C series vs 300, 400, 500

[Forest Road 594]

I know its an old topic BUT BUT BUT..... Now that I have both I must say the old C160 looks like a better built machine. I don't see a brake drum. Is it internal? I like the parking brake/idler lockout vs the Eaton style. The cooling fan on the sunstrand has some protection wrapped around it. And I can't really see how you could break that pulley anyway. Also the filter location in my opinion is much better as opposed to the Eaton. I nearly tore a filter off the 314 last year with a loose tire chain.

So really now is the Eaton any stronger than the Sunstrand? Are the Sunstrands rebuild able?

Now the ease of access to everything under the hood. No contest. I can see the rocker bar and easily swap out the lift links and mower deck lifts. I don't need a ridiculous rockshaft assembly for $300. And the battery has plenty of room! I like the height indicator too!!!!

I'm digging the tool box under the seat. Not that I'd put much under there. But there's the option.....A larger fuel tank, especially for a 16hp Kohler! No idiot lights to go bonkers. And the brake/neutral switch looks like it was made for a Sherman tank.

I see a C - series 8 speed in my future....

[smoreau 658]

I like both! Nothing sounds better then my k341 idling while i'm waiting for it to warm up before I use it! But my 417A's are some powerful, unstoppable tractors!. If there's something that requires a lot of hard work, 417A is my first choice for power and strength! but lighter duty and pure enjoyment, you cant beat that 74 c160! I'm sure that my c160 could do most anything that the 417's do, but I don't want to take the chance of damaging a great classic tractor!

I think the eaton 1100 trans is stronger then the sunstrands for sure. But like you said they have a nice park feature that the eatons do not. So IMHO both have there good points and thats why I have both!

[can whlvr 993]

i like my 1100 series brake band way better than my c160 parking pawl that i have to split the rear end to fix,the 1100 has a brake band thats adjustable and serviceable,i really like my 160,but thats one thing thats not as good,and yes the sundstand is rebuilable,i had mine done when it went bad,the newer tractors have the idiot lights which most of us could do with out but i think they were trying to make the machine seem more fancy to keep up with others,and the steering column isnt as good but i think they needed to (upgrade the look)and probally save a few bucks too,but they are still great tractors,i have 4 maroon stripes and 4 c series and love every one of them

[Forest Road 594]

HHHhmmmm good points. Suppose I'll just hang in there with this one. Its mechanically perfect right now. Hope it stays that way. I'm trying to figure out how to keep the 314H, refurbed 312-8, and this C160. Right now wife wants at least one of them gone. Will have to see.

[boovuc 1,090]

I think the sundstand trannies are very good but they are only rebuildable by a few dedicated people and the parts are harder to get. The Eaton 1100 however are much more "available" for parts. In fact, they are still supported by Eaton. I agree with you about the cooling fan on your C-160 verses the fan on the Eaton and the older K series 16HP motor is a wonder in it's own right but I believe the C series and the 300, 400 and 500 series tractors are on the same solid ground overall.

[smoreau 658]

HHHhmmmm good points. Suppose I'll just hang in there with this one. Its mechanically perfect right now. Hope it stays that way. I'm trying to figure out how to keep the 314H, refurbed 312-8, and this C160. Right now wife wants at least one of them gone. Will have to see.

Hurry and get a implement that you can't live without! Make sure its one that is difficult to switch, this way you can keep all 3 :)

[Forest Road 594]

Spot on Boo! I really like the simplicity of the wiring on this machine. And the easy access to the rock shaft. I dread chainging lift links or anything for that matter on my 300 series. Takes 15 minutes and a lil agravation to get the stinking pins installed. Hopefully she lasts a long time. I just deleted my Craigslist search functions on my smart phone.

[Forest Road 594]

HHHhmmmm good points. Suppose I'll just hang in there with this one. Its mechanically perfect right now. Hope it stays that way. I'm trying to figure out how to keep the 314H, refurbed 312-8, and this C160. Right now wife wants at least one of them gone. Will have to see.

