Fuel pump d180

[tommyg 152]

I'm having some trouble getting my D180 to keep running when the gas tank gets below a certain point. I'm thinking it's the fuel pump. Am I correct in thinking there is a vacuum pump on those things? The connection seems to be a bit loose and my hunch is that it's not sucking the fuel like it should. I know a couple people have had success with electric fuel pumps. Any thoughts out there?

[JamesBe1 82]

Yep. I went with an electric fuel pump. It was well worth it.

Check out Brian Millers page, he has some info fuel pumps (mechanical and electric). I mounted mine on the side panel halfway between the tank and the engine, and wired it to the coil wire for power. There already was what I think was a factory hole in the sheet metal, and I only had to drill one hole to attach it.

Here's the only pic I have of it:

[tommyg 152]

Cool. I think that's the route I might go. No need to crank the engine forever to get fuel to it when you run out.

[tommyg 152]

BTW... Did you place the pump before or after the filter?

[JamesBe1 82]

I placed it before the filter simply because the filter was there first (near the engine).

Actually, my tractor had two filters on it. One just happened to be right were the fuel pump now is. I took that filter out and installed the fuel pump there. Just dumb luck that it happened to be the place where I wanted to install the pump.

BTW, the pump came with an inlet filter/strainer.

[JackC 617]

I now use 1/4 inch clear fuel line from the pump to the carburetor.and just before the pump and after the filter.

The clear line allows me to see if there are any fuel delivery issues or leak back issues.

I had one situation where the vacuum line from the crankcase to the back of the pump was not secure and the pump was not working properly causing a lot of cranking before starting. With the clear fuel line I can see if the fuel is sitting in the line at the input to the carburetor at all times on my D-160.

[tommyg 152]

I now use 1/4 inch clear fuel line from the pump to the carburetor.and just before the pump and after the filter.

The clear line allows me to see if there are any fuel delivery issues or leak back issues.

I had one situation where the vacuum line from the crankcase to the back of the pump was not secure and the pump was not working properly causing a lot of cranking before starting. With the clear fuel line I can see if the fuel is sitting in the line at the input to the carburetor at all times on my D-160.

That makes sense. The way it is, I can only pull off the hose to see if there is any fuel at the pump end.

[JamesBe1 82]

I now use 1/4 inch clear fuel line from the pump to the carburetor.and just before the pump and after the filter.

The clear line allows me to see if there are any fuel delivery issues or leak back issues.

I had one situation where the vacuum line from the crankcase to the back of the pump was not secure and the pump was not working properly causing a lot of cranking before starting. With the clear fuel line I can see if the fuel is sitting in the line at the input to the carburetor at all times on my D-160.

Great idea. I recently replaced my fuel lines, but I didn't spring for the clean hose as I am too cheap.

When I start mine with the hood up, I keep my eye on the fuel filter and listen to the pump. I used to have a filter where my pump is now, and the center plate off. I would often look at that to see the fuel flow.

[JC 1965 1,530]

JamesBe1, Will 1/4" fuel line fit over the inlet filter that comes with the electric fuel pump? I just purchased a purlator facet electric pump and haven't tried it yet but it looks like the inlet filter side where the fuel line slides over it is larger than 1/4". :dunno:

[wheeledhorseman 574]

It's amazing how, despite the distance that separates us, all along I've been going through most of the same things as my 'band of brothers' on the other side of the pond.

My D-200 had an electric fuel pump fitted by a PO and judging by the build up of pink ish grey deposits inside the chamber it had a previous life on an automobile when fuel was still leaded before it found its way to the tractor. As it has become tempramental I'm replacing it with a Facet pump which has been waiting to be fitted for a couple of weeks now.

Re the pipe size, the facet pumps are available over here with two different union sizes for pipes of 4mm and 6mm ID (1/4" or 3/8"). The unions are available separately so you should be able to get the smaller size to fit on your pump quite easily. According to the instructions that came with mine the pump can lift fuel up to 12" above the level in the tank to prime itself so fitting it under the hood is a possibility but the instructions also suggest that it should be located as near to the tank as possible so after a good look round I've decided on pretty much the same location as James.

It's perhaps worth mentioning that these pumps come in two different delivery pressure capabilities, 1.5 - 4 psi and 4-7 psi. For use with a small engine the lower pressure model is ideal, the higher pressure model could well end up causing flooding past the needle valve in the float chamber. The instructions also recommend a filter between the tank and pump, in fact there is a facet filter that fits to the pump then takes the fuel pipe union. Seems silly now as it was only a few bucks more but, like James, I went for the cheap option so I'll be fitting one of those see through filters in the line.

I really must get round to fitting it but I've been busy playing catch up as the sun has now finally come out to play after a couple of months of near continuous rain that we've had here. Must try and make time this weekend.

Andy

[JamesBe1 82]

JamesBe1, Will 1/4" fuel line fit over the inlet filter that comes with the electric fuel pump? I just purchased a purlator facet electric pump and haven't tried it yet but it looks like the inlet filter side where the fuel line slides over it is larger than 1/4".

I'm going to have to doublecheck my fuel line size when I get home tonight. Unless anyone can tell me what the 'standard' fuel line size is on the D series. I thought it was 3/8'.

Even if that was the case, I am sure that you can get 1/4' fuel line to fit over the end of the inlet filter. It just takes a little more effort.

