Need ideas...What to do w/Charger 12

[Ed Kennell 37,985]

Found this pile o parts (Charger 12) while cleaning the barn today to make room to winter store the boats.

Kinda got side tracted on the cleaning and 3 hours later, the "pile" started to look pretty cool.

I moved the front axel over the frame to drop the front end.

Now what do I do with it .... Puller ... Dragster ... Rat Rod .... Go Cart ??????????

It has a 3 speed in it now which I assume is no good for a puller. Would this tranny handle speed ?

I have a C-101 with an 8 speed that I could put in, but I have visions of a redo on the 101 as it is 99% complete.. needs a carb and starter.

[AMC RULES 37,124]

Dude!

You know...the resto police are watching?

[1maidenfan 202]

Dude!

You know...the resto police are watching?

:ROTF:

[Ed Kennell 37,985]

Dude!

You know...the resto police are watching?

:scared-ghostface:

OK, I'll plead guilty of chopin the charger, and promise I won't cut on the 101 if we can make a deal for a light sentence and time served for good behavior.

[Kelly 1,029]

A Charger is a Hydro, the Raider is a stick, and I'm pretty sure all Raiders were 6/8speeds, so not sure what you cut up.

[TT-(Moderator) 1,131]

Two things that I would like to add......

If you keep the rake, you'll need to level the engine or the oil will pool in the breather cavity and not drain back into the crankcase correctly.

If you plan on going "fast", the front axle will need tilted back at the top for some positive caster. If you run it with the current negative caster, it will whip and wander all over the place and could be hard to control. I certainly hope you'll build better tie rods too.

I have no idea how much speed the transaxle will take. Regardless, all new bearings and a lighter weight oil would be a great help. Keep in mind that the original style front wheel bearings aren't designed for high speeds either.

[Coadster32 793]

I think it looks pretty cool with the front end the way you have it. I'd take TT's advice though. I wouldn't shy away from a 4 speed pulling, just make sure it is a 4 pinion rear and not an 8.

Don't worry about the police. IMHO, I'd rather see a mutt being built, than it all going to the scrap pile.

Good luck with it.

[Tankman 3,518]

^{Lengthen the frame, looks like a great chopper project.}

[Ed Kennell 37,985]

A Charger is a Hydro, the Raider is a stick, and I'm pretty sure all Raiders were 6/8speeds, so not sure what you cut up.

A Charger is a Hydro, the Raider is a stick, and I'm pretty sure all Raiders were 6/8speeds, so not sure what you cut up.

It was a Charger... I scarfed the 2046 Sundstrand hydro out of it for my 16 AUTO, then bolted on this 3-4 speed.

I think it looks pretty cool with the front end the way you have it. I'd take TT's advice though. I wouldn't shy away from a 4 speed pulling, just make sure it is a 4 pinion rear and not an 8.

Don't worry about the police. IMHO, I'd rather see a mutt being built, than it all going to the scrap pile.

Good luck with it.

I think it looks pretty cool with the front end the way you have it. I'd take TT's advice though. I wouldn't shy away from a 4 speed pulling, just make sure it is a 4 pinion rear and not an 8.

Don't worry about the police. IMHO, I'd rather see a mutt being built, than it all going to the scrap pile.

Good luck with it.

How do I tell if it's a 4 or 8 pinnion ??

[Ed Kennell 37,985]

Two things that I would like to add......

If you keep the rake, you'll need to level the engine or the oil will pool in the breather cavity and not drain back into the crankcase correctly.

If you plan on going "fast", the front axle will need tilted back at the top for some positive caster. If you run it with the current negative caster, it will whip and wander all over the place and could be hard to control. I certainly hope you'll build better tie rods too.

I have no idea how much speed the transaxle will take. Regardless, all new bearings and a lighter weight oil would be a great help. Keep in mind that the original style front wheel bearings aren't designed for high speeds either.

Two things that I would like to add......

If you keep the rake, you'll need to level the engine or the oil will pool in the breather cavity and not drain back into the crankcase correctly.

If you plan on going "fast", the front axle will need tilted back at the top for some positive caster. If you run it with the current negative caster, it will whip and wander all over the place and could be hard to control. I certainly hope you'll build better tie rods too.

I have no idea how much speed the transaxle will take. Regardless, all new bearings and a lighter weight oil would be a great help. Keep in mind that the original style front wheel bearings aren't designed for high speeds either.

Thanks for the advice. If I would set up for speed, I will lower the rear by moving the tranny up and using smaller rear rubber. Also plan to move the steering wheel back about 10" and down about 6" to put it behind the console. Any thoughts ???

[kpinnc 11,866]

How do I tell if it's a 4 or 8 pinnion ??

I'm not sure why this matters, unless Chris just hates to see an 8-pinion differential used for your application. He may have meant 10-pinion (as they are less tolerant of abuse) with his remark?

To answer your question: You can't tell from the outside of the transmission. 4 and 8 pinion differentials behave identically- though a 10-pinion "limited-slip" differential does not. The only way to determine for certain if it's a 4 or 8-pinion is by opening the case and looking at it, though most tractors (I would say NEARLY all) with 1-inch axles are NOT 8-pinion. I have heard of them, but never seen one. The Toro MPV shows several transmission models with them, but it is not always correct.

If the tranny has 1 and 1/8th inch axles, it can be either 4 or 8-pinion. 8-pinions in this case are more common.

Good luck with the project. Nice concept!

[Ed Kennell 37,985]

Thanks, Kpin, The tranny is 1" axle, so you say it's probably 4 pinion..

Just got one step closer to the LOOK i'm after. Moved the steering column back.

Now I'm thinkin puller.

[Coadster32 793]

I'm not sure why this matters, unless Chris just hates to see an 8-pinion differential used for your application. He may have meant 10-pinion (as they are less tolerant of abuse) with his remark?

Yes, I meant don't use a 10pinion rear to pull with...sorry for the typo. :hide:

[Rooster 191]

I like the rake, maybe lengthen the frame a bit, but it would be fine as is.

If your looking at Rat rod/go cart/dragster type "speed", as in just something to play with, there really is not a big need to lower it much. Smaller tires in the rear are going to hurt the speed, or require more over driving of the trans-axle. Overdriving the trans, however, could be a good thing as it aids in the gearing advantage. Six of one situation.

Lowering it will help cornering a bit, but with that tractor you won't get good handling at all unless you ditched that trans-axle all together. Wider would help you more than lower

I have seen a Horse that is actually very competitive in its class in mower racing. (The technical legality of the build is still being debated)

SO real question is, what do you want to do to it? How much time and money do you want to put into it?

You Could build an 60+MPH capable machine out of it, or do much less?

AS for what TT said...he is spot on, that front end over about 10 MPH is going to get hairy scary! I have seen race chassis with bad front end geometry that I could barely even keep on the track at 15MPH, and they had purpose built, but badly set-up, racing front axles!

If you are going to pull or race, first step is finding out where and what the rules are, before you build something illegal!

[kpinnc 11,866]

Thanks, Kpin, The tranny is 1" axle, so you say it's probably 4 pinion..

Remember, my "axle" remarks were for mechanical trannies, not hydros. Charger hydostatics sometimes had a bevel-gear, automotive style differential. Not sure how to tell on those from the outside.