Penetrating oil tests

[SousaKerry 502]

This was forwarded to me in an email today FWIW thought I would share.

For those of you who actually try to repair some older and rusted equipment, the following just might help you out. Worth the short read.

Penetrating Oils

Machinist’s Workshop Mag™ recently published some information on various penetrating oils that I found very interesting.

Some of you might appreciate this.

The magazine reports they tested penetrants for break out torque on rusted nuts.

They are below, as forwarded by an ex-student and professional machinist.

They arranged a subjective test of all the popular penetrates with the control being the torque required to remove the nut from a “scientifically rusted†environment.

Penetrating Oils ........... Average torque load to loosen*

No Oil used .................... 516 pounds

WD-40 ....................... ... 238 pounds

PB Blaster ..................... 214 pounds

Liquid Wrench .................127 pounds

Kano Kroil ...................... 106 pounds

ATF & Acetone Mix............53 pounds

The ATF-Acetone mix is a “home brew†mix of 50 - 50 automatic transmission fluid and acetone.

Note this “home brew†released bolts better than any commercial product in this one particular test.

Our local machinist group mixed up a batch and we all now use it with equally good results. Note also that “Liquid Wrench†is almost as good as “Kroil†for about 20% of the price.

Steve from Godwin-Singer says that ATF & Acetone mix is best, but you can also use ATF and lacquer thinner in a 50-50 mix.

[varosd 1,185]

Wow! great info!

I know that we all have our own preferences but I will try the ATF/Acetone brew

[tunahead72 2,460]

Interesting...

Strange that the results for WD-40 and PB Blaster aren't that far apart, yet I (and others?) find that PB Blaster will easily loosen things that WD-40 won't begin to touch. :dunno:

[Save Old Iron 1,568]

I would love to know how they created the “scientifically rusted†environment and how many bolts each mixture was applied to.

Interesting no one tried the same test on rolls pins stuck in 40 year old steering wheels.

Also interesting to see if a "witches brew" of acetone, pb blaster, ATF and liquid wrench wouldn't be a miracle cure. Heck, throw some Marvel Mystery Oil in there too.

[rmaynard 15,751]

What troubles me about acetone and ATF is that the two liquids do not blend. If you mix it, then shake it until you have an emulsion, the acetone will quickly separate and evaporate before it has a chance to penetrate. :confusion-shrug:

[Save Old Iron 1,568]

Did a little research on this topic

Turns out the fasteners where not bolts but "pins". I was wondering about the units being listed as pounds, not foot pounds. I thought the 516 number, if foot/ lbs, was a little suspicious.

The results published apparently are the pressure needed to push a pin out of the "scientifically rusted" environment.

Also turns out the author grabbed a bottle of power steering fluid by mistake (not ATF) and used power steering fluid for this experiment. Does power steering fluid mix better with acetone? Guess one of us will soon find out.

read post #18 by the author

http://bbs.homeshopm...ating-Oil/page2

[Zeek 2,286]

Wow that's is an interesting post! I was sort of loyal to Liquid Wrench just because that's what worked for me, but I will be trying the ATF/acetone combination. . . has me curious

I think a lot of stuff is based on good marketing and may not be the best thing to use, or you can make it yourself - IE a product called Tufshine http://tufshine.com/...ire-clear-coat/ which is marketed as a permanent tire shine. I bought it and it does work as advertised and does a good job at that, BUT send me a PM and I'll tell you what I think believe (after few unscientific tests) it really is :eusa-whistle:

[Tankman 3,520]

Interesting! I have a degreaser that is a mix including acetone, works great. Picked it up at an auto supply store in a spray bottle.

I'm wondering now, "Perhaps cuts rust?" I'll have to give it a try.

Just went into the shop, the stuff is PURPLE POWER. Contains water, sodium silicate, EDTA, 2-butoxyethanol, and surfactants.

Whatever those ingredients are, PURPLE POWER really works. Like WOW!

[CTPhil 53]

I use a mix of ATF, naptha and diesel fuel. The naptha stays mixed unlike the acetone component.

[sorekiwi 761]

My brew at work:

I didnt invent it scientifically at all, just tried to cover all my bases with everything I had on hand. I have heard people swear by brake fluid as a penetrant as well.

[Coadster32 793]

Interesting thread, and thanks for sharing. Not certain about "a scientific control" on this one. IMHO...there's no such thing as a silver bullet for anything. A rusty-stuck bolt sometimes requires a bigger wrench and a beer. Let's not forget about a good heat application as well.