Hurry and get a implement that you can't live without! Make sure its one that is difficult to switch, this way you can keep both

Scotty I think I have every implement they made. Snow plow, grader, 42" RD, 2 stage and single stage blowers, tiller, even a Mac Kissic chipper. My wife is hanging in there now. 4 tractors would push her way over the edge.

[smoreau 658]

So you need to find what your wife collects and can't live without and give her a ultimatum. But don't start a war over it!! that would be the worse then loosing a tractor. Just tell her that it is you enjoy each of the tractors and it helps you get the yard work done faster to spend more time with her.

[Kelly 1,029]

I guess I'm lucky the wife don't care how many tractors I have, and with over 100 that is a good thing, she even finds them for me, goes to swap meets and helps me set up, she has done the same forever with my race cars, even part of the pit crew, so I really don't have any advice for you on keeping or getting tractors, just as Scott said keep her happy that is what I do, I buy her nice things now and then, doesn't have to be big or expensive, maybe flowers or that book or other thing she told you about, you were listening to her right??!!

Oh and on the 300 VS C's I kinda like the 78-79 C's myself, they do have the hard to get to rockshaft but I like the big gas tank under the seat, wide dash tower, still has the old metal dash, and classic hood lines, but I also love my 520's they are a step up in the 300, 400 500 line with a better dash, gauges, and upgraded steering and axle, plus the monster 20hp Onan.

[squonk 41,171]

I don't know if it's the area I live in or not but, just about every 300-500 series tractor I come across for sale is a rusted hulk. The paint is all blown off and large scabs of surface rust. I even had a 200 series that was always cleaned and garaged and it was hard to keep paint on it. I find the older ones sitting outside for years have little rust and the paint just faded some. :scratchead:

[Wheel Horse Kid 105]

I don't know if it's the area I live in or not but, just about every 300-500 series tractor I come across for sale is a rusted hulk. The paint is all blown off and large scabs of surface rust. I even had a 200 series that was always cleaned and garaged and it was hard to keep paint on it. I find the older ones sitting outside for years have little rust and the paint just faded some.

I have noticed that too. Maybe they went to a cheaper quality paint when they made the 300-500 series compared to when they made the b and c series and other older ones. As far as which tractor is better (c series or 300-500 series), I think both are great machines. One thing that stands out to me is that all of the c120, c140, and c160 tractors had cast iron Kohler motors, whereas alot of 312, 314, and 416 tractors had either magnum motors or twin cylinder motors. I feel that the cast iron Kolher motors where the longer lasting motor. If my 312-8 did not have a cast iron Kohler motor, I probably would not have it. Just my 2 cents!

[CRE1992 135]

Pretty sure the kohler magnum engines are cast iron... The reason they switched to command engines in the last production runs is because the Magnums were very expensive to purchase.

[Wheel Horse Kid 105]

Pretty sure the kohler magnum engines are cast iron... The reason they switched to command engines in the last production runs is because the Magnums were very expensive to purchase.

'

I stand corrected. You are right, my bad. But, I still feel that the K series motors were a better motor than the magnum motor as far as durability and toughness goes. Just my opinion.

[CRE1992 135]

Pretty sure the kohler magnum engines are cast iron... The reason they switched to command engines in the last production runs is because the Magnums were very expensive to purchase.

'

I stand corrected. You are right, my bad. But, I still feel that the K series motors were a better motor than the magnum motor as far as durability and toughness goes. Just my opinion.

I would rather have a magnum because you don't have any points to change or adjust. You also don't have to deal with a coil. As for the original topic. I feel like the C series, especially a 1978 C161 is a great tractor. However I am more partial to the newer series of tractors.

[can whlvr 993]

Pretty sure the kohler magnum engines are cast iron... The reason they switched to command engines in the last production runs is because the Magnums were very expensive to purchase.

'

I stand corrected. You are right, my bad. But, I still feel that the K series motors were a better motor than the magnum motor as far as durability and toughness goes. Just my opinion.

the magnum is basically a k,same block and guts and the magnum has a better ignition system

[Kelly 1,029]

Magnum is a great engine I like them just need to swap out the Walbro carb, and your all set.

