Does size really matter?

[Torino 14]

No I am not talking about that. I am talking about GTs. We had a snow so I was able to test the 520xi with plow. Weighing in at around 1100lbs it did a good job but no better than any other tractor I have used to push snow. I have used a JD 216, 318, Simplicity 7012, Wheel Horse Electro to move snow and I have to say there is not alot of difference in the lot. All having wheel weights and chains. I thought with almost twice the weight as some other GTs I would get a lot more traction but that was not so. I would take a much smaller GT with dif. lock than the extra weight of the 520xi or the dual brakes of the 318(so I can stop one wheel spinning and get traction with the other) or the feature on the Simplicity that when one wheel spins the power goes to the other. Now don't get me wrong, I had great fun using the 520xi but can not say that it lives up to it's weight. I am much more impressed with what the early smaller tractors can do. It's like David and Goliath. David was not as big and strong but got the job done which was more impressive doing so.

So I guess my question is why do we need the bigger tractors? We have all seen little round fenders move snow just as good as a 500 series. You can use a 60" deck on a 520. I love the big tractors but are they really needed?

[refracman 167]

In truth no, but ya know the compensation thing and you get a 60" cut with a smaller tractor by useing a gang reel mower and get a nicer cut to boot

[GlenPettit 1,716]

I would have thought yes:

(1) For an implement like a tiller or snow-thrower, the extra hp really makes a big improvement when working hard and heavy use, that's when you really need it, and a larger heavier tractor can handle, tow & control the implement much better.

(2) In snow & ice, I would think that the larger/heavier tractor would be less likely to get into trouble by sliding/slipping, but IF/when it does get stuck, it is a lot harder to get it out than a smaller light weight tractor.

(3) A smaller tractor does a great job with smaller lighter jobs, but may not have enough strength to tackle the larger heavier jobs.

(4) There sure are a lot of factors to consider, and it's hard to really compare tractor sizes (tires, hp, weight, age & the drivers' experience).

For me, it takes hours & hours of use to get used to the individual "personality" of a new tractor. I do have a beautiful '69 GT-14/loader that is big and strong; but very "stiff", hard to steer, slow & moody, -- I like my old rusty weaker C-101 for plowing, because it was my first original Wheel Horse in '78, is very agile, I know her well, (even has a name), and she still keeps plugging along, like me.

For mowing; a lighter fat-wheel tractor is much better/softer on the lawn.

[Ken B 3,164]

So I gotta ask, how much snow were you pushing? You may not notice a big difference until you get hit with over of foot of heavy wet snow. Trust me, I used to run a Trojan 3500 Payloader with a 22 ft. blade on it to clear snow. If the circumstance's call for it, size does matter.

[JackC 617]

No other horse can push or pull like a D Series with weights and chains on.

[Rick_in_CT 156]

I'm surprised in your results. I went from a Charger 12 to a 522xi, both with plows, weights, and chains, and I have to say that I find the extra weight of the 5xi makes a difference for me. I have 550 feet of blacktop with a hill leading up to the road, and I very rarely spin the wheels. Moving dry snow is easy, but when you get the heavy wet stuff is when I want the most weight possible under me. When making a long run with the Charger 12 in the heavy stuff, when it would start to back up in front of the blade, the weight in front of the blade would become too much, and the machine would start to slide sideways a little, loosing some of its bite on the snow that was being pushed. The 5xi rarely ever gets "bumped out" by the snow that I am pushing. I can push going uphill with no problem on the 5xi, where I know I use to spin the tires on the Charger 12. I would also take smaller bites and more passes with the Charger due to its limitations. With the xi I usually cut with 3/4 of the width of the blade at full throttle and it throws the snow to the side pretty well. I am using two link chains which provide a smooth ride, and work well on the blacktop.

I would go with what ever works best for you. Smaller machines eat less gas. I am surprised how much gas I go through on the 5xi compared to the Kohler 12 in the Charger. I have attached a picture from a recent storm here in Connecticut. I have a plow on one 5xi and a two stage blower on the other 5xi. In my opinion, having the two tractors is way more fun than having a plow truck.

Rick

[Wheel-N-It 2,968]

Rick, thats a couple of really nice snow movers you have! I know what you mean about the gas consumption too. My 417 with the KT-17 Kohler drinks noticeably more gas than the trusty old 312 you see in my avatar.

[roscoemi 245]

I agree with Glen, you will need the hp and weight running a tiller or as blower. I sold a Craftsman with a 17.5 Kohler and 6 speed that I plowed with for 10 years when I got my C-121. P'Chops Ranger is about 1/3 smaller with 1/3 of the hp and plows as good in different types of snow. The blade design on the WH scrapes much better tho.

[MalMac 1,331]

Out of all my tractors I use my C-81 the most. The only time I use the bigger tractors is when the 2 stage blower is needed and a bigger mower deck is used.

When mowing I still go with mostly the 10hp. In todays high price gas the big hp usually just set.

On the farm we use the formula when buying equipment of how much acreage we need to get done in a certain amount of time to what size of implement is being used. Then we look at what the piece of equipment cost vs. what amount of profit we are going to get from it. Plus there are other factors that figure in. With the cost of everything being so high. You really have to look at how much more profit your going to get and what kind of time frame it is going to take to get it. If it takes a huge amount of time you start getting into the factor of the piece of equipment costing money before you start getting profit from it. There are all different kinds of factors the come into play with everybody having different contributing factors.

With just mowing around here we can get done just alittle faster using the bigger tractor with a bigger deck but the cost is just not worth it. Plus you don't get what every Wheel Horse enthusiast wants. Seat time.