[wp205a 43]

Kano makes 2 Kroils, Aero and Sili. We use Sili-Kroil and it works wonders. Now that I've said that, I hope my steering wheel comes off my 854 with little or no damage. Been spraying it off and on since August dreading the result. Great post, thanks.

[wp205a 43]

Pics posted today, steering wheel and engine pulleys removed, with nearly zero effort thanks to Kano Sili-Kroil. Not knocking the others, but I'll keep buying Kroil.

[varosd 1,185]

Kano makes 2 Kroils, Aero and Sili. We use Sili-Kroil and it works wonders. Now that I've said that, I hope my steering wheel comes off my 854 with little or no damage. Been spraying it off and on since August dreading the result. Great post, thanks.

Since August!!??!! just kidding I soaked the blades on my 48" for like 2 months before they came off. didnt want to use a torch. ended up using liquid wrench and beer...not in the that order!

[JackC 617]

Has anybody tried this?

LOCTITE Fast A Counting Freeze/Corrosion Release Aerosol

Loctite Freeze & Release corrosion release instantly freezes seized and rusted bolts, nuts and studs down to -45[DEG]F (-43[DEG]C). The exceptional shock-freeze effect of this penetrating oil causes microscopic cracks in the layer of rust, allowing the lubricating ingredient to wick directly into the rust by capillary action. The rusted bolt assembly can be easily dismantled after allowing only 1-2 minutes penetration time.

http://www.fastenal...._campaign=email

[CTPhil 53]

Sombody (if they can stand the price ) should test that and report back. :handgestures-thumbupright:

[Tankman 3,520]

Sombody (if they can stand the price ) should test that and report back.

At $16+ per can, a bit costly (to say the least).

That being said, I'm going to try a can when I see it on the auto parts shelf. :eusa-think:

[prondzy 3,883]

Just bought a can on eBay through jegs performance. Yes $16 is steep but if it saves soaking time on that one stuck bolt I figure its money well spent. Will post results when can arrives....

Just bought a can on eBay through jegs performance. Yes $16 is steep but if it saves soaking time on that one stuck bolt I figure its money well spent. Will post results when can arrives....

[JackC 617]

Good to hear. I hope it actually works. I like older cars and wheel horse tractors and run into a lot of stuck parts and I don't like the idea of using a torch.

[SousaKerry 502]

I tried it at work without much luck but it wasn't scientific either, and I got the can for free from the Loctite sales guy.

[CTPhil 53]

Doesn't need to be scientific in my book. You spray iy on and it works or it doesn't. Keep us posted if you try it again.

[SCOOBY 312-h 14]

i have always used a product called deep creep penetrating oil. in my own opinion it out performs pb blaster and liquid wrench, witch is the local stuff.

[davev8 0]

My homebrew is 2/3 kerosene and a 1/3 engine oil...i have it in a 2 pint spray can that you pump up.. as its so cheap i can use for cleaning small parts etc... if i buy new i get duck oil as its much much better than WD40 at starting wet engines and is a very good rust preventative as it leaves a waxy residue, i have a drawer full of drill bits i sprayed heverly  approx 4 or 5 year ago and they still have a waxy feel to them....WD40 has gone in 2 days 

[RMCIII 838]

Military had some outstanding penetrating and long term lubricating solvents. I can't remember the penetrating lubricant, but the long term lubricant was SFD. < Awesome product. I do not remember what was in that stuff, but it actually stopped the rusting process also. If you got it on your hands, it was a nightmare to get off. If it got on your BDU's, they were done. You could not get the stuff out no matter what you tried. I wish I would have written the product mfg. down for both of them. Products were tested to mil specs for aircraft fighter altitude friction and freeze points. Whatever that stuff was made with, it worked.

[wheeledhorseman 575]

Has anybody tried this?

LOCTITE Fast A Counting Freeze/Corrosion Release Aerosol

Loctite Freeze & Release corrosion release instantly freezes seized and rusted bolts, nuts and studs down to -45[DEG]F (-43[DEG]C). The exceptional shock-freeze effect of this penetrating oil causes microscopic cracks in the layer of rust, allowing the lubricating ingredient to wick directly into the rust by capillary action. The rusted bolt assembly can be easily dismantled after allowing only 1-2 minutes penetration time.

http://www.fastenal...._campaign=email

 

I've tried a pretty much identical probuct by Ambersil which makes the same claims. In practice I didn't find it any better than their regular product which is a third the price. The technology sounds good but to my mind where the nut and bolt are in contact with substantial thicknesses of steel then you're no more likely to achieve these very low temperatures with a spray than you are of getting to cherry red with a small propane torch.

 

Andy