[JamesBe1 82]

JamesBe1, Will 1/4" fuel line fit over the inlet filter that comes with the electric fuel pump? I just purchased a purlator facet electric pump and haven't tried it yet but it looks like the inlet filter side where the fuel line slides over it is larger than 1/4".

Surprise! I am using 1/4" fuel line and it fits on the purolator inlet filter no problem. I also use hose clamps just to be sure.

[JackC 617]

The fuel lines on my 1977 D-160 with the ONAN BF engine are all 1/4 inch. I only use the clear line after the filter and near the engine so I can see that there is fuel sitting at the input to the carburetor at all times. If it starts hard I can tell if it is fuel delivery or not. A clear filter will work depending on the configuration of fuel pump and carburetor. My filter is before the fuel pump and the fuel pump is before the carburetor and I need to see if the fuel is getting through the pump and up to the carburetor. The engine did start hard when I first bought the tractor because the vacuum line from the crankcase to the fuel pump was loose causing the fuel pump to not work properly. With the clear line you can also see if the fuel is leaking back to the tank when the tractor is not being used. If that is happening you can either add a quick fix shut off or fix the cause of the leak back. That will reduce the wear on your battery and starter. I am slowly converting all my tractors over since they all get to sit a lot and I like seeing where the fuel is when I go to start them.

I have been getting the 1/4 inch clear fuel line and clamps from Advance Auto. They have a small engine section at my local store.

[JC 1965 1,530]

Thanks James, I'm glad to hear that 1/4" fuel line will work. I'll be working on mine this weekend. :thumbs2:

[JC 1965 1,530]

I've never used the clear fuel line, is it as strong as the black rubber fuel line ? I like the idea of seeing if the fuel is getting to the carb. That's why I'm replacing my old mechanical fuel pump with an electric pump. If my tractor sets for about a week without starting. Then when i try to start it I have to crank it until the fuel gets to the carb before it will start. I don't want to burn up the starter so I'm going with the electric pump. :eusa-whistle:

[JackC 617]

<<I've never used the clear fuel line, is it as strong as the black rubber fuel line ? I like the idea of seeing if the fuel is getting to the carb. >>

I only use the clear line near the engine.

Not sure how well it will hold up since I just started using it.

The line should remain full. If it doesn't then a shut off before the fuel pump may help.

There are rebuild kits for the fuel pump and carburetor that run about $70.

The kit contains everything needed to rebuild the fuel pump to new condition which is fairly easy to do.

The vacuum line from the crankcase to the back of the fuel pump on this engine was loose causing the pump to not work properly. I took the pump apart and cleaned it and tightened the vacuum line to the crankcase and it works great now.

I bought the rebuild kit while still available but I will save it for when it is needed.

Here is a picture of the clear 1/4 inch fuel line on my 1977 D-160.

It really helps to see how the fuel delivery is working.

[JackC 617]

Common problem with the ONAN vacuum fuel pump. Some are mounted on the engine tin and some are mounted on the carburetor.

Here is a cheap fix for a weak pump when the reeds don't close properly.

[tommyg 152]

After picking up some seals from the local Toro dealer, I asked him about whether or not there was a replacement pump available like the one I currently had. He handed me this one... manufactured by Briggs. For $19.99, I decided to give it a try.

This was my existing set up. I replaced the metal filter with a see through plastic filter. There were no directions with the new pump, so I was a bit perplexed as to what connected to where. I used an extremely low tech, perhaps even primal decision making process. I stuck it in my mouth and sucked on both the old one and the new one. There was one end that I could not suck any air through on both units. So I assumed this was inlet side of the pump. Another was marked with a "P". I assumed this meant "pulse". So I hooked this up to the vacuum hose. Of course, there was only one left, so I hooked that up to the carb. To my delight, I got it right the first time! The mounting holes lined up almost perfectly with the threads for the old pump and where my choke cable was bolted down.

Here's my final set up. Works great!!!

[JackC 617]

Very economical solution and no wiring needed.

Almost like giving the old horse a new heart.

I like the vacuum pumps.

[Warning:Unsupervised 81]

     Went through several pulse pumps here on wifes Husqvarna and our JD so I'm no fan of them myself. They get weak and wear out like plastic mechanical pumps do so I also went to a Facet elect and never looked back. Facet makes the stronger design so no more dry fuel filters while the engines under load. So' there's no worries having burnt valves or a hole in a piston from running way too lean and the engine starts up much easier with electric pumps saving wear on starter/battery/charging systems. Most people never knew their filter was running dry periodically until it's too late, very costly rebuilds have happened over running too lean.

  With only 2 wires it's easy enough to wire a Facet pump, most put them on a seperate toggle but there you must always remember to turn it on/off. Personally I run mine so the ignition switch controls it. I use an inline fuse on it so when the ignition is turned on the pump is on and never worry about it running or not. Pull the fuse out if I need to have ignition on but don't want the pump on for any reason.  No relay or regulator is needed with a Facet pump.

  I mount my pump above my transaxle on my Horses so its hidden. Facet says run the filter "before" the Pump to keep the pump clean for warranty. I don't even double filter a fuel line as fuel pumps just wear out faster.

It's more trouble to convert a pulse pump setup on a tractor than wire a Facet pump to one but it does cost a bit more for elect!  Certainly get what you pay with the Facet as it's paid for itself over time on all my tractors. Nice write up for anyone who may choose this route but I suggest putting a clear filter on this setup so you can verify the fuel flow. My pulse pumps only gave me minor problems with age but they can lead to some serious problems if simply ignored.

 Take care!