C-175 Repower (my first post)

[Watch3612 5]

Hello Red Square! Along with my first post here, this is my first wheel horse, garden tractor restoration and beer-for-tractor trade.

I'll stick to the important details: C-175 - KT17 Series I with a broken rod (no holes in the block) along with a really nice 46" deck, plow blade, tire chains and wheel weights for a case of beer and future horseback riding lesson for his son (my wife teaches riding lessons). The motor has serious blow by on the other cylinder, and my fathers yard is hilly, so a rebuild is not a great option.

My goals are:

1. Repower and use the original manual PTO;

2. Clean up the body panels and repaint the hood, but not a full restoration;

3. Rewire with safety switches in place (harness was hacked);

On to my engine questions:

1. After doing a lot of reading, I'm leaning towards repowering with a Kohler K341 for swap simplicity and longevity, but was looking for feedback if this was the best option? I want to keep it simple as my local parts availability is limited.

2. I am most concerned about the K341 taking the original PTO (diameter and length) and clearances to body panels. I can always offset the motor and change the belt length, but would prefer to keep as much original as possible. Can anyone supply the Kohler K341 Engine Spec(s) that would work or a resource where I can find them myself?

3. Any other advice is appreciated.

Looking forward to this winter project! Thanks for your help.

[Watch3612 5]

Thats interesting because it shows up just how it should on my iPad.

[rmaynard 15,425]

I've seen this phenomena before. Here it is without the suction cups.

 

[SousaKerry 501]

First off

  you came to the right place.

 

Speaking of someone who has done this swap in reverse (my C-125 is now a C-175) I would try to find a series II kt-17 since you have all the parts already.  Basically the PTO will fit but, you will have to change the shaker plate that the motor sits on, the belt guard, the PTO hoop, and the PTO bracket that bolts to the block. 

 

All that is counting on you finding a K341-AS that came off a tractor with the shaker plate setup.  If not then you will have to drill some holes in the frame and solid mount the motor as was done on the earlier and later tractors.  And you will still need all the parts mentioned above.

 

My donor KT-17 series II came from a cub cadet that a guy was parting out and it drove off the flywheel end,  I removed the hardware from the flywheel and changed the plastic screen out for a steel one I had laying around from a K-301.  I did quite a but of searching and trial and error to come up with all the necessary parts to do the swap but this was before I found

[Watch3612 5]

If I could find a Series II that would be great, but I've read (and found out) the Wheel Horse specs are tough to find due to the different crank size.

This is the list of KT17 Wheel horse specs i found:

If anyone has a list of non-wheel horse KT17 specs that would fit or even better a KT17 Series II in CT, I'd be appreciative.

[pfrederi 17,645]

Don't obsess on crank size the 1" cranks can be used you just need th bushing from a C-81 that made 1 inc 1-1/8 inch.  They are available on ebay often.  I have one c175 repowered with a series one KT 17 from a JD 317 (had to convert to a electric PTO as JD was too cheap to spec ball bearings on the crank.  My other one is a Series 2 short block but using left over parts from my first conversion for carb and intake/exhaust.

[boovuc 1,090]

Loved that anti-gravity garage!

As a person who's first tractor was and still is the same C-175, you have options but the best option is a KT17 Series II as was pointed out. One of our members here from Virginia has one for sale. (We just couldn't hook up and I think he still may have it or it would be on my machine).

They can be found with patience. Another suggestion is an Onan replacement. P216, P218 and P220 Onans for Wheelhorse are plentiful and powerful. Would it look like a stock C-175. Nope! But it could bridge the gap between finding your KT17.

 

The blackhood verses the newer hood design are very close to being the same. Just a thought and another option to consider.

[Watch3612 5]

The wheel horse population in CT is sparse relative to Deere and Cub Cadet, so patience is key. I'm trying to stick with Kohler, but I appreciate the Onan suggestion. Always appreciate the tip on available parts as well.

[546cowboy 301]

 

 

Actually I have done two of those conversions to a K-341 in a C-175. You would have to have the shaker plate for a K-341 because the plate for the K-17 does not have the hole in it for the sump in the 341 pan. Of course you could cut a hole in the shaker plate you have but I don't know if the mounting hole for the engine will line up.

 

Another thing you have to do is move the shaker plate mounting blocks ( there is another set of holes already in the frame ) or the engine will be too far forward as I recall. Everything will line up then on the PTO.

 

You would also have to change the choke and throttle cables because they are too short to reach the front of the K-341.

 

It makes a fine tractor though when you are done. The K-341 has plenty of power. Here is a picture of the last one I did.

Edited August 29, 2013 by 546cowboy

[Watch3612 5]

That's great information and a nice looking tractor. I'm going to keep my eyes open for a wheel horse k341. What model did your K341 come from?

[546cowboy 301]

I just couldn't tell what that engine came out of but if you are looking at a K-341 on-line and it says it is a K-341A or AS then it has the pan that has a bump-out. Like I said though I was lucky to have that shaker plate I needed. Another reason that not much gets thrown away around here. HA!

