Filling rust pits

[tommyg 152]

I picked up a 60 deck this weekend and want to work on restoring it as a winter project. The top of the deck at one particular area has some really deep metal pitting from rust. Still solid, but will look terrible if I leave it as is. I came upon a product called Lab Metal. Has anyone had any experience with this? Looks like a miracle in a can if you read all the stuff it can fix, one of them being metal pitting.

[rmaynard 15,730]

I have used Lab Metal on items that needed to be powder coated. However, if you are going to be painting it, a good glazing putty is much cheaper, and easier to work with. Product I use is called Icing. Heavily pitted areas usually need to be sandblasted, then spray a coat of epoxy primer before glazing.

[clintonnut 126]

You can use either glazing filler or high build primer. I'd probably coat the whole thing in glazing filler as it flows out nice and is easy to sand.

[eb in oregon 28]

As long as you get any active rust out, pretty much any two part epoxy should work. Some sand or grind better than others, but they all do the same thing. I'm not convinced priming the piece before applying your filler really makes a difference, but it can't hurt.

[tommyg 152]

I'm concerned about the longevity of filler on a piece that's subject to a lot of abuse and vibration. This stuff seemed hard as nails, but I don't know what it's like to work with.

[eb in oregon 28]

Your concern is appreciated, but these are your options as I see it. You can use a filler, or you cannot use a filler, you only have those two choices without welding or brazing.

 

I would conjecture that if you were to have your deck bead/sand blasted, or hydro blasted (industrial pressure washer rated at 40,000 pounds) to prepare the deck, your chances of failure are reduced as this insures that there is ZERO rust to grow again. I myself would be loath to spend the time and funds. I would pressure wash the deck, hit it hard with a wire wheel, clean with acetone , and slap on JB weld or the two part Locktite compound. I'd use an angle die grinder with a 1 1/2 or 2 inch spiral lock sanding pad to get close, then hand sand or use an orbital sander if there is room.

 

I think the two aforementioned compounds are more durable and vibration resistant than body filler, but then, maybe not. I prefer to do a job once. I dislike having to go back and start all over. But sometimes that's just the way it goes. Regardless, unless you are planning to run that deck each and every day, I think you have a pretty good chance your repair will last for years.

[tommyg 152]

"...and slap on JB weld or the two part Locktite compound."

Loctite was another option I looked at as well as a product made by the same people who make POR15. Can't remember the name. Seemed like that was an epoxy type system. Thanks for the tidbits. I've gotta do some modifications to make the deck fit my D first. But hopefully later this winter, I can start the restoration process.

[Ed Kennell 39,162]

I've used  Tuf Fil Polyester by Freeman Mfg. with great success. It feathers out really well.

[tommyg 152]

I've used  Tuf Fil Polyester by Freeman Mfg. with great success. It feathers out really well.

Looked it up and that looks like a good alternative as well. Thanks for the idea!

[953 nut 56,159]

  Glazing putty is easy to use, but I wouldn't use it on an item that will be USED hard like a deck. It has two inharent problems, it will not take abuse and it expands and contracts at a different rate than the metal so it will tend to show in the sunshine.

 

JB Weld is the best IMHO, while doing a restoration on a 1919 American Le France fire engine a few years back I filled a few corroded areas in the water pump that went completely through. I sand blasted the pump (aluminum ) and repaired it with JB Weld as a stop gap until I could find another pump; never found one and never need to. The JB is like new 22 years and a lot of fire apparatus musters later. 

["D"- Man 827]

I have used Lab Metal, if you are using it for the first time, I suggest that you learn on a practice piece first, until you are confident that you completely understand how to make it work for your application and purpose.  It helped me to call the manufacturer and ask for advice on how to use it, as the instructions are sort of incomplete.  If you do not plan on powder-coating or plating after, I would have a go at something else.

[Jerry77 1,218]

On 12/3/2013 at 10:00 AM, eb in oregon said:

Your concern is appreciated, but these are your options as I see it. You can use a filler, or you cannot use a filler, you only have those two choices without welding or brazing.

 

I would conjecture that if you were to have your deck bead/sand blasted, or hydro blasted (industrial pressure washer rated at 40,000 pounds) to prepare the deck, your chances of failure are reduced as this insures that there is ZERO rust to grow again. I myself would be loath to spend the time and funds. I would pressure wash the deck, hit it hard with a wire wheel, clean with acetone , and slap on JB weld or the two part Locktite compound. I'd use an angle die grinder with a 1 1/2 or 2 inch spiral lock sanding pad to get close, then hand sand or use an orbital sander if there is room.

 

I think the two aforementioned compounds are more durable and vibration resistant than body filler, but then, maybe not. I prefer to do a job once. I dislike having to go back and start all over. But sometimes that's just the way it goes. Regardless, unless you are planning to run that deck each and every day, I think you have a pretty good chance your repair will last for years.

 

Pretty hard to beat JB Weld ..for almost any repair..have a friend who used it to repair cracks in a motor block that he took to Bonneville Salt Flats and ran to 160 mph...wouldn't have believed that except that I saw it...good luck

[cschannuth 3,817]

JB Weld will outlast the rest of the deck. 

