Martin 2,132 #76 Posted December 11, 2013 Hopefully just get it running. It will get "restored" later for a 416 H I'm getting together for my next rebuild.... The engine would be a good rebuilder sofar, std bore with no ridge to speak of. We will see as we go forward if it's a runner or not...... Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Digger 66 3,485 #77 Posted December 12, 2013 (edited) im not sure. the lights were mostly peterson manufacturing from what I've found, but the reflectors on my 1848 are 'sate-lite' 24 (4 3/8 x 1 7/8) made in chicago. i might try searching a little. i was going to get another set of the more rounded lights i put on the c125, they are dual globe, whereas the square edged ones on the 416 are single. the 416 ones cleaned up real nice so i just put them back on. i couldn't see the point of replacing a perfectly good light because i wanted the more rounded ones. these are the c125 ones, another p.m. light, look really nice on that c1x1 style seat pan. that style pan doesn't have the wider holes that we are trying to cover up either...... A couple of these might look cool . I put one in place of the stock incandescent lamp on my & it looks much better . Edited December 12, 2013 by Digger 66 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
woodchuckfarmer 333 #78 Posted December 12, 2013 Good job, I like projects like this, it may run like a champ you never know...Wayne 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
n1defan 47 #79 Posted December 13, 2013 Wow, the buff job really brought that paint out Martin! I'm going to start on mine soon, and seeing your results really motivates me. Matt matt, ive been going back and forward about whether to pull this one apart and redo it or just clean it up as it sits. i thought by trying some cutting compound and polish on the seat pan that would help. the hood is my biggest problem area though, not sure if i can make that look good enough without a repaint. somebody in the past repainted part of it and looks terrible. if i can flatten the 'texture' of the repaint and blend it in, might try some wet sanding and see if i can get it looking good enough. IMG_2443.JPG i really would like to get away without rebuilding this one as its in great mechanical condition already, and it would be nice to keep it as a 560 hour oem original. Your 416 is now beginnning to look really good Martin. BTW, I want to say I DO like your shop/horse barn. Its full of Wheel Horses, just as it should be ! van, yes its getting more like i want it... the shop is getting a little crowded in there, all horses except for a cub 682 and jd 314. the cub and jd could become trading material for the right horses, but i enjoy them for what they are even if they arent the right brand and/or color........ heres the gang..... IMG_2442.JPG IMG_2444.JPG Looks good Martin. thanks denny, i really like this 400 series more and more, going to end up being a really nice do all tractor....... Is that one of my hitches on that shinny Red tractor? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #80 Posted December 13, 2013 it sure is tom. i got one last year when you and scott did a run of them. i love it........ take a look here..... http://www.wheelhorseforum.com/topic/41335-testing-out-scott-moreaus-2-hd-hitch Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #81 Posted December 14, 2013 (edited) alright, good news and bad news......... before the good and bad though, an update....... cleaned up the head gaskets and a spray with silver paint. new ones will come when its running. let them dry and installed the heads and torqued. filled the engine with diesel and let it soak into the sludge in the oil pan, drained it and filled a couple times. bolted the engine on the hydro tractor instead of the 8 speed it came off. will install all the parts on the engine sitting on the hydro tractor. dismantled the starter motor and cleaned it out. put some fresh grease in the outer bearings and freed up the gear. installed it on the engine and made sure that i had power and it spun over. right, now the good news..... since i had the starter good, i thought id install the flywheel and turn the engine over and see what sort of compression the engine had.... front cylinder.... first bump 50 second 75 third 100 fourth 110 rear cylinder......first bump 50 second 75 third 100 fourth 110. checked both twice, dry, no oil put in plug hole. so 110 on both cylinders is good for me, engine sounds good turning over, no unusual noises so far........ now the bad.... tested the ignition module and its bad, couldn't get it to drop voltage as i rotated the engine, constant battery voltage through the engine revolutions. i read a thread on here about how chuck (soi) used a test light to test the module. tried that and also used a magnet and passed it over the eye from both directions, flipping the magnet over to make sure n and s poles were passed over it. no change....... so more $$$$, ordered a new one from onanparts.com along with a new rotor and some carb kit gaskets and condenser. also ordered another 3 ohm harley dual fire coil from the same place i got the one for my 1st 416. at least i have spares for the 1st 416H if this engine doesn't work out.... the more i get into it though, the more it looks like the p.o. had a no fire issue and gave up on the engine. then it got picked for parts. the engine has less than 600 hours on it, the same as my 1st 416. so hopefully in a bit more time and money it will become the engine for my next build...... Edited December 14, 2013 by Martin 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vinylguy 4,674 #82 Posted December 14, 2013 Did you get some seat time on 416-H#1 today? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #83 Posted December 14, 2013 (edited) oooh yeah, about 3 hours worth. i think i ended up going over everything twice, and i did the side road and neighbors business car park and all the side walks and the other neighbors driveway and and and and........ video of #1 416H...... Edited December 14, 2013 by Martin 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
