Martin 2,132 #1 Posted February 6, 2013 one thing i was concerned about when i first got the c160 was the wiring harness. at one time or another the wiring (starting circuit- im sure) got really hot and melted some wiring insulation and obviously took out some wiring. the previous owner had wired in a push switch to turn over the kohler. well i have wanted to rewire the whole tractor and tonight removed the harness to use as a pattern. wiring on these tractors isnt new to me, having remade harnesses for both the 1054 and 1057 when the tractors were rebuilt. the c160 uses gm 'packard' style connectors (terminals in plastic plugs) instead of the older style connectors found on the 50s and 60s wh tractors. so i need to source the terminals from somewhere and also get myself a good crimping tool designed for these terminals. upon inspection the ignition switch plug has endured some heat, and although its still holding the terminals just fine, i will probably swap this out too, along with new wiring. the lighting circuit looks fine from a quick inspection, so i will just be replacing the main harness..... heres some pics so far documenting my progress. first of all i needed to remove the harness. of course the first step would be to disconnect the battery, then i repositioned the gas tank to get to the ignition and wiring etc to disconnect behind the dash. then the coil +, starter solenoid connections, seat safety switch, ammeter, rectifier, and removed the harness from the tractor. the previous owner installed switch needed to be removed as well... the 'extra' wiring for turning over the starter..... in order to just get the harness off the tractor the bat+ wire that hooks to the rectifier plug needs to be removed as well. its the one wire that is closest to my thumb in the pic. its sort of the odd one out, is the way i look at it, the two wires on the right of the plug go to the stator on the engine. the two single plugs further to the right connect to the ammeter. to remove these type connections i use a wiring terminal tool. this works on most of the gm type terminals, and probably others too. the round ones are used for the newer weatherpak type connectors, but for what we want to do the thin flat type tool is needed. just push the tool into the socket on the side of the terminal that looks to have a small space for a tool such as this. there is a tang on the terminal that will release as the tool pushes pass it. then you just need to gently pull on the wire to remove it from the plug.... the seat switch wiring passes through this area so this needs to be fed out towards the engine after disconnecting the switch under the seat.... now we remove the wiring carefully, the harness right where it got hot was very brittle so in order to use it as a pattern, i needed to be careful and not break it fishing it out from under the hood stand. heres what damage we are dealing with. i think the ignition switch is ok but just to be on the safe side, in going to test it before replacing the wiring. i dont really want to deal with unnecessary trouble shooting when the new harness is installed. now i need to go and shop around for some terminals and a decent crimping tool, i have plenty of wiring laying around, but may purchase some of the nice marine wire that is talked about on the forum every now and again. if any of you electrical gurus out there have good suppliers for the terminals and wiring etc, i would appreciate some leads to cut down on some of my searching.... once i have all my supplies we will get into making up a harness using the original one as a pattern...... i think this wiring diagram represents my harness, looks like the previous owner but the push button switch in the red wire that runs from the pto interlock to the starter solenoid 'trigger' using the terminals that would connect to that safety switch. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wishin4a416 2,191 #2 Posted February 6, 2013 My 77 C-160 didnt have a seat safety switch. Just the PTO safety. Should it have one Martin? I am new to the c-series. Picked one up to redo. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
whc160 74 #3 Posted February 6, 2013 Hey Martin try this place. http://terminalsupplyco.com/default.aspx I get supplies from them for the shop I work at. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rock farmer 41 #4 Posted February 6, 2013 Martin, Are you going to make a breadboard (a sheet of plywood with nails for pins) or just match the new runs up with the old ones? Joe Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
