8 spd axle seal leaking

[John Voss 76]

I have a 73 12hp 8 speed that has developed a slow leak out of the left rear axle seal. Does anyone have a guide to replacing these and a part number for the seal?

Thanks!

[leeave96 487]

I'm sure there are better instructions (and someone please correct me), but with my 520H, I pulled the rear tire, hub, took a sheet metal screw and screwed it into the seal in a couple of places, gave the seal a pull via the screw (some use a slide hammer) and it came right out. Installing the seal, I made sure there were no burrs on the axle shaft from the hub mount, greased the axle, put the seal on and I think I drove it in with a piece of white CPVC pipe. It was a fairly easy fix IMHO. I think some of the later tractors used two seals (again correct me if I'm wrong) back to back to provide better sealing long term.

Good luck,

Bill

[Dresden Guy 24]

I also have a leaking axle seal, on a 1976 C-160, and I am thinking that the step of "removing the hub from the axle" won't be so easy, being 10-15 years older and rustier! I am all ears on this procedure, but am fearing the proverbial "frozen" hub on the axle.

[stevasaurus 22,872]

John, you should have Wheel Horse transmission #5073. Dresden Guy, your trans #5091. Not sure which axle diameters you guys have, but if the axles are...

1" dia use seal skf 9815

1 1/8" dia use seal skf 11050

[rmaynard 15,610]

Removing the hub is the most difficult part of the entire job. However, in many cases, if the seal has been leaking for some time, the transmission lube may have worked it's way between the hub and the axle, and it will come off easily. If not...

Here are some links to threads concerning the removal of frozen hubs.

Read through both before attempting a hub removal.

Most importantly, do not bang on the hub with a hammer. It is cast, and it will break easily. If it doesn't break or move, you will pop the c-clip off inside the transmission, necessitating the opening of the transmission.

Once the hub is off, removing and installing a new seal is pretty simple.

[John Voss 76]

So I finally got around to doing this job. Removing the hub was very easy as it seems oil had seeped onto the axle. But when i went to dig out the old seal it didnt seem like there was really much of a seal to remove. I dig bits and pieces of what seemed to be a seal out and eventually was just hitting metal with my pick which i assume was the needle bearing for the axle. I then installed the new seal and tapped it into place. It didnt leak at first when just sitting still the first couple nights, but then i used it a few days later and after that it is leaking again. Any ideas?

[stevasaurus 22,872]

Two things come to mind...a bad bearing can cause up and down motion with the axle...check this by removing the hub and seeing if you have any up and down or side to side movement of the axle...you should have very little to none.  The second is, you either got a defective seal...or it was damaged while installing.  A burr on the end on the axle, or on the key way can put a tear in the rubber of the seal.  The seal should be flush with the end of the axle housing.  File the end of the axle and the top of the key way...use a piece of tape over both and slide the seal on over the tape.

Edited November 13, 2013 by stevasaurus

[John Voss 76]

I checked the axle movement and it was very little, i did tape the keyway and axle end before putting the new on on. 

[stevasaurus 22,872]

I think I would try a new seal and try to pack some bearing grease in the end before installation.  After that, you may be splitting the trans to find out what is going on.  A worn axle...a small crack in the trans housing...clean the whole trans really well to determine that the oil is actually leaking from the seal and not running from somewhere else before it drips.

 

BTW...do you know what weight of oil is in the trans??

Edited November 13, 2013 by stevasaurus

[John Voss 76]

I will give it a shot, thanks!

[rmaynard 15,610]

Two things you said concern me, First, the statement that you removed very little seal material. If there was that little of a seal remaining, you would have been getting more than a slow seepage.

 

Secondly, you said "I checked the axle movement and it was very little".

 

When you say "very little", there should be virtually no movement, up or down, front to back. You can have about 1/8" movement in and out. Any other movement indicates a bad bearing, or a worn axle.

 

Having said that, always make sure that the recessed area where the seal is to be installed is clean and free from debris. Make sure that all of the old seal (rubber and metal) is removed. When installing the new seal, be sure that it is pressed in squarely. One way to do that is to start it into the recess, then slide the hub onto the axle and drive it in with that. That should assure a nice even, square insertion.

[rmaynard 15,610]

Another thought, I just disassembled a transmission where the previous owner had installed one of the seals backward.

[John Voss 76]

Will the old seal have metal in it? When i was removing the old seal i picked out very little rubber material before running into metal. I assumed this was the bearing. Is it possible that i do not have the old seal fully removed? 

[rmaynard 15,610]

Old Wheel Horse seals were metal and rubber. Newer Toro seals are rubber and plastic. Aftermarket seals are mainly stainless steel housings with rubber (neoprene) seal, and some have a stainless steel spring in the back of the housing.

[John Voss 76]

I am guessing i still have some of the original metal seal behind the new seal i put in. I think i need to dig it out then re try with a new seal. any tips on removing the old seal? I was using a pick and various other tools to pull on the old seal but was only able to scrape the rubber away.

[stevasaurus 22,872]

I think that seal is only about 1/8" thick...should be the same size as the one you just put in.  It should come out without much effort...do not mess up the rim of the bearing.  I know there is not much room to see what you are doing.  Did you get the new seal in flush with the axle housing???

[John Voss 76]

I believe the new seal is flush with the axle housing I will have to check when i get home. What concerns me is the lack of the old seal i pulled out. There just wasn't much there and as mentioned above if there wasn't that much seal left it should have been leaking at a faster rate. 

[Duff 206]

I'm with Bob on this one - you've still got some of the old seal in there. There should have been some metal come out along with the rubber when you pulled the old seal. I'll bet if you pick around in there some more you'll eventually loosen up the metal and once that's out your new seal should do the job. You said you filed and taped the axle, which was good. If you don't have any lateral bearing play, I think you'll have your problem solved once the original seal is completely out of the way.

 

 

Good luck!

~Duff  

[redrooster 83]

After removing my wheels i noticed my seals were leaking.What is the best way to remove the axle seal? I didn't really see this specifically discussed.

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[rmaynard 15,610]

This subject has been discussed ad nauseum here on the forum, and is even discussed within this thread, but it never hurts to discuss it again. The hubs must be removed first. That will be the most difficult part of the whole job in many cases, but let's assume that because you have leaky seals, the hubs come off easily.

 

Take a small screw driver or punch and penetrate the outside of the seal. I use a dental pick to then hook the seal and pull it out. Before I got a set of picks, I bent the end of a 1/8" straight blade screw driver into a hook to pull with. The seal should come out pretty easily. Once out, clean the recess where the new one goes, clean the rust and dirt from the axle, make sure there are no burrs on the keyway (cover it with electrical tape), lubricate the axle with a thin coat of oil or grease and slide the new seal on. Tap it into place squarely, flush with the surface. 

 

That's the short and simple version of the procedure.

[redrooster 83]

Thanks for the info. This is all new for me. I've had my "75" C 141 since 1988. I'm ready to see it stand tall again!

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[rmaynard 15,610]

FYI, the C-141 was produced in 1978 and 1979, so it's newer than you think.

[Lagersolut 680]

Here's what I use to remove most seals - all the  times the wife wanted something painted,  I ended up with 1/2 dozen of these in the screwdriver drawer , they work great - better than opening the paint can .

 

 

Edited December 6, 2013 by Golds-Red

[redrooster 83]

I feel confident about a seal change now. Thanks!

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[redrooster 83]

This is all I could remove if the axle seal. The new seal I got measures 15/8". No way will that go back. I'm guessing I have the wrong seal and maybe not getting all of the old one out????

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