[Wheel-N-It 2,968]

You've got a nice JD 345 to cut grass with, so with that being said here goes;

Just my 2cents but if I were you (knowing what I know now) I would be patient and buy a series 2 engine (even if it needs to be rebuilt) and install it in your chassis. There is enough other stuff to do with your C-175 to keep you plenty busy while you look for a series 2 engine. The series 2 engine makes good power, and I would not want to stray away from that if at all possible.

Nothing against the K-341 ( I have 2 ) but the KT-17 series 2 is a great engine.

[Watch3612 5]

I figured on a Wheel Horse board the 345 would go unmentioned.... It's an outstanding garden tractor (water cooled Kawasaki)with 375ish hours on it that i bought from the original owner for what I would consider a really good deal.

The wheel horse is going to my old man once I clean it up and we repower, hopefully with a series 2. Like you said, plenty to do beyond the repower. It's a winter project, but I don't want to be power washing in sub freezing temperatures, so I'm looking to get all the cleaning done this fall.

[Dieselcowboy 210]

I had a C175 with an Onan on it. It was 18hp. Direct replacement engine. Sounded good too.

[Watch3612 5]

Possibly found a Kt17 but it's another Series I. If its running, and in another C-175 (worse shape), what would be a reasonable price for this setup with no attachments?

Also, Since my last post:

I bought an all original C-161 with briggs twin, plow and mower deck. Runs great, minimal use, and

Have seen my wife grow very concerned about the number of tractors being brought home.

[AMC RULES 37,127]

[Sparky-(Admin) 21,300]

Possibly found a Kt17 but it's another Series I. If its running, and in another C-175 (worse shape), what would be a reasonable price for this setup with no attachments?

Also, Since my last post:

I bought an all original C-161 with briggs twin, plow and mower deck. Runs great, minimal use, and

Have seen my wife grow very concerned about the number of tractors being brought home.

You mentioned that your fathers yard is hilly....not a good enviroment for the series 1. Post a wanted ad in the classifieds here, theres plenty of WH guys in Ct. Someones gotta have something that'll go in without to many modifications.

Mike......

[953 nut 55,044]

I figured on a Wheel Horse board the 345 would go unmentioned.... It's an outstanding garden tractor (water cooled Kawasaki)with 375ish hours on it that i bought from the original owner for what I would consider a really good deal.

The wheel horse is going to my old man once I clean it up and we repower, hopefully with a series 2. Like you said, plenty to do beyond the repower. It's a winter project, but I don't want to be power washing in sub freezing temperatures, so I'm looking to get all the cleaning done this fall.

 

   If your "old man" isn't interested I will adopt you and you can give it to me!   

 

[Watch3612 5]

Mike - Good catch on the hills, if I got a series 1 I would give him the C-161 (it also has a mower and plow) and I'd keep or sell the C-175. I'd most likely sell because my biggest thrill with these great machines is learning how they work, getting them functioning how they should and keeping them from the scrapper. Any money i make only goes to fund the next one, but it's definitely not my motivation.

With regards to an adoption... That's a first!

[Watch3612 5]

Quick update on the KT-17: I've been busy disassembling the rest of the C-175, and like most I'm stuck at the hubs and steering wheel, so into the motor we went. With zero compression, I had no hope; however, upon pulling the head and turning the flywheel, the cylinders operated normal. After closer inspection, the intake valve was wedged open by a bolt from the air cleaner assembly which had backed itself out and fallen in.

Moral of the story, the KT-17 may be alive and well...

[SousaKerry 501]

Sweet nothing like finding a simple fix to a major problem.

[Watch3612 5]

Good news like this always seems to reinvigorate my interest in projects... But those hubs and steering wheel are feisty.

[AMC RULES 37,127]

Hopefully it'll be an easy fix, and that series one is back in action.  

[JackC 617]

Quick update on the KT-17: I've been busy disassembling the rest of the C-175, and like most I'm stuck at the hubs and steering wheel, so into the motor we went. With zero compression, I had no hope; however, upon pulling the head and turning the flywheel, the cylinders operated normal. After closer inspection, the intake valve was wedged open by a bolt from the air cleaner assembly which had backed itself out and fallen in.

Moral of the story, the KT-17 may be alive and well...

I had the exact same experience with a C-175 that I purchased. Runs beautifully now.  

 

Also, if you ever re-power, the KT17 II would be an excellent choice.  I recently purchased a 417A with a little over 550 hours on it for $250.  The tractor was left outside uncovered and had some rust issues. The PO said there was no spark and a shop told him the flywheel probably needed to be removed to replace the stator. After cleaning the carburetor and fixing the wire to the condenser, it starts and runs beautifully.  It also came with a nice 48 inch deck.  Keep your eye out for those kind of deals.

Edited January 21, 2014 by JackC

[Fordiesel69 259]

run it on flat yards only and it will run forever.  On hills of any kind, you will have portholes in the block.