Bearing and seal cross numbers

[stevasaurus 22,764]

This should be helpful to those who decide to rebuild their transmission, and in the case of "randhad" above (who discovered a mistake in one of the PDF's) can figure out what the # of the bearing is and then verify the PDF's are correct.  I'll try to make this simple, but it needs to be part of this thread.

 

By measuring inside diameter (ID) and the height of a bearing you are replacing, you can actually name the bearing yourself.  This is for KOYO and Torrington bearings and it works like this.

 

A through, needle bearing starts with a "B".  The rest of the numbers are the ID and the height in16ths of an inch.  So, if you have a bearing that has an ID of 3/4" and a height of 5/8" (the ID is listed 1st) you have a B-3/4" x 5/8"...3/4" = 12/16" and 5/8" = 10/16"......so the bearing is a B-1210.  A bearing B-1816 is a through, needle bearing with an ID of 1 & 1/8" and a height of 1"

 

The cap bearings work like this..."M" signals a cap bearing...the numbers work the same as with the through, needle bearings...with the exception of a "1" at the end.  I have no idea what the "1" stands for at the end.  So...a cap bearing that is ID 3/4" with a height of 1" is going to be  M-12161.  If anyone knows what the (1) on the end stands for...I am all ears. 

 

Hope this helps all to verify the bearings they pull out of their transmissions.  There are some transmissions out there (Wheel Horse) that are not listed in the PDF's...like the #5060 10 pinion, limited slip.  I think the brake shaft on that is 1" not 3/4"...by using the formula above, you will get the right bearing. 

Edited November 18, 2014 by stevasaurus

[ranger 1,750]

Hi from over the "pond",

 

    Regarding the "1533" bearing size i found a metric bearing 6908 or 61908 size 40mm x 62mm x 12mm which, it would appear would only require

   a couple of thin sleeves & a shim for axial positioning, and no case or diff machining. I wonder if anyone has tried these & would they be strong enough?

   If they turned out OK then I'm sure some enterprising person could produce kits for those in need :)

 

         Doug.

[pacer 3,173]

Use caution on choosing the 11124 seals for the 1 1/8" axles! There are at least 2 with that same number - one will fit and the other wont. The outside diameter is different, with one being 1 9/16" which is too small - the one we need is 1 5/8". And I think I saw another size with something like 2 1/2" OD.  The main thing is to be sure and check the dimensions of the one you are looking at! I like to put the number in ebays search and get the many, many different prices offered on items - like with these seals they can range from 3-4$ up to crazy prices like 25-30$ and free ship or crazy ship costs. but many times the seller wont show the dims of the seal. (I got caught here and ordered up 2 of the 1 9/6" size because they were only about $4, they were shown to fit a Harley ) And remember, these seals show the exact same number designation...

 

Another factor in the 1 1/8 seals is there is there is yet another size with an 11050 number, this one being 1 1/8 X 1 3/8"  Would be wise to pull your hub and eyeball the seal and see if its the 1 5/8 or the smaller 1 3/8. I just got trapped here - not pulling the hub and ordering up the 11124 seal and on pulling the hub saw it was for the smaller one

 

The top one is the 1 9/16" OD 11124 seal that wont fit anything ...

The 1 3/8" 11050 seal is on the bottom left, and on the right is the 1 5/8" OD 11124 that is the right one - the differences are pretty apparent.

 

 

[pfrederi 17,741]

What brand was the upper one.  The lower right is SKF which is what I usually use.

 

Consider ordering seals from a bearing supply place.  I use EB Atmus prices are good and they give all the dimensions with the seal in the listing.

[pacer 3,173]

The upper seal is "KOK" ??? whatever that is... prob not U.S.

 

My nearest bearing supply is a 40+ mile trip and often they will have to order whatever, which means another trip and the prices arent the best and of course there are taxes... I just spend a few minutes prowling ebay and can usually find NOS items at greatly reduced prices and often get free shipping. Then its delivered right to my door a few days later. Anymore I buy a large amount of my household and shop needs off the web.