[can whlvr 993]

yep thats so true,i have a couple of the older adjustable type and they run so good with those carbs on them,and the old ones dont need throttle shaft repair as much as the cheap walboro

[wheelhorsekid 141]

I have a 74' C 160 Automatic that is restored, but the motor has never been touched. It's as strong now as it was in 74'. I've even pulled my escalade with no problems for fun. And with 4 people in it. Over 6,000lbs total. Love the c 160. IMO, no better tractor. Newer ones do ride better, but iI love the old grit and that's why I got her.

[woodbird007 16]

I prefer the look of the "C" series. Even my my 76' B 80 8 spd is a tank in search of a bigger engine i love the classic red and cream look. I've also noticed a lot of peeling paint on the later tractors. Is it just the 300s that switched to 6" front rims?

[dcrage 628]

The 6 inch rims are needed to allow for the use of the 37" SD deck -- The bigger front wheels would hit on turning to the left(?) -- So I believe it was only 300 series that had the smaller front wheels and not sure it was all of them

[bean 85]

I have a 300 series, and swapped out the 6" fronts for 8"-b series front wheels, and the 22x7.50-12s for 23x8.50-12s. I have a 42" rd deck and there is plenty of clearance. I have seen the 37" deck, and always wondered why it was ever produced.

I like the modern magnum engines better than the k series. the simplified ignition is a plus.

as far as looks, the 73-76 b/c series are my absolute favorite, especially the 73 no names. there  's just something about that square/90* hood

Edited July 9, 2013 by bean

[546cowboy 301]

The paint does seem to hold up better on the older tractors as far as bubbling. But at the same time I have seen many, many brown, pitted older tractors. The newer ( late 80's and 90's ) seem easier to bring back from that bubbling though. A little scraping and some aircraft stripper, some sanding , primer and it looks new again. I don't know why they didn't use primer. Although I suppose they were cutting costs there, but the paint would have lasted longer.

 

I have had Horses from the 60's, 70's, 80's and 90's but I have never owned a 300 series or a 400 series. I have only had three verticals and got rid of them as soon as I could. The C's and the 520's are my favorites. Although recently I have acquired about 5 of the mid 60's horses and have been pretty pleased with the ease of swapping parts between those models. Seems like if you one parts tractor you have parts to fix any of them.

[leeave96 487]

HHHhmmmm good points. Suppose I'll just hang in there with this one. Its mechanically perfect right now. Hope it stays that way. I'm trying to figure out how to keep the 314H, refurbed 312-8, and this C160. Right now wife wants at least one of them gone. Will have to see.

 

If you got a 314-H, I'd hang onto that tractor for life - it's a great tractor.  If you want to make it better (IMHO), add Matt's foot control to it.

 

Pretty sure the kohler magnum engines are cast iron... The reason they switched to command engines in the last production runs is because the Magnums were very expensive to purchase.

 

Magnum engines are cast iron.  Basically a K series engine with electronic ignition.  The switch to Command engines had more to do with EPA pollution requirements.  I think after 1997, no one used the Magnum engine in a OEM tractor anymore.  It was also the end of the Onan too.

[Forest Road 594]

HHHhmmmm good points. Suppose I'll just hang in there with this one. Its mechanically perfect right now. Hope it stays that way. I'm trying to figure out how to keep the 314H, refurbed 312-8, and this C160. Right now wife wants at least one of them gone. Will have to see.

If you got a 314-H, I'd hang onto that tractor for life - it's a great tractor. If you want to make it better (IMHO), add Matt's foot control to it.

Right you are! The C160 didn't last to long. Nor did my beloved 312-8. The day I brought home a 522xi kwik way loader combo some stuff had to go. I'm left with a 200 hour 314h and every attachment I could ever use on that tractor. 42" RD, single & two stage snow blowers 50" grader, mackissic chipper, snow plow.....

I did invest in a Scotty hitch and Matt's foot pedal. I wouldn't ever want to be without the foot pedal!!!

I'm in the process of building a Magnum 16 for use in the 314. At the current rate I doubt ill have it done for the next snow blowing season.