Crank 20 times before Kohler's start

[The Toolman 22]

My C-101 does the same thing when it has set for a coupla weeks or so, an everything is new. Gas valve in tank, see thru filter right before the engine where I can see it, new pump, rebuilt carb. No different from when it had the old stuff on it. If I use it every few days, no problem. Couple weeks, long cranks to start. Shutting the fuel at tank didn't seem to help any either.

Fuel pumps always seem to push better than pull, don't know why they didn't go with a small electric by tank on these lower than carb, 3 mile away gas tank models.

[tzthompson 2]

My son-in-law has the same problem with his 15hp Kohler. I thought we would install an inline primer bulb as suggested, Should it go between the tank and the inline filter or after the inline filter, or does it make any difference? Thanks

[The Toolman 22]

It really shouldn't make any diff as long as the filter is kept clean.

[Warning:Unsupervised 81]

Great Kohler hard starting posts here guys, covers about everything. My 76 B-100 8-speed {tank on firewall} is hard to start in spring after setting all season. After shutting gas off and running carb/line dry for storage when spring comes it must be primed,primed & primed again. It takes several shots after waiting for line to fill and it starts a few times for short periods but wont pick up enough fuel to run until about 5-6 tries. But once it picks up fuel it runs great and starts on its own real quick every week through out the season.

   Even after a couple weeks it picks right up no problem.

    After reading here though I think I will take my fuel pump apart and give it a cleaning. When I got it, the fuel system was filthy and I went through it all including a carb kit. I didnt want to take the pump appart then but I found its breakdown since. Just assumed the old pump may be getting weak since it does run great at all speeds? A good cleaning in it may be my ticket and if not I'll know what its condition is. If it looks anything like the rest of the system did Im suprised its running really. Was just flat nasty inside!! The ol' guy who had it passed on several yrs before I bought it and it was stored with fuel in it. Stored inside at least but fuel varnished.

  It only takes a tick turd to stop up the tiny holes in fuel systems that I do know.

  Thanks I appreciate your time and I'll let you know if theres a change or if I just tear it up. That wont be a first by any means...lol

 

FYI on white spiders in gas I saw a weird thing last summer. My neighbor filled her Toro HXL up with gas, she didnt see until afterwards her can was full of hundreds of tiny black ants. I had to pull the tank off. Lucky she saw them floating after filling it and didnt start it. I guess the lead ant went in and the rest followed?? So her ant problem solved itself.  Ant our 4.00 gallon new gas just great?...Had to say it...lol

[47JDG 65]

I used to have this issue with my C-81 until I started leaving the fuel cap loose. I just turn it a revolution now and don't tighten it down completely. I used to have to prime up the fuel pump when it would sit a week or longer. A couple of times it flat out lost its prime while I was cutting grass. Ever since I have left my fuel cap loose, I have had no problems. (obviously I have a fuel vent problem).

[dandan111 31]

My cap isn't vented very good. It starts better with the cap off. Thought about drilling a hole in it.

[PaulC 341]

I have a 12 hp kohler magnum on my 312h that does this same thing. what ive learned to do that seems to help is toggle the choke from off to full 4 times or so and then leave it on. I also have another 12hp magnum on a 312a with high hours that burns oil and that one fires right up haha

[Warning:Unsupervised 81]

DANDAN111

 

 I think if you just drill a whole in the cap it may splash out when full? Im only guessing this?

  I do know the vented caps have an inner liner cap with a gap between cap top/liner so it wont splash out. If its only after sitting long stretches like over winter like mine it may be best to let sleeping dogs lie? I would just replace mine if it starts doing it alot. So far mine dont bleed off between mowing sessions and Im starting to feel lucky after reading here?..lol

[ericj 1,578]

my D200 when it sits for a long period of time i have to spray carb cleaner in it till it picks up the fuel. unfortunately it gets left sit more than it gets run so i just deal with it. it was dad's tractor bought when i was a teenager and i grew up driving it so it has low hours and ain't never going any where else if i can help it

 

 

 

eric j 

[tunahead72 2,400]

It only takes a tick turd to stop up the tiny holes in fuel systems...

 

That statement cracks me up for some reason, I have no idea how to respond.

[banjoman 1]

Hey guys, I have a 1979 C-161 with a Kohler 341. I replaced the fuel line and the cut off valve with the filter at the gas tank. I had fuel coming out of the hose before the fuel pump but no fuel after the fuel pump. I would turn over the engine with the fuel line after the fuel pump off and would get no gas. I took the fuel pump off and manually pumped the lever that went into the engine block and the gas would pump gas. I put the fuel pump back on and cranked it up and started  and ran for about 45 minutes and would stop running.  I took off the fuel pump again and primed it with my finger moving the lever up and down until there was gas in the bowl and it would run some more. My question is do I have internal problems in the engine block not pumping the lever on the fuel pump or do I have a bad fuel pump. Thanks for all your help!

[nyquil junkie 225]

Will the old k series run gravity fed or do they require the pump?

[47JDG 65]

Hey guys, I have a 1979 C-161 with a Kohler 341. I replaced the fuel line and the cut off valve with the filter at the gas tank. I had fuel coming out of the hose before the fuel pump but no fuel after the fuel pump. I would turn over the engine with the fuel line after the fuel pump off and would get no gas. I took the fuel pump off and manually pumped the lever that went into the engine block and the gas would pump gas. I put the fuel pump back on and cranked it up and started  and ran for about 45 minutes and would stop running.  I took off the fuel pump again and primed it with my finger moving the lever up and down until there was gas in the bowl and it would run some more. My question is do I have internal problems in the engine block not pumping the lever on the fuel pump or do I have a bad fuel pump. Thanks for all your help!

