squonk 40,740 #1 Posted January 11, 2014 Marvin has developed a bit of an illness. C-145A It would run for like 10 min. then die. After sitting a bit it would restart and run for a couple and die. Now it will start and run for maybe 15-20 seconds and die. When it acts up, it sure seems like it runs out of gas. It will be in the process of quitting then it will fire and die again and finally quit all together. This is what I have done so far between plumbing projects in the house. I looked in the rear tank. I saw junk in the fuel valve and an old gas cap gasket half covering the hole. Drained out gas,cleaned out junk. checked the fuel filter,. It is clean. Checked the amount of fuel being delivered to the pump, good flow REPLACED FUEL PUMP WITH NEW ONE! Replaced carb with one that I had rebuilt 2 years ago and it was sitting wrapped in plastic on the shelf as a spare checked to see if voltage was dropping out to the coil ok replaced condenser replaced coil and wire with spares I had around Replaced the spark plug. Old plug that wasn't very old at all had lots of carbon on it. I have inspected the points. The contacts are white with no burnt spots. After I did every step I tried running it and it does the EXACT SAME THING! My next step is going to be removing the fuel line from the pump outlet and checking how much is being pumped and the quality of the gas will be looked at. It was fresh gas but who knows nowadays. If that checks out I'm going to replace the points. I can't believe points would be so intermittent but i guess anything possible. Thoughts? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AMC RULES 37,102 #2 Posted January 11, 2014 Humm...is the rubber fuel line new too Mike? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wishin4a416 2,190 #3 Posted January 11, 2014 My 312-8 had very similar symtons as yours years ago all except for running for 15-20 seconds. Mine ran for 10 minutes and quit. It was never just for seconds. Anyway my problem was a sticky exhaust valve. Just something to check if your other changes dont work. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
squonk 40,740 #4 Posted January 11, 2014 Humm...is the rubber fuel line new too Mike? I've been thinkin about that line. That's one reason I want to see how much fuel that new pump is pumping. Haven't had the time lately to work on it. Putting in a new tankless water heater in and it's one of those square pegs into a round hole kind of projects. 200 yr old houses are great! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AMC RULES 37,102 #5 Posted January 11, 2014 You'll get it figured out... lot's of time before the big show. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Racinbob 10,864 #6 Posted January 11, 2014 A long shot here but I have seen it happen. Is the gas tank vent clear? In years past I had a couple (not Wheel Horses) start pulling a vacuum in the tank and starving the engine. It seems to me that the engine would run longer than that though. I Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chazm 413 #7 Posted January 11, 2014 Humm...is the rubber fuel line new too Mike? I'm with Craig on the fuel line I would replace the filter as well... cheap insurance Also you will love the tank-less water heater once you get it in the round hole ...endless hot water Chasm Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
squonk 40,740 #8 Posted January 11, 2014 If you watch my video in Jerseyhawgs snow plowing thread you will see Marvin's running fine. About 10 seconds after I stopped the video it started to bog down Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JERSEYHAWG / Glenn 4,497 #9 Posted January 12, 2014 (edited) Mike. Imho. Fuel line breaking down and clogged. Whatever residue was in tank. Replace line and filter. Glenn Edit: starving for fuel. Edited January 12, 2014 by JERSEYHAWG / Glenn Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
baerpath 517 #10 Posted January 12, 2014 Blow back into the fuel tank could be the strainer in the tank is plugged. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steve k 82 #11 Posted January 12, 2014 Squonk Start it up and as soon as it starts to die have someone spray carb cleaner in the air intake of the carb, if it picks back up it is a fuel problem, if it does not pick back up the problem is not any thing to do with fuel. I use this trick all the time. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
can whlvr 993 #12 Posted January 12, 2014 do you have an inline spark detector,the ones you put on the sparkplug wire,then you could rule out the ignition,watch it when it dies,i would replace the fuel lines and filter,to rule them out as stated already,then look in to the valve,maybe when it dies you could pull the head and look at the top of the valves,but it may not show by then as every thing will cool and probally not be stuck,but worth a look Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