[DennisThornton 4,769]

Don't forget solder!  Well, the old time autobody guys would refer to it as "lead", but solder is great for filling pits if whatever you are working on can stand the heat, and solder doesn't need much heat.  Lots of folks think you have to braze or weld, and if strength is an issue then perhaps you must, but for rust pits or a no longer needed small holes most can be fixed very nicely with a little propane torch and solder!  Larger holes will need a filler, maybe a washer or stamp-out to fill the hole and a little more skill, but most anybody can fill a pit with minimal soldering skills.  And while it won't completely restore the strength it is a heck of a lot stronger then most (all?) other fillers that don't require heat.

 

For those who haven't soldered, many fail because they try to solder rust or otherwise dirty metal.  Clean metal, some flux and just enough heat will make solder flow like mercury and remind you of the Terminator II!

[Horse46 519]

Dennis I would love to give this a try, do you mean solder as in whats used to solder copper pipes?

[rmaynard 15,730]

 

[rmaynard 15,730]

My thoughts...after you watch this, you will probably think like I did...sand blast and glazing putty is a lot simpler.

[DennisThornton 4,769]

Filling a pit is different than what the gent from Eastwood is doing. He's working with an old and heavy gauge rounded fender that basically is too strong to badly warp from the heat and is using lead as a filler instead of polyester autobody filler, or as many use the brand name, "Bondo".  Today's vehicles with thinner gauge flat panels are VERY difficult to fill and smooth with lead, and there's really no need to.  But rust pits can be filled easily with solder to form a strong and waterproof fix that can still use autobody filler to finish smoothing.  At least the lead will prevent moisture from penetrating into the filler. Of course a non-porous filler like Alum-a-Lead or perhaps even JB-Weld and others could also be used where strength is less of a concern.  I just wanted those without the tools or experience of brazing or welding to know that there are times when a first class repair can be made with a simple propane torch and plumbers solder.

[DennisThornton 4,769]

On 8/5/2016 at 5:57 AM, Horse46 said:

Dennis I would love to give this a try, do you mean solder as in whats used to solder copper pipes?

Well, yes sort of.  "Solder" is not all the same and the "lead free" is certainly not "lead" filler but still, "Yes!", sort of.  Yeah, even lead free will work fine with filling pits but you might want to start off with acid core leaded solder.  Though I've heard such terrible things about lead, the mercury I played with as a kid, the asbestos I breathed in autobody and brake repair and all the hydrocarbon solvents I breathed and washed my hands in for years.  If I suddenly don't reply to any more posts you'll perhaps understand...

 

It's curious folks like you that make me and I'm sure many others right here, want to share what we have learned through the decades so our "technology" won't die.  Oh I so wish I could have a time machine and go back to the old blacksmiths, pattern makers, sand casters and machinists!  I fear that SO much has been lost or at least tossed to the wayside and will be lost...

 

Hey, grab some acid flux and some kind of solder, drill some 1/8" holes in some sheet metal and fill them up with solder!  You'll be tickled!  Then try some 3/8" holes and become humble again!  <grin>!

[rmaynard 15,730]

1 hour ago, DennisThornton said:

 Though I've heard such terrible things about lead, the mercury I played with as a kid, the asbestos I breathed in autobody and brake repair and all the hydrocarbon solvents I breathed and washed my hands in for years.  If I suddenly don't reply to any more posts you'll perhaps understand...

I hear you on this one.

[Jerry77 1,218]

10 hours ago, rmaynard said:

I hear you on this one.

Me too...the truth has been spoken..I should have died 30 years ago..

["D"- Man 827]

On 5/13/2016 at 10:25 PM, "D"- Man said:

I have used Lab Metal, if you are using it for the first time, I suggest that you learn on a practice piece first, until you are confident that you completely understand how to make it work for your application and purpose.  It helped me to call the manufacturer and ask for advice on how to use it, as the instructions are sort of incomplete.  If you do not plan on powder-coating or plating after, I would have a go at something else.

I just received the frame from my 18 automatic from the powder coater after using the lab metal to fill rust Pitts, and the results we're very pleasing.   The powder coater used 2 mil thickness on the paint powder 420 degrees for 20 minutes in the oven.  After getting it home I use some wax and it really give it a gorgeous shine.  The gloss black will really set It off nicely with the Regal red on the remainder of the tractor.

Edited January 20, 2017 by "D"- Man

[Jaymon74 84]

I've been using a product called Permatex Rust Treatment (I believe it was once called Extend) for years. Buy it anywhere body work products are sold. With it,  you get what rust you can, then apply a coat of this on top, let it dry, then top with filler. I experimented with it ten years ago. I divided a section of a truck bed into two parts. One I just knocked of the loose rust and paint, lightly sanded and wiped with Acetone, then applied a coat of Permatex Rust Treatment only, the next section sanded all the way to metal, wiped with Acetone, and applied just a coat of primer and painted. The place with the PRT still looks like it did right after applying it. The other spot has already chipped and scratched and now has rust spots. I use this product alot. I redid a mower deck using it and glazing putty. It turned out excellent and held up the whole time I owned it which was four years before selling it.

["D"- Man 827]

On 1/16/2017 at 11:57 AM, "D"- Man said:

I just received the frame from my 18 automatic from the powder coater after using the lab metal to fill rust Pitts, and the results we're very pleasing.   The powder coater used 2 mil thickness on the paint powder 420 degrees for 20 minutes in the oven.  After getting it home I use some wax and it really give it a gorgeous shine.  The gloss black will really set It off nicely with the Regal red on the remainder of the tractor.

I have pics of this frame prior to powder coating showing this pitted areas filled in with the Lab-Metal, in a thread entitled: 

 

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