Try priming it up again and then leaving your gas cap very loose on your fuel tank. It sounds just like the issue I had with my C-81. If its pumping fuel when you work it manually with your finger, its much more likely its a vent issue than an internal issue with your cam.

[can whlvr 993]

yea they will run gravity feed

[RedHorse54 578]

On 9/21/2012 at 7:31 AM, tractorbeast said:

I have two 1980's C-series with a 10 and a 12hp kohler on them. they both act the same when starting. 20 or more cranks before finally starting. Ive had the carb apart a few times on the 12 hp engine, with no difference in the ease of starting. Could it be a fuel pump issue possibly? If I pull the "out" hose off the fuel pump, how should the fuel come out-drizzle or shoot up in the air. Any thoughts or suggestions would be appreciated.

 

[formariz 11,987]

I had the same issues with a C125. Here what corrected it 100% from an earlier post.

 

Posted November 28 · Report post

On 10/30/2016 at 9:56 PM, Ed Kennell said:

  No need to rebuild a carb till this is resolved.      Fill the tank to be sure the fuel level is above the fuel pump and try cranking again with the carb line off.

These pumps have very little suction capacity.   The pump intake must be below the fuel level.   These tractors with the tank under the seat can have a fuel delivery problem if the pump is less than perfect.   If the inlet valve does not seal perfectly, they will not suck fuel into the pump.

 

Correct indeed! The stock mechanical pump in this system with tank under seat has a lot to work against it specifically gravity . With fuel tank full level is about even with pump, however as it lowers even with a new pump its hard work for it. On my c-125 anything less than full tank at full throttle under load there was always fuel starvation. It was also very easy to see what was happening by paying attention to the fuel level inside the clear inline fuel filter.

Switched to a Faccet electric pump and tractor runs so much better. Starting it is pretty much instant, once it turns over it fires.

 

Another change I made was to eliminate strainer inside tank. Somehow unlike other systems, with tank under seat, garbage always gets in the tank. Strainer gets blocked real easy and clearing it is just a pain. I opted to have an additional clear inline filter right outside tank. I can see how much debris is in it all the time and it is easy to change keeping tank also clean this way.

 

So, I have a small clear inline filter outside tank, a filter right before pump (supplied with pump) and I also have a large clear inline filter in the engine bay. This last filter I found at Auto Zone and unlike most, fuel enters through top and also exits through top. Filter stands up straight acting like a sediment bowl. If there is water in the system it actually separates it from fuel and you can see water on bottom of it.

 

All sounds a little excessive but for the last two years I never had to clean carburetor, adjust it or any other fuel related problem.

 

[moe1965 735]

Be careful if you are going to add air pressure to the fuel tank static electricity could build up.   BOOM. Not a good thing.

[tunahead72 2,400]

5 minutes ago, formariz said:

... and I also have a large clear inline filter in the engine bay. This last filter I found at Auto Zone and unlike most, fuel enters through top and also exits through top. Filter stands up straight acting like a sediment bowl. If there is water in the system it actually separates it from fuel and you can see water on bottom of it...

 

I'm curious about this last filter.  Do you have a photo (maybe installed), or a part number from AutoZone?

[formariz 11,987]

1 hour ago, tunahead72 said:

 

I'm curious about this last filter.  Do you have a photo (maybe installed), or a part number from AutoZone?

Don't have good access right now to tractor mentioned in post but here it is in another one.

[Warning:Unsupervised 81]

Thanks' I like that filter too Formariz I may just get me one? My B100 8spd still starts the same after cleaning the pump so I figured when mine needs primed every week to use it I'll put a new one on it.  May even put an electric pump on her this spring if it's too hard to prime, that gets old no doubt? 

[Racinbob 11,030]

I'm glad this old thread was resurrected. I have the same issue with my 2005 Classic GT. If it sits one day it fires right up. Each additional day requires more cranking. I always figured it was just the fuel flowing back into the tank. This gives me some ideas. 

[JackC 617]

I run into the same problem all the time with my tank under seat C-Series. I put an electric fuel pump on my C-81 and I now get instant starts.  I also use clear fuel line from the filter to the carburetor so I can watch the infusion of the happy juice to the engine.

Varoooom 

[Stormin 9,981]

I've fitted primer bulbs in the fuel lines on my tractors. Just a squeeze and your off.

 

[Wishin4a416 2,191]

Make sure the throttle shafts are not overly worn. I have rebuilt 3 in the recent years and bushed the shafts which were terrible and they start so easy now.

[Warning:Unsupervised 81]

1 hour ago, Racinbob said:

I'm glad this old thread was resurrected. I have the same issue with my 2005 Classic GT. If it sits one day it fires right up. Each additional day requires more cranking. I always figured it was just the fuel flowing back into the tank. This gives me some ideas. 

 

You are correct!!

  It is indeed the fuel flowing back to the tank because when the pumps seals go bad they are no longer able to hold pressure nor build pressure well enough. They will bleed off.. A cheap fix is adding an inline primer bulb to it like Stormin says.

Edited December 23, 2016 by 123GO