[pfrederi 17,741]

Understand the travel issue. I used to a 'local' place 35 miles one way and had the same issues.   Places like EB Atmus take the order online and the items are shipped directly from SKF or Timken.

[pfrederi 17,741]

KOK is a Taiwanese firm seems to have a good reputation, been around since the 60s.  Not sure why the seal was wrong size...

[gwest_ca-(File Mod) 11,046]

According to the SKF list 3 different companies use the 11124 part number that result is 3 different seals.

 

CRINDUSTRIES

HARLEY-DAVIDSON

SKF & Napa

 

Garry

[Brad GREENWALD 13]

where do i get a gasket for the 5025
 

[rmaynard 15,514]

Part #3912, available from Toro for about $4.00.

[Achto 27,604]

Great job! Thanks Steve

[coreyss 0]

In the beginning of rebuilding a 1972 5085 transmission. But unsure wich pdf parts list to use. I assume #2?

[gwest_ca-(File Mod) 11,046]

Here is an original parts list

It is likely #2 but I did not compare the original Wheel Horse parts numbers to those in the list. 

If you come across one that is not in the list let us know and we can get it updated.

 

Garry

[Fun Engineer 859]

Bearing seal help needed.  I was going through my stock of new bearings and seals and can't identify what this seal is for.  Can anyone offer a suggestion or tell me how to figure it out? I believe it may be for a 1 1/8 axle but I don't know why I would have three of these as I don't have any 1 1/8 axles.  Here it is. National #340835

 

Any help would be appreciated.

Dave

[stevasaurus 22,764]

Dave, that National #340835 seal is the same as SKF #11050 and the same as Wheel Horse #1213 and TORO #100443.  They are for the 1 1/8" axles in the manual transmissions...not the hydros.  I went to Motion Industries.com and checked the measurements of the seal and then used my charts to find out. 

[Fun Engineer 859]

Thanks all knowing Dino. 

I was going to pm you but thought you'd be on the lake

 

Now why did I order these?

Just realized my C-81 takes that seal. Thought they were 1". Thanks again. 

 

You bringing the Mrs this year?

 

edited by Steve

from Steve...yes, I am bringing her. 

[slim67 2,735]

On 11/30/2012 at 9:32 AM, stevasaurus said:

Here are 3 PDFs.  I have included Motion Industries catalog numbers and the size of the bearings in each attachment.  If you click on this link, it will bring up Motion Industries web site...type in their catalog number for the bearing or seal that you are looking for.  It will give dimensions, a picture and an approximate price.  You can also order online.  Most of these bearings are also available from your TORO dealer and NAPA.  Hope this helps...

 

https://www.motionindustries.com/motion3/jsp/mii/productCatalogSearch.jsp

 

The 1st PDF is the WH # 5003 and 5010 RJ and 3 piece suburban transmissions.

 

The 2nd PDF is the 3 and 4 speeds...WH # 5007, 5025, 5046, 5048, 5049, and 5053 transmissions.

 

The 3rd PDF is the 6 and 8 speeds...WH # 5086, 5073, 5091, 103907, 103916, and 103918 transmissions.

 

1. UNI DRIVE TRANS 1.pdf

2. UNI DRIVE TRANS 2.pdf

3. UNI DRIVE TRANS 3.pdf

Thanks for posting this information Steve. It has been very helpful and has saved a lot of scouring the internet. 

[Cole J. 71]

Hello all,

As searching throgh the forum and seeing all the post and helpfull info that stevasaurus and slim 67posted I see no info on the inner bearing for the drive axel on a 72 WH charger 10 which is a hydo stat. I made the trip to motion industes in a near by town and they ran the WH part number 1533. He told me he could not get that exact bearing but he could get one with the correct id of the shaft and the correct od of the bearing to fit the case. The only difference was the thicknes of the bearing, the one I need is .5 inches the one he had being thicker. Will the thicker bearing work, if not to thick to interfear with any moving parts.

Thanks in advancefor any info you can give.