woodchuckfarmer 333 #85 Posted December 15, 2013 That's a good sounding machine. It handles that snow with no problem.....nice job and have a ball with it.....Wayne 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #86 Posted December 15, 2013 just came in from doing a little more. got the engine flushed one more time with the diesel. then i filled the oil pan with some 30 oil and ran the starter in short bursts until the oil came through the filter mounting (filter removed) . flushed the oil pickup/pump/oil galley up to the filter real good. i think i will change the oil out one more time, install a filter and then make sure i have oil pressure before running it..... 416-8 that donated the onan. lets call this one #3. most of this one will end up being used for a new build. actually a pretty nice tractor. 592 hours. 416H with the hydro i need and the onan mounted on the frame. this one is #2. i think this one had 900 hours on it.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #87 Posted December 19, 2013 little closer with the engine assembly. ignition all done, engine wiring hooked up. waiting for a carb, air cleaner and some other things in the mail and the intake and exhaust can go on. put a new gas line in and cleaned the tank. looking more complete..... made a bracket to mount the coil, made up some new plug wires etc. coil will sit level with and right next to air cleaner. similar to the last 416 conversion, just a slightly different position. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bowtiebutler956 650 #88 Posted December 19, 2013 As always, nice work Martin! You should have it running in no time, and hopefully the engine is sound, with no smoke or knocks. Matt 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dodgemike 52 #89 Posted December 20, 2013 Martin I really enjoyed reading Your step by step progess with Photos. Top notch work and great Looking tractor. Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #90 Posted December 22, 2013 (edited) yesterday and today sorted a whole bunch of electrical gremlins, all due to corrosion at terminals etc. everything works on it now. thought a clean up might be in order for the big day ahead once i have the rest of the engine goodies. just waiting on a carb, inlet manifold and muffler. some should be on their way, the muffler will need to be made or bought from somewhere. i have a miller welder p216 muffler to be used temporarily if i need to, just need to remove the hood as it wont clear it. broke out the da polisher and went to work on the paint, swapped some panels from the 416-8 and mixed and matched some pieces to use the better ones. tractor all naked waiting for some clothes. all the sheet metal is in good condition, but paint is bad, chalky and i wasn't real sure if it would come back..... and the results, looks better than it did, still needs help though. nice straight rust free parts, so they will be a good candidate for stripping and powder coat in the future..... need to find a nice left side hydro cover, for now the manual lift cover will do. this is just going to be a 'test mule' for the engine and hydro..... and maybe even this will find its way on there too. if you look real close in the pics you will see two hydro levers already on there. the column one is junk and won't work ok without a bunch of work, so i swapped in the lever from a c175 parts tractor i have. will be ok for testing. if i get the urge matts foot control may be installed and the others removed..... Edited December 22, 2013 by Martin Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bowtiebutler956 650 #91 Posted December 22, 2013 Well, you already have that Horse looking somewhat presentable Martin. I think those hydro foot controls are cool, and I think you should give it a try. This is your test mule, errr Horse right? Nice work Martin! Matt Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rick 235 #92 Posted December 22, 2013 Very nice work, makes me want to go out to the shop and get busy on my tractors... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
leeave96 487 #93 Posted December 23, 2013 (edited) Very nice work! If you can get the Onan going, that would be great. When tearing into the engine, did you have any trouble getting the tins off? That Onan has some HUGE cooling fins! BTW, you will love Matt's foot control kit. Good luck, Bill Edited December 23, 2013 by leeave96 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #94 Posted December 23, 2013 Bill, as far as the tins go, they came off easy. the bolts that go into the top of each head were previously broken off, so they needed to be fixed. theres only two other bolts that go into the head and they are on the side. just got to work at them slowly back and forth. pb blaster helps, as does some heat. the bolts that go through the tins only and are held by welded in nuts on the back of the tins needed some help from the blaster but they came loose. a little anti seize or lube helps avoid this problem in the future. the head bolts gave me fits as well, only broke one of those by getting a little impatient, but if you really take your time they can come out ok........ I'm getting used to the whole onan deal now. they are a great engine, but do need more tlc than the kohlers. they sound great when working hard, are a very smooth engine when tuned right, but parts are expensive. this latest one i have more $$$ in that the last 416, I'm hoping the engine will be a good runner, will soon know for sure. all the signs are there that its a good one so far, i think the previous owner had ignition problems from a bad trigger module and just gave up on it. the upper engine looks great, just hoping we don't have any low end bearing noise or whatever. before i buttoned up the valve covers i spin it over a few times to get the oil up in the top of the engine and seems the oil system is working correctly. valve adjustment was also done.... hopefully by the end of this week i will get it running.