1977 B80 Trans, Needle Bearing Issues

[jabadamutt 9]

Hello all, my 1977 8 Speed B80 Wheel Horse needs wheel bearings. It shifted good with no problems, just about an eighth of up/down play on the left axle, oil leaking from there as well of course. One of two hubs is going to be a bear to get off. My questions are these... I see I can buy a used trans on eBay for 100 bucks, would I be better off just buying this? From what I've read, parts are going to be an issue, should I try getting parts before I start, or once I have it torn apart? I have read in the forums that Motion Industres is a good place for the bearings, there is one of these stores two miles from me, do I just take in the old needle bearings or is there a part number someone has used? What parts do I need to be looking for? Gasket for the cases, wheel seals and wheel needle bearings? Which of these parts are availble from Toro? Do I need to disemble the entire trans (or is it recommnded) once I split the cases just to replace the needle bearings? The tractor was my dads who past away recently and it has great sentimental value to me. I am a bus mechanic by trade, so am mechanically inclined, but have not worked with transmissions... Thank you in advance for any assistance.

[pfrederi 17,887]

Work with with you have to start. Needle bearings are cheap. Look at the pinned post on this section for part numbers. 1-1/8th inch axle is Herrington B1816 seal CR11050...1" axle B1616. Seals CR9815 Center gasket is available from Toro for about $5. The only hard to find part is the inner axle ball bearing. Hopefully your needle bearing didn't completely fail and damage the ball bearing in the process.

Download teh trans repair manual and search this forum for even more pictures. If it was shifting OK you will not need to get too far in.

[sorekiwi 761]

The trans is easier to do than you think. Being a mechanic by trade, you'll wonder why you were a little nervous attacking it.

Since you know the history of the one you have, and it still works fine apart from your oil leak, I'd work with the one you have. Buying second hand is a crap shoot. Since you have to split the case anyway, I'd look at all the needle rollers. As Paul said, the needle rollers are cheap. Be nice to the roller bearings on the diff though, they are no longer available.

Plenty of help here if you get stuck, but I'm sure you'll find it a lot easier than you thought.

[stevasaurus 22,872]

I would take it apart first and see what you need. If you order from Motion Industries, the parts come in buy 8:00AM the next day (here anyway). NAPA may have some of it on the shelf. TORO may be 2 days too get the gasket, check your shifter boot also. Like was said above, the inner axle ball bearing is no longer available, everything else is. We have all the numbers for the bearings and seals, but I always take the old parts with me when I order. There are plenty of pictures and videos in the LINK section on the main page to help you out...and plenty of help here if you need it. Post some pictures... :)

[jabadamutt 9]

Thanks for the replies! Attached is a photo, have gone thru the deck, engine, painted and the trans is next, will take my time with the trans since the snow is about to fall. Also have posted on you tube how it looked when I just about started,

Was in the process of refinishing the rear tires when I ran into this issue. With what you all have posted, I feel better going into it. I will probably take you up on your offer to ask more questions once I get into it, might not be for a couple of weeks due to upcoming weekend commitments. Thanks again.

[Foozerush 40]

You will enjoy the WH over that MTD!! :)

[jabadamutt 9]

So, I was able to spend a couple of hours on it today. So far, I have purchased the gasket, wheel bearings (using the part number previously mentioned for 1 1/8 axles) and axle seals. The guys at motion industries definitely seem very knowledgeable. He had lost a son in Iraq, was cool talking to him since I am a vet. Got the hubs off as well as the key ways, had to use a 3 jaw puller on one of the axles, and one key way was a pain, but all came off with no damage. Pulled the trans out, not to hard, just took off the shift knobs using a strap wrench and took off the bracket that holds the trans on the top. Left it at that for now, am hoping that I can get to splitting the cases next weekend.

[stevasaurus 22,872]

Keep us posted...I like the guys at Motion Industries...I have a very good guy here at mine also He is always willing to spend the extra time trying to match up a bearing or seal. :)

[jabadamutt 9]

Ok, so I was able to split the cases today, it looked fairly decent once i took it apart. The left side needle bearing was totally gone, no needles left... What happened was the needles must have come apart and somehow and went thru the axle and unfortunately took out most of the 1 1/2 bearing that gets pressed into the side of the case. Pfrederi, you must definitely have lots of experience with these because what you said may have happened did... Found all of the bearing pieces in the case, cleaned it all out, cleaned off all the old gasket materials and replaced the two wheel bearing needle bearings I purchased previously. Most everything came out with little pain. So now I need to find that 1 1/2 bearing... The parts book shows it as part number 1533. I am hoping that I can take the old one into motion industries and they can match it up. Anyone have a good number for this? I am thinking about going with double oil seals when I finish it up, good idea? Thanks all!