953 nut 54,375 #13 Posted January 12, 2014 If you watch my video in Jerseyhawgs snow plowing thread you will see Marvin's running fine. About 10 seconds after I stopped the video it started to bog down Turn the video camera back on and it should run fine! 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wheel-N-It 2,968 #14 Posted January 12, 2014 Mike this is one of those little ghost problems that can take alot of trouble shooting and several more replaced parts to figure out. You're gonna love that tankless water heater though. Make sure you have enough gas going to it. I have seen where the gas meter needed to be replaced to get enoug fuel to the heater. Also I have seen where you need to change everything from a 1/2 pound system to a 2 pound system, then install a regulator at each fuel burning appliance. So if you are having a problem with the water heater keeping up with your needs, don't at first blame the water heater, it can easily be starved for fuel. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
squonk 40,740 #15 Posted January 12, 2014 I know 12 V is not dropping out to the coil. Everything in the ign. system has been replaced but the points.I find it hard to believe a valve is sticking as the engine doesn't have a chance to even get warm. I tried spraying carb cleaner as it was dying and it doesn't seem to help. I'm going to replace the line and if that doesn't help the points. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackC 617 #16 Posted January 12, 2014 (edited) If the problem developed right after Marvin was engaged in snow removal duty there could be a moisture or water in fuel problem somewhere. Maybe rig up a small temporary gravity feed tank and tube with fresh fuel either before or after the fuel pump. Just like they do in hospitals when your body is not working. Also be sure the points are adjusted properly. My 8 horse will not run if the points are off by even a little. Edited January 12, 2014 by JackC Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wheel-N-It 2,968 #17 Posted January 12, 2014 Mike if you sprayed carb cleaner in it as it was dying but things did not change then I would suspect an electrical problem. I was having a similar problem like that on the 314 Hydro I bought just before Christmas. Turns out one of the safety switches at the PTO was a little flakey. I'm not a big fan of those anyway so i took it out of the system and no more problem. I also had the very same problem with the 310-8 I bought from Jay. Of course when I bought the tractor there was no engine in it so he didn't know there was a problem with that safety switch. Anyway, just a thought. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steve k 82 #18 Posted January 12, 2014 squonk, what wheel n it said. If you sprayed carb cleaner it the carb as it was dying and the motor did not recover that means it was not lacking fuel. That leaves compression or spark as the culprit. Steve Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Desko 588 #19 Posted January 12, 2014 It most likely is an electrical problem because compression would not factor in if it ran for 10 minutes because it would not fire at all if it had low compression. Check you spark you may have a bad coil that kills out after it gets hot. That is just my 2 cents on it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JERSEYHAWG / Glenn 4,497 #20 Posted January 12, 2014 Everybody likes Mike & Marvin. Will be following this close. Go get em Mike. Glenn 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
squonk 40,740 #21 Posted January 12, 2014 Not the coil..All ready tried another. All that's left in the IGN. system that haven't been replaced are the points and switch. I have a super secret way I'm going to test them. I don't want to jinx myself so I will reveal it after testing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JimD 3,345 #22 Posted January 12, 2014 (edited) Mike, check the wire from the coil to the points for weak spots or breaks. It could be that when it warms it breaks contact and when it cools it makes contact momentarily. I had this happen to my B80 once. I replaced the wire and it's been fine since then. Also make sure the condenser you replaced is grounded well. That will produce the symptoms you describe too. Edited January 12, 2014 by JimD 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steve k 82 #23 Posted January 12, 2014 desko I was just thinking if a valve was sticking open=no compression. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wheel-N-It 2,968 #24 Posted January 12, 2014 desko I was just thinking if a valve was sticking open=no compression. Steve, on the level here too. Also I try to encourage everyone to run MMO in their fuel. This will work wonders to prevent the valves from sticking. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AMC RULES 37,102 #25 Posted January 12, 2014 I also had the very same problem with the 310-8 I bought from Jay. Of course when I bought the tractor there was no engine in it so... Did you try making a warranty claim anyway. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