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #95 Posted December 24, 2013 (edited) more updates...... got a package from mike in ohio, (sorekiwi) today, THANKS MIKE!!!!!!! carb, intake, air cleaner, some heat shields for the exhaust and some parts of a junk muffler got the top off the carb and cleaned the bowl, blew out the idle passages and generally just did a quick job on it, mounted the carb and intake and completed the fuel lines and filter. i had the muffler from the miller welder so i through that on there to see if it would fit. hood won't close so i need to do something about that..... heres some pics..... carb is in great condition, thanks again mike! reused the old gasket, just a wipe of petroleum jelly to help soften it a little.... also here is a video i got my wife to do for me......... the muffler is noisy (just bolted it in without gaskets) and i only went through the carb really quick, the hi speed needs some more love..... but its a runner and the engine seems to be a good one. now i need to go through the carb properly, i have a kit for it so it will get pulled down. Edited December 24, 2013 by Martin 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bowtiebutler956 650 #96 Posted December 24, 2013 That engine sounds really healthy Martin! Once you get the carb dialed in to stop the surging, I bet she'll purr like a kitten. Matt 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #97 Posted December 26, 2013 more on the onan carb problems..... i took off the top again to have another look, removed the main jet and blew out behind it, every removable jet, orifice etc is clear. heard where the soft plug just above the mixture screw can cause surging symptoms too so looked at that, put some black rtv over the plug just to make sure its sealed ok. let that sit for a day or so. while waiting, i looked at the hydro. i wanted to change out the oil even though it didn't look too bad, plus it had an automotive fram oil filter on it, pf43 i think. anyway wrong filter from my point of view. so i changed out the filter, drained the oil. i thought i would try putting the oil in the trans before the filter this time and it went much better. no oil burping up at me. i put 4 quarts in, (not a complete fill according to the manual) to start with, installed the filter and turned the trans over by the engine to circulate oil through the filter. once i got it running i checked the level again, right at the f mark. I've learned to not put the 5 quarts it mentions in the hydro manual all in as most times the level ends up too much in my experience. so start at 4, can always add more later once you've got the oil through the trans by running it a little. anyway, back to the engine, installed the rest of the engine parts, found some used exhaust manifold gaskets to use temporarily, gave them a wipe with rtv and installed the miller welder muffler. this will be a temporary thing until i get ahold of an oem type setup. i will need to run the tractor with the hood removed if i want to drive it around though, as there is a clearance problem. i managed to get it running a little better, but I'm going to have to soak the carb to cure the hi speed surging. another thing i noticed while running it is if i hold my finger just to control the governor arm without over revving it, the surging will settle down and even stop after let it do its own thing for a while. once it starts to move just slightly, off it goes again surging. this can be repeated and it seems that just slowing down the reaction of the governor arm compensating helps to smooth out the surging. i think the spring is in the right holes, but i will look up and see in the manual. i think the carb is the main problem still though, sea foam is helping to run it smoother, but its just like the other onan in 416 #1, its going to need some more cleaning. i got away with not soaking the #1 carb, but i don't think this is going to be the case here. i can say that the tractor operates very nicely, hydro seems strong when hot and the engine runs beautiful except for the carb. its very quiet, no unusual noises and seems to have plenty of power. doesn't blow any smoke either, i think the minor staining of rusty water in the bores was only minor and once i cleaned it up with scotch brits, didn't seem to affect the cylinder compression or oil control in anyway. the bores were one of the biggest concerns going into this, as i could see where water had made its way in there. anyone thats dealt with water in a bore will tell you it doesn't take very long to cause irreparable damage. i think i got lucky. it looked like this tractor had spent some time outdoors and seeing that the intake and exhaust were off and ports were exposed for some time, its amazing there wasn't more damage....... right now I'm uploading some video of it running and driving, but heres some pics first....... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #98 Posted December 26, 2013 heres the first one, before i took it out for a run. i have some belt noise to sort out as well, the idler looks like its sticking a little and making the belt jump around....... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #99 Posted December 26, 2013 heres the next one, the phone went dead at 1 min 40 something so it gets cut off, but theres a 3rd video coming with more driving around...... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #100 Posted December 26, 2013 heres the 3rd one...... sorry about the fingers over the lens...... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