[pfrederi 17,887]

1533 is NLA from anywhere.... There is no direct substitute. Search this forum for 1533 there are some ideas about sleeves and other sized bearings. Sorry!!

[stevasaurus 22,872]

Send a PM to ( racinfool40 )...I know he has a few of the #1533 bearings and will help you out. :)

Personally, there is no good reason to double up the oil seals...actually...I do not think a second one will fit.

[sorekiwi 761]

Well, thats a shame about the 1533 bearing.

As the others have said, its no longer available from Toro, although I am sure there must be a few sitting on dusty shelves in the dealers somewhere around the country. A few phone calls might be worth your while. About a year ago the list price was around $75 (apiece).

If Mike (racinfool) cant help you with a used one, send me a PM. I've got a few transmissions here that I could pull apart to look for a good one.

[jabadamutt 9]

Thank you, racinfool is helping me out, appreciate it!

[jabadamutt 9]

So, when I installed the wheel bearings, How do you know how far to drive them in? I was thinking I would drive them in about the thickness of two oil seals, and double up on the seals. They seem to be fine like this, but Steve's comment about them not fitting has me wondering if I am going to have issues when reassembling. I got the idea of doubling up on the wheel seals from reading forum stuff, sounded like a good idea. Thanks again!

[stevasaurus 22,872]

I think there is a ridge in the axle and other places for that mater where the bearing goes in until it seats on that ridge. If so, you can not tap it in any farther than that. Another thing, you can always change a seals on these trannys without tearing them apart.

[jabadamutt 9]

Got the trans installed today, thanks to all! Just need to install the tires and test drive her. I will take some pictures and post them here when I get a chance. Thanks again!

[jabadamutt 9]

Here's are some pics! Let me know what you think...

[varosd 1,185]

there is a pair of used 1533 bearings just popped up on sleaze bay FYI

[stevasaurus 22,872]

I just love the way these transmissions clean up and look brand new. BTW, nice looking horse. Congratulations on getting her back together, really looks great. :)

[jabadamutt 9]

Here is the youtube version:

[racinfool40 202]

:handgestures-thumbupright: definitly a nice lookin machine there..Glad ya got her back on the road!!

[stevasaurus 22,872]

Yep, that's a B-80...sounds just like my B-100 when you start it...nice machine. Did you try or end up doubling the seals on the axle?? :)

[jabadamutt 9]

Thanks for the positive feedback! On the wheel seals, there was no ridge that stopped the bearing from going all the way thru. The bearings were a tight fit, I used an arbor to install them. It was the same arbor I used to hammer out the thin small piece of the old bearing that was left in the axle. On my trans, if I wanted to, I could go all the way thru from one side out the other side with the needle bearings. I measured the seal thickness, doubled that up and left room for two seals, I figured as long as they fit, why not... I noticed, one problem after a test drive to the gas station, the hub on the left side walked towards the center. I tightened it back down but am concerned this is going to happen again. I was thinking that I would remove the old lock bolt, check threads, replace if needed and maybe drill a notch into the key way where it sits, maybe even drill another hole thru the hub and install a second lock bolt...

[sorekiwi 761]

At some point Wheel Horse did put a second setscrew in the hubs at 90 degrees to the existing one It may help your problem.

Usually I have found that the hubs that wont stay tight are wallowed out in the bore. The hub does need to be a reasonably close fit on the axle in order to stay tight.

[pfrederi 17,887]

Thanks for the positive feedback! On the wheel seals, there was no ridge that stopped the bearing from going all the way thru. The bearings were a tight fit, I used an arbor to install them. It was the same arbor I used to hammer out the thin small piece of the old bearing that was left in the axle. On my trans, if I wanted to, I could go all the way thru from one side out the other side with the needle bearings. I measured the seal thickness, doubled that up and left room for two seals, I figured as long as they fit, why not... I noticed, one problem after a test drive to the gas station, the hub on the left side walked towards the center. I tightened it back down but am concerned this is going to happen again. I was thinking that I would remove the old lock bolt, check threads, replace if needed and maybe drill a notch into the key way where it sits, maybe even drill another hole thru the hub and install a second lock bolt...

Check the end of the set screw, it should have cup like depression in the end that will dig into the woodruff key. I bet yours is worn smooth. Buy a new one at any hardware store 3/8 16TPI 1.5 inch or longer