014 Start at the fuel tank, drain it, remove the fitting and look at the filter screen that should be on the fitting, it's not uncommon for them to be either damaged or removed and the fitting full of trash, clean or replace the fitting and filter and then replace the fuel line from the tank to the engine. if the tank screen is missing you can install an inline fuel filter then check the fuel pump, if it's bad either a new mechanical or electric pump would be in order. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Crown Vic P71 20 #9 Posted February 12, 2014 (edited) I had the problem with my c125 I was told to unhook the fuel line from the fuel pump then cup your hands around the fuel tank where you fill it and blow into it. If gas comes out the other end of te line There is no clog if everything there is ok then disconnect the fuel line between the carb and fuel pump and turn over. If gas comes out then the fuel pump is good, if the pump is good then it's a carburetor problem... This helped me out on my c125 but I'm not sure if anything is set up the same way on yours if you are able to do these steps you should be able to figure out what is wrong. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Edited February 12, 2014 by TractorfanC125 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
smoreau 658 #10 Posted February 12, 2014 Sounds like a bad fuel pump, I have 3 KT17's and a magnum 18. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Don1977 604 #11 Posted February 12, 2014 (edited) Don, You are probably are correct that it would be an easy swap, but there is still the manufacturing of a mount that will align the engine shaft and pulley properly with the hyro pulley. I was hoping someone had already done it. I did it 24 years ago with a 16 Briggs Vanguard. Up graded to an 18 Briggs Vanguard in 2010. I did it on a 1977 C-120 you have a lot more room on the Black Hood. The only thing you need to get right is the the same height and location of the power take off shaft and pulley alinement. I bought both engines with the wiring it made it easier to change as it came with the Briggs switch. Put " Repowering Our 520H" in the search block above for a thread on a Honda repower. Edited February 12, 2014 by Don1977 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackC 617 #12 Posted February 12, 2014 It definitely sounds like a fuel delivery problem. If the carburetor is good, then it could be a weak fuel pump due to a bad diaphragm. Those are easy to find and replace and worth a try. A machine like that probably does not have a lot of hours on it compared to a machine that spends a lot of time mowing grass or moving snow. I doubt the engine is worn out but it may be carbon-ed up since it likely is not run too hard for long periods. A replacement KT17 from a used Wheel Horse would keep it closer to original and would be the easiest to do. Mechanics at most mower shops, or even at your air strip, should be able to fix if you do not have the time. Those engines are also sensitive to the points and condenser being set and working properly. Sometimes the points need to be cleaned and re-gaped. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
toddsanderson 23 #13 Posted February 12, 2014 I'm right down the road from you in the Fort. Right now I'm short 2 guys at work and working 6-7 days. If I had the time I'm sure I could whip her into shape, or at least help you pinpoint what the deal is with it, you replaced some key components, shouldn't be much more. I'll keep an eye on this thread and see if you made any progress, but work has me busy, and I don't see a 2 day weekend for a while. Gregg How much cash does it take for you to come to the Auburn airport and fix it? There is a local shop in Auburn that does small engine repair, but I have to load up the machine and take it to him. This thing weighs about 1700 lbs. Pretty hard to move since it will not run. I'm willing to pay someone to make it right. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WH nut 553 #14 Posted February 12, 2014 Im right up the road in battle Creek, I may be able to have a look see Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AMC RULES 37,130 #15 Posted February 12, 2014 Cool ...good luck with it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
whfan74 2,066 #16 Posted February 12, 2014 I am sure my dad, retired Wheel Horse dealer, would be more than happy to swing by and take a look and get you back in business. He is located just outside of Warsaw, IN......so not too far from you. Just shoot me a pm if you are interested and we can probably work something out. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
toddsanderson 23 #17 Posted February 19, 2014 Well, some good news! The fuel shutoff valve was seized in place. I twisted it back and forth a few times and it broke loose. When I cranked the engine over I noticed the fuel flow through the fuel filter was constant and had much more volume than before. The engine fired right up and ran like it should whether at idle or full speed. Regardless, I am going to have Scott's dad go though this machine completely. It has oil leaks, the fuel lines are old, the plug wires look old, and it needs a brand new paint job and body work. It should be neat to see what it looks like done. 6 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
toddsanderson 23 #18 Posted March 11, 2014 Well, it looks like my horse will get a new Briggs vanguard twin. Mine has carb issues and probably could use points etc. I need this machine to be reliable to move the planes. Should be really nice with modern power. The old KT17 is low time and is mechanically fine. Anyone here have use for the engine? I had an offer a few months ago when I first thought of repowering. Would be happy to sell it to someone on the forum first. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
eh2fay 8 #19 Posted March 21, 2014 How much you asking? Series I or II. Have a c175 I'm looking to redo and may need engine parts. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
toddsanderson 23 #20 Posted April 14, 2014 Air Horse is just about done. New Briggs being final fitted and tin is at the powdercoaters. Looking forward to having it back. It sure makes moving planes much easier! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
whfan74 2,066 #21 Posted April 15, 2014 I appreciate you putting your trust in us Todd. We are really trying to plug away on this and feel horrible about the delays. Life isn't fair and we must, and will, move forward. Can't wait to get it done and available for pick up. Hang in there......dad is really trying! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stigian 1,234 #22 Posted April 15, 2014 What a fantastic Wheel Horse, you don't see them like that every day.. Or at all come to that Glad your getting the engine issues sorted with a re-power. Any chance of seeing your Wh in action moving planes when it's back in action? It would be cool to see Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
toddsanderson 23 #23 Posted April 15, 2014 I appreciate you putting your trust in us Todd. We are really trying to plug away on this and feel horrible about the delays. Life isn't fair and we must, and will, move forward. Can't wait to get it done and available for pick up. Hang in there......dad is really trying! No worries. Looking forward to having it back. It takes 1/5 the effort to move a plane with the Air Horse than with a tow bar and tug. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
toddsanderson 23 #24 Posted April 15, 2014 What a fantastic Wheel Horse, you don't see them like that every day.. Or at all come to that Glad your getting the engine issues sorted with a re-power. Any chance of seeing your Wh in action moving planes when it's back in action? It would be cool to see What a fantastic Wheel Horse, you don't see them like that every day.. Or at all come to that Glad your getting the engine issues sorted with a re-power. Any chance of seeing your Wh in action moving planes when it's back in action? It would be cool to see Yep, I think I will like having a modern engine in the machine. The old engine is low time and I believe has good internals. When it runs, it is very strong, but it just starts running bad for no reason at times. I will definitely shoot some video moving planes. It is a lot of fun to move planes around with this machine. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Forest Road 594 #25 Posted April 17, 2014 Sounds like a great project. I was driving by Teterboro airport in NJ recently and saw an Xi powered air tug. One of the last wheel horses built. Would live to see one working. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