[rexman72 210]

you would think more weight better traction equals pushing the snow better

[6wheeler 603]

I'd say, yes size does matter. The company I work for , put a new seat in the ready-mix truck I drive. With my impressive girth, its much more difficult to fit between the seat and the steering wheel. Oh, we were talking about tractors right? All of my tractors handle my 10 and 12 inch plows without any problems. I do not use any of them for snow. I use my Bobcat and an 8' plow. Of course, here in Minnesota we don't seem to get any, anymore. But as far as mowing, I think the 520 with a 48" deck far and away out cuts my C-165 with the same deck. The 520 turns better and I can go alot faster (I haven't tried my 60" on it yet)but, that is true. It does drink alot more fuel. I have never tried the smaller round hoods because quite frankly, I don't think they would fit me :twocents-mytwocents:

[JimD 3,345]

I have plowed 10 to 12 inches of snow with a B60 with an 8hp k181 transplant many times over the years with chains and no wheel weights. It took awhile to get the job done with that much snow. Now I use a C85 with a 14hp OH140 Tecumseh transplant, same plow, with chains and no wheel weights. It does a better job, so I think the horsepower makes more of a difference than weight. You're opinion may vary. :)

[855ownerJoel 32]

WELL....... Regarding SIZE, never mind. I use my 855 for most of my snow removal until it gets up to blower depth, and then I still sometimes or most often still go back to my 855 for snow removal. There is a time and place for more HP and weight. The 855 has less trouble getting unstuck, although it seldom has left me stuck, and the 8 HP has plenty of power for pushing a plow. My 14 and 10 HP models suck more fuel and even though heavier do not always necessarily get through the snow better. Part may be tire width, second may be that the weight just makes them sink more rather than driving over snow, or maybe just maybe it's all about the little engine that could. What ever it is gear ratio, tires, flotation, the little Wheel Horses were designed to get the job done!

[actractorboys 2]

Size dose matter sometime I got a 1276 with 10 hp and I can push 2 to 4 inches of snow with turf tires and no chains or weight and my old 855 wouldn't move with out chains

[Jake Kuhn 1,554]

For plowing I have never really cared about having a big machine. I have used a round hood the last 3 years with no issues. I just used my 702 today and it does great! No weights and I never caught it spinning! ~Jake

[woodbird007 16]

Weight and horsepower aside what I like best for snow plowing is hydrostatic. My 875 and B 100 auto are much more effective and convenient than when I plowed with my gear drives.

[mowerman1193 32]

I was out plowing snow back when i had a big Simplicity collection.I had old landlords and soveriens but I always used a little 717 Simplicity Broadmoor because I felt cool making my neighbor mad because I was going places that he kept getting stuck at with his Wheel Horse D-180, LOL.. I had the little Broadmoor weighted down with all the factory wheel weights weights (40#) plus the rear pin weight (40#) and a collar weight on each side of the pin weight ( 40# ) two link v-bar chains. That little tractor would push more snow than any other tractor I have owned. Though I have never weighted any other tractor like that either, LOL

The worst tractors I have ever plowed with is my John Deere 140-H3's. if I don't have the 75# wheel weights on that thing it aint going to push itself down the driveway, and I have the v-bar chains on it. I think its because the plow is so heavy on the front of it that its pulling weight off the rear. My Work Horse's ( Gt1642 and GT1600 ) will push a lot of snow and I have never run any weights, just v-bar chains.. I think with Wheel Horse's plow frame hooking to the rear axle helps put weight on the back wheels rather than mounting plows at the front like the Simplicity's and John Deere's

[Tim 97]

in terms of moving snow, hp does not really matter 8hp-20 hp, the tires will spin before you run out of power even with chains!!!

size does not matter, weight matters...load it up you will be amazed...

I agree the design of pushing of the rear end makes the plow riding up the snow much harder

I like hydros to plow the best, you can start out slow and then when you get moving, speed up, goes much faster

the only garden tractor i ever plowed with besides a WH is an old sears suburban 12 ~1970, the plow went on the front end and constantly road over the snow

Edited January 24, 2013 by Tim

[mowerman1193 32]

in terms of moving snow, hp does not really matter 8hp-20 hp, the tires will spin before you run out of power even with chains!!!

size does not matter, weight matters...load it up you will be amazed...

I agree the design of pushing of the rear end makes the plow riding up the snow much harder

I like hydros to plow the best, you can start out slow and then when you get moving, speed up, goes much faster

the only garden tractor i ever plowed with besides a WH is an old sears suburban 12 ~1970, the plow went on the front end and constantly road over the snow

Hey Tim, I like your weight bracket on the rear, is that a homemade bracket? How does it mount to the tractor. I have been wanting to do something like this for my GT1642.

Kevin

[IthacaJeff 151]

Tire width also matters. skinnier tires (with our without chains) dig in more while wider tires float on

top. My 310-8 has very little trouble moving most snow, but the big storm a week or so ago did make

pushing a lot of snow difficult. Had to plow in a herringbone pattern. I run 2 sets of chains, one of the

sets is v-bar. A heavier tractor may have made some difference.

My Simplicity Sunstar with 60" deck and wheel weights weighs about 1200 lbs. If it were not for the

diff lock I would get stuck in mud/wet grass all the time. The worn down fat tires are terrible for

traction.

[Tim 97]

kevin i had an old bracket that was for a rear trac vac,

I welded a 2" receiver to it

I bought a trailer hitch and cut off the part where the ball bolts on

I then welded a piece of flat stock to it to hold the weights and a couple pieces of flat stock to stop them from sliding out

this works well for me, i took a cargo carrier that i made and made a box for it, i use the tractor like a little truck around the yard