posifour11 723 #5 Posted February 6, 2013 I have to do this too. Eagerly awaiting the outcome. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Save Old Iron 1,566 #6 Posted February 6, 2013 Martin, terminals are Packard 56 style which I buy off Ebay in 50 and 100 qty's. The connector shells are easily obtainable thru online small engine parts websites. Try to stay with MARINE GRADE wires as they are tinned and typically have better insulation thickness and composition. Heat shrink is a dime a dozen available from hundreds of sources. If you can get a 3:1 shrink ratio, it will be a better fit than the 2:1 shrink ratios. Some shrink tubing is internally coated with a heat melt adhesive. This adhesive lined shrink will provide a longer term shield against mother nature seeping into the connections. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Save Old Iron 1,566 #7 Posted February 6, 2013 good source for expandable nylon wire loom and accessories http://www.ebay.com/sch/furryletters/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=25&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2654 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #8 Posted February 6, 2013 (edited) My 77 C-160 didnt have a seat safety switch. Just the PTO safety. Should it have one Martin? I am new to the c-series. Picked one up to redo. not sure on what models had what, maybe somebody familiar with the different models will chime in on this..... Hey Martin try this place. http://terminalsuppl...om/default.aspx I get supplies from them for the shop I work at. thanks for the link, i am checking them out..... Martin, Are you going to make a breadboard (a sheet of plywood with nails for pins) or just match the new runs up with the old ones? Joe ive use that method in the past, but most of the time, i just dismantle the harness and cut each color wire slightly longer, then temporarily tape it in a few spots, install it and check length, etc before making connections/final length. sometimes a slightly different route works better and installs neater, although maybe not in exactly the right place as original. we will see how it works out..... Martin, terminals are Packard 56 style which I buy off Ebay in 50 and 100 qty's. The connector shells are easily obtainable thru online small engine parts websites. Try to stay with MARINE GRADE wires as they are tinned and typically have better insulation thickness and composition. Heat shrink is a dime a dozen available from hundreds of sources. If you can get a 3:1 shrink ratio, it will be a better fit than the 2:1 shrink ratios. Some shrink tubing is internally coated with a heat melt adhesive. This adhesive lined shrink will provide a longer term shield against mother nature seeping into the connections. good source for expandable nylon wire loom and accessories http://www.ebay.com/...984.m1439.l2654 chuck, do you have a source for the wire and terminals? i think i remember you posting on here in the past, a vendor that sold marine wire in assorted colors, small lengths etc........ Edited February 6, 2013 by Martin Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TT-(Moderator) 1,145 #9 Posted February 6, 2013 Should be this one: http://stores.ebay.com/Gregs-Marine-Wire-Supply?_rdc=1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #10 Posted February 6, 2013 Should be this one: http://stores.ebay.c...e-Supply?_rdc=1 thanks for the link tt. i will look into it more. my memory is crap, but i thought there was one supplier that would do say 100 ft total in different colors at say 4 colors/25 ft each or 10 colors/10 ft each or something along those lines. i go crazy searching for things i 'thought' i seen somewhere on here at times and didnt 'bookmark' it or copy the info...... must be old age or something like that..... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trouty56 567 #11 Posted February 6, 2013 (edited) Martin...NAPA sell the plug for the switch and the connector ends for it (with the tabs you mentioned). At least they did when I bought my switch some time ago..... switch connector part# 7-016034 terminals part# 7-016036 Maybe they still have them....... I had the wrong number for the connector....sorry Edited February 6, 2013 by Trouty56 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trouty56 567 #12 Posted February 6, 2013 In regards to a seat switch......I have a 75 and it had a thin wide switch of some sort under the seat cushion...... It was wired for a switch but was bypassed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TT-(Moderator) 1,145 #13 Posted February 6, 2013 On 2/6/2013 at 5:04 AM, Martin said: i thought there was one supplier that would do say 100 ft total in different colors at say 4 colors/25 ft each or 10 colors/10 ft each or something along those lines. i go crazy searching for things i 'thought' i seen somewhere on here at times and didnt 'bookmark' it or copy the info...... must be old age or something like that..... I saved that seller as soon as Chuck pointed him out in this post: http://www.wheelhorseforum.com/topic/19680-raider-10-starter-circuit-question-a-couple-more/ Gotta be the one. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #14 Posted February 6, 2013 Thanks everyone! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Save Old Iron 1,566 #15 Posted February 6, 2013 i thought there was one supplier that would do say 100 ft total in different colors at say 4 colors/25 ft each or 10 colors/10 ft each or something along those lines. i go crazy searching for things i 'thought' i seen somewhere on here at times and didnt 'bookmark' it or copy the info...... must be old age or something like that..... I saved that seller as soon as Chuck pointed him out in this post: Gotta be the one. That is the one - quality of the wire is top shelf - however I don't see the advert for buying 100 feet in any color / qty combo anymore. I see the same wire in 100 foot spools for the same price but not the choice of "adding it all up to 100 feet" in multiple colors. It was great to be able to buy 5 feet of pink and 50 feet of black and red with 25 feet of brown and orange, etc, Maybe an email to the seller will confirm if he still has the ability (or desire) to split the spools anymore. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TT-(Moderator) 1,145 #16 Posted February 6, 2013 Another eBay seller recommended by some members on a boating forum: http://stores.ebay.com/Genuinedealz Greg's website: http://gregsmarinewiresupply.com/Zen/index.php?main_page=contact_us Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
refracman 167 #17 Posted February 6, 2013 I prefer Dell City, you can buy 1 pc or a 100 pcs and they ship fast, they also sell the crimppers. If you into having you harness a exact match to OEM. All their stuff is good quality also. http://www.delcity.net/ 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #18 Posted February 7, 2013 well i just went and ordered a whole bunch of stuff, 6ga, 12ga and 14ga marine tinned wire from gregs, terminals, connectors and crimper etc from delcity..... i need to do kents 875 now as well so i ordered my colored wire in 50 ft lengths, should be plenty to do a few more tractors down the road too........ (gotta plan ahead) gregs marine wire order..... Products ------------------------------------------------------ 1 x 14 AWG Tinned Marine Primary Wire = $10.00 14 AWG Colors RED 14 AWG Coil/Reel Size 50 Feet $10.00 1 x 14 AWG Tinned Marine Primary Wire = $10.00 14 AWG Colors BLACK 14 AWG Coil/Reel Size 50 Feet $10.00 1 x 14 AWG Tinned Marine Primary Wire = $10.00 14 AWG Colors YELLOW 14 AWG Coil/Reel Size 50 Feet $10.00 1 x 14 AWG Tinned Marine Primary Wire = $10.00 14 AWG Colors LIGHT GREEN 14 AWG Coil/Reel Size 50 Feet $10.00 1 x 14 AWG Tinned Marine Primary Wire = $10.00 14 AWG Colors ORANGE 14 AWG Coil/Reel Size 50 Feet $10.00 1 x 12 AWG Tinned Marine Primary Wire = $14.00 12 AWG Colors RED 12 AWG Coil/Reel Size 50 Feet $14.00 1 x 12 AWG Tinned Marine Primary Wire = $14.00 12 AWG Colors GREEN 12 AWG Coil/Reel Size 50 Feet $14.00 20 x 6 AWG Tinned Marine Battery Cable = $21.80 6 AWG Colors BLACK 6 AWG Coil/Reel Size Per Foot $1.09 3 x 1/4" Dual-Wall Adhesive Heat Shrink 3:1 Ratio = $4.35 Colors BLACK 3 x 1/2" Dual-Wall Adhesive Heat Shrink 3:1 Ratio = $7.05 Colors BLACK ------------------------------------------------------ Sub-Total: $111.20 Table Rate (Any U.S. Address, USPS Priority Mail): $11.95 Total: $123.15 delcity order..... Qty Item Price Item Total ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 100 152105 Ring Terminal, 10 Stud, 16-14 Ga (100 MIN$0.03210 $3.21 100 152145 Ring Terminal, 1/4" Stud, 16-14 Ga (100 M$0.05070 $5.07 100 152565 Ring Terminal, 5/16" Stud, 16-14 Ga (100 $0.05070 $5.07 10 916505 1/4" Copper Tin Plated Lug, 6 Ga (1 MIN) $0.62 $6.20 10 916605 5/16" Copper Tin Plated Lug, 6 Ga (1 MIN)$0.62 $6.20 100 925735 Quick Connect Female Terminal, 16-14Ga Pa$0.26 $26.00 50 929875 Quick Connect Male Terminal, 16-14 Ga Pac$0.27 $13.50 5 945285 Body for Male Terminal, 1 Contact Packard$0.24 $1.20 20 972535 Body for Female Terminal, 1 contact Packa$0.27 $5.40 1 990168 Ratchet Crimp Tool, Open Barrel Terminals$31.43 $31.43 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Tax: $6.97 Your order has qualified for free shipping. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Total: $110.25 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BOWTIE 226 #19 Posted February 7, 2013 I'M OLD CHEVY MUSCLE CAR COLLECTOR AND SAVED A LOT OF THE OLD DASH,,ENGINE AND REAR BODY HARNESSES. ALL THE WIRE COLORS/GAUGES,TERMINALS AND PIGTAILS ARE THERE TO USE OVER. . IT WILL SAVE YOU A LOT OF MONEY. WHEN I REBUILD A HARNESS I UNWRAP THE HARNESS AND TWIST TIE WHERE WIRES LEAVE THE HARNESS. TAKE PICTURES IF NEEDED. DO YOU REPAIRS AND REWRAP WITH YOUR TAPE. IT LOOKS LIKE UNTOUCHED HARNESS WHEN DONE. BOWTIE IN OHIO Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #20 Posted February 7, 2013 yes, the old gm harnesses are good for parts. i need to replace the wiring in this harness, as the heat damage to it has exposed a lot of the wire itself and corroded it. for me the only 'correct' way to fix it is to totally replace the wiring from connector to connector, that requires new terminals as well. i dont believe that using 'pigtails' is the right way to repair wiring, but thats just my opinion....... the plugs, if in good, undamaged condition will be reused. i always take a bunch of pics when doing any work on the tractors. sometimes what you have is untouched and sometimes it isnt. thats whats so good about this forum, if something doesn't look right, usually you can find a pic on here, or at least ask for one to be posted..... thanks for your comments everyone!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BOWTIE 226 #21 Posted February 7, 2013 MARTIN THAT'S WHAT I MEAN. YOU ALWAYS NEED TO REPLACE AT LEASE ONE END AND I TRY NOT TO SPLICE. THANKS Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #22 Posted February 8, 2013 (edited) I prefer Dell City, you can buy 1 pc or a 100 pcs and they ship fast, they also sell the crimppers. If you into having you harness a exact match to OEM. All their stuff is good quality also. http://www.delcity.net/ the del city order got here today. wow, quick shipping just like you said!!!!! anyway heres the order in pic form.... just waiting on the wire now..... Edited February 8, 2013 by Martin Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #23 Posted February 13, 2013 wire came in yesterday. very nice wire and worth the trouble of buying online and waiting for it vs picking up the cheap generic stuff at the local farm and fleet..... also picked up a 5 terminal ignition plug from napa...(sme7016034) got onto starting the new harness. first of all cut all the different wire colors i needed to length. following the harness and the wiring diagram i worked out what lengths and colors for the different circuits. i used 14 ga wire for all lengths. i also bypassed the seat switch by running the black from the ignition switch directly to the coil + instead of to the pto socket. this gives power straight to the coil when the ignition is on rather than having to prove closed through the seat switch first. i still ran the red wire to and from the pto switch and will eventually use the original type switch at the brake pedal. (for the moment i made up a small piece to bypass that wiring and the switch as i dont have a switch at present... this way the pto still needs to be off to crank the engine and once the brake switch is installed the wiring for that will plug into the harness and connect to the trigger stud of the solenoid. see the wiring diagram above to see the routing of wires.... heres some pics..... wiring all cut to length... ready to start crimping the terminals, crimper and insulation stripper.... sample of crimped terminal. all wiring that goes to the ignition plug terminated and in plug. the light circuit will be added when the wiring is installed in the tractor.... basic harness temporarily taped together to check on tractor. needed to make sure that all wiring was the right lengths and positioned correctly. i made the harness a little longer in some areas to make a neater installation under the hood stand. i wanted to keep the wiring further away from the lift jackshaft and needed to add a couple inches to the length.. completed harness next to the old one, the additional length can be seen if you look closely... ammeter/ rectifier and pto switch end showing plugs.... small bypass wire for the brake switch.... next up will be the final installation on the tractor..... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sorekiwi 761 #24 Posted February 13, 2013 Nice Martin! The crimper did a nice job as well, whats the brand name on that and where did you get it? I absolutely hate every crimping tool I own, and I own about 6 different ones! EDIT: Oops, never mind, I see it in your order above! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martin 2,132 #25 Posted February 13, 2013 mike, the crimper is great for the female terminals. the male terminals are a different story. crimper jaws seem to be too wide to crimp them without bending the little tangs that are present on each side of the crimp 'area'. hard to explain, i will take a pic of what im trying to describe, but anybody who has taken apart the male terminals from the sockets would have seen them before.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