 

[pfrederi 17,741]

1533 is NLA from Toro. One of our vendors here has had them made up  look one posting down in this section

 

 

 

 

http://www.wheelhorseforum.com/topic/63745-1533-bearings-no-problem/

[ohiofarmer 3,276]

  Finding an oil seal by size.

 

 After much searching on this site for Sunstrand axle oil seals for one inch and 1-1/8 seals [because I was told the auto trans axle seals are different], I finally found a place where it was simple and easy to enter the measured size and get results.http://simplybearings.co.uk/shop/advanced_search_result.php?search_in_description=0&keywords=0.75x1.312x0.25.

 

When I measured my pulled shaft seals, they were distorted and even though the size was a little off, the wonderful British site asked me to correct it. The site brought up SKF oil seals and once I had that number, i went to NAPA online and used their cross check. The input shaft for both  is the same CR 7475 in the SKF and NOS 7475 in NAPA. the one inch axle seal is CR 9863 / NOS 9863 and the inch and a quarter axle seal is CR11124 / NOS 11124

 

 These are for an Electro 12 and a 1075 Wheel horse. so if anyone wishes to check my work, that would be fine.  I just about was at my wits end, but was determined to find this stuff on my own. The site above really helped. If you experts wish to check my work, that would be very nice.

[gwest_ca-(File Mod) 11,046]

Found this

CR9878 is correct replacement  for WH 5958 (newer Toro # 100607)  Your 9863 may work it is very close.

 

The 11124 is correct but the ID is 1-1/8".

 

CR part numbers are very close to the nominal shaft size.

9878 or .98 is close to 1"

11124 or 1.11 is close to 1.125" or 1-1/8"

They can't be exact because they have so many different styles and materials used so the last digits identify them.

 

Garry

[ohiofarmer 3,276]

On 2/21/2017 at 6:44 AM, gwest_ca said:

Found this

CR9878 is correct replacement  for WH 5958 (newer Toro # 100607)  Your 9863 may work it is very close.

 

The 11124 is correct but the ID is 1-1/8".

 

CR part numbers are very close to the nominal shaft size.

9878 or .98 is close to 1"

11124 or 1.11 is close to 1.125" or 1-1/8"

They can't be exact because they have so many different styles and materials used so the last digits identify them.

 

Garry

 Well, i got the seals in and they do work. I still do not know exactly how you look all that stuff up, but I was trying to stubbornly do it myself. I guess the next time, i will try it and ask for confirmation before I order the seals. The axle seals were reasonably priced, but the pump seals were 20 bucks each. i had seventy bucks in two tractors with SKS double lip seals from NAPA I am thinking the little 1075 might just be perfect with a 6.5 HP Predator i have lying around and then fasten rails to the frame for a front mounted sprayer.

 I had a bit of 1/8th plastic tubing and put a string through it and tied a small rag to the string. A very easy way to insert the rag into the gear case filler tube and check for grundge in the gear case before filling it with fluid

[pfrederi 17,741]

11 hours ago, ohiofarmer said:

 Well, i got the seals in and they do work. I still do not know exactly how you look all that stuff up, but I was trying to stubbornly do it myself. I guess the next time, i will try it and ask for confirmation before I order the seals. The axle seals were reasonably priced, but the pump seals were 20 bucks each. i had seventy bucks in two tractors with SKS double lip seals from NAPA I am thinking the little 1075 might just be perfect with a 6.5 HP Predator i have lying around and then fasten rails to the frame for a front mounted sprayer.

 I had a bit of 1/8th plastic tubing and put a string through it and tied a small rag to the string. A very easy way to insert the rag into the gear case filler tube and check for grundge in the gear case before filling it with fluid

  If you are buying multiple seals you should look around for a better place price wise.

 

I order from EB Atmus  Cr7475 is $10.80,  CR 9863 is $5.07  CR11124 is $3.13   Shipping on my last order was $6.80

[Dakota8338 115]

Most excellent & helpful information everyone.

[dennisf 0]

just what i needed